140 replies to this topic

[Thirdstar]

[ApheX]

Sorry but the PPC is fine as it is. As other have said already, It has taken the Dev's Ages to get that weapon to how it should be working and now this is the case and more people are using it, some others are now complaining that it's too powerful.

It's perfect how it is. It's powerful, heavy as hell and is damn hot, but not so much you fry in a few shots. exactly what the PPC should be. Why are you complaining OP? We can use more viable weapons now.

[Lukoi Banacek]

Glythe I dont need to know your background to know that your smug and condescending approach to debate devalues your thoughts to being no more than a rant. Was that unclear? Your opinions are just that. They are not facts. People who disagree with your anecdotes and weak observations arent deluding themselves. They are disagreeing with your poorly presented point.

As for no longer running PPC myself, its because I dont find them more effective in my builds (and as I actually keep track of what few metrics we have available in game I can base that decision on facts not my gut) than I do erPPC and LL.

I certainly dont fear a PPC boat in game because they have significant recognized heat issues...and regardless of people bragging, most people arent super accurate with them especially when snap shooting up close.

[Penance]

I've always felt minimum ranges on weapons except for missiles and some ballistics is stupid,especially for energy weapons. I think the only thing that should apply to energy weapons is a max range.

In reality, at least mine, most energy weapons come out of the "muzzle" at or near the speed of light, at least lasers do, PPC's though, your guess is as good as mine, I'm no physicist. I'm guessing they're accelerated the same way a gauss slug would be since they are charged particles. Anyway, all energy weapons I feel should do full damage at all ranges below the maximum range, since they come out of the weapon fully charged and ready to go. After the maximum range though, the damage should dissipate as it already does.

I think minimum ranges are really more for ballistic and missile weapons. Missile weapons I view like torpedoes, they need to travel a certain distance to arm themselves as safety features to prevent them from blowing up in the launcher for example. This also poses the option to allow pilots to turn the safety off, which if a mech is right next to you, the mech firing would also take some splash damage.

The only ballistic I feel should only have no minimum is the gauss rifle since it probably has the fastest muzzle velocity of all ballistics.

Edited by Penance, 27 February 2013 - 06:40 AM.

[Elizander]

Yokaiko, on 27 February 2013 - 05:50 AM, said:

The PPC is supposed to outclass the Llas.

Its bigger, heavier, generates more heat AND has all of the downsides of energy (heat) and ballistics (firing delay)...not to mention the damage hit from its minimum range.

The PPC is supposed to be a feared weapon, on the scale of a gauss rifle. This is the first time the damn things have felt right since closded beta.

Due to ping issues, I still have to fall back on the Large Laser, sadly.

[Glythe]

Penance, on 27 February 2013 - 06:33 AM, said:

I've always felt minimum ranges on weapons except for missiles and some ballistics is stupid,especially for energy weapons. I think the only thing that should apply to energy weapons is a max range.

Might I interest you in this link.... particularly the second paragraph under description.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/PPC

The PPC was built with a minimum range because if you use it inside of that range it can blow you up. I mean I'd much rather that be downside to the minimum range issue but we would never have something that severe. It is also a balance mechanism in the TT game. If you go back and read developer quotes they found no reason that ballistic weapons should have a minimum range. PPCs on the other hand have a very specific lore suggesting that the minimum range makes sense. It also makes the weapon unique and therefore interesting.

Lukoi, on 27 February 2013 - 06:32 AM, said:

As for no longer running PPC myself, its because I dont find them more effective in my builds (and as I actually keep track of what few metrics we have available in game I can base that decision on facts not my gut) than I do erPPC and LL.

The people I have talked to and their experiences are factual events even though it is also a reflection of their opinion.

This thread itself is a reflection of the old "should Gauss be nerfed" thread. And while that is ironic and quite hilarious it also happens to be inconvenient. I should note that at the time I was one of the people in the crowd who thought the Gauss rifle was fine (rather the K2 was broken because it could use 2 of the weapon in question).

Here again you assume all the wrong things. First by the way you mean "it's" not "its" (since your tone indicates that you would love to read such a correction).

Second I am not basing things on my gut as you seem to have randomly decided. I can look at how quickly I kill a fresh Atlas with build A and compare that with build B. I showed my build to a friend and he tried it and immediately came to the same conclusion.

Finally I must point out that tone is an implied concept with any written work. Studies have shown that people with a certain mindset will interpret a passage in a different fashion (and this can be influenced with mood). Without familiarity with the writer's style tone can be extremely difficult to pinpoint. If on the other hand you conclude that I'm being smug with you (and only you) it is probably because you're being something of a 4 letter word that I'd rather not type out.

Edited by Glythe, 27 February 2013 - 07:02 AM.

[EmeraldSongbird]

No.

[Joseph Mallan]

Glythe, on 27 February 2013 - 04:42 AM, said:

The fact that the PPC has a low number of critical slots is why I suggest the health nerf and the zero damage within 90m change.

If you don't feel the new PPC is every bit as powerful as the old Gauss rifle you are deluding yourself. We all know how that one turned out.... Gauss rifle is now only featured on sniper builds and is about 10 times more rare than the AC/20 on the battlefield (used to be the other way around).

No. no its not. Gauss puts 15 damage on target with every hit. PPC puts 10 damage on target with every hit. Gauss 50% more damage with every hit.

As for HP for weapons.... I played for decades where a single critical hit broke your weapons. Any more than one HP is a huge BUFF in my experience.

[ASSASSYN X]

And the great nerf this nerf that continues.

[DrBlue62]

OP needs to stop taking Cbills from the pro ECM lobbyists.

Edited by DrBlue62, 27 February 2013 - 07:07 AM.

[Sheraf]

PPC is on target for nerfing now? ER PPC next?

[EmeraldSongbird]

Sheraf, on 27 February 2013 - 07:11 AM, said:

PPC is on target for nerfing now? ER PPC next?

Minimum range needs to be nerfed!

[Shlkt]

Just to correct a common misconception... PPCs and ballistics do not have a firing delay other than your ping time. Lasers suffer from the exact same ping delay, but they appear to fire faster because your client draws the laser beam before receiving confirmation from the server. But really you should be leading your shots with lasers by almost as much as with PPCs, especially at close range.

[Lukoi Banacek]

You are right Glythe. Calling people deluded isnt smug or condescending lol. Its a fact you and some others have an opinion, true but those opinions again, are not facts. Given the volume of replies disagreeing with you on this thread, maybe you should have some of your friends express tgeir thoughts. They might do it in a constructive manner. And yes, I was being sarcastic in my second sentence above if you didnt catch it. Written tone isnt always based on the inference of the reader. Or are you just deluding yourself into believing that? LOL.

[Penance]

Glythe, on 27 February 2013 - 06:57 AM, said:

Might I interest you in this link.... particularly the second paragraph under description.

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/PPC

The PPC was built with a minimum range because if you use it inside of that range it can blow you up. I mean I'd much rather that be downside to the minimum range issue but we would never have something that severe. It is also a balance mechanism in the TT game. If you go back and read developer quotes they found no reason that ballistic weapons should have a minimum range. PPCs on the other hand have a very specific lore suggesting that the minimum range makes sense. It also makes the weapon unique and therefore interesting.

Because we know, when this stuff was thought up, it was done by people with PHD's in particle and astro physics, so what's on Sarna has to be true? Lore asside, PGI is taking liberties. The fact that PPC's pump out damage and disabled ECM isn't unique and interesting enough for you? Do they currently have ANY weapon in game do damage back to the person firing is they are at point blank? Nope? where is this "Lore" feature you speak of? I mean all those splat cats firing 6srm 6's into someones back while standing right there should surely take splash damage from the explosions right?

You should've also posted the video of the US Navy's rail gun that has all the flames coming out of the barrel due to the superheated air in front of the projectile..yet the game doesn't have that.

Further, there is nothing in that paragraph about "blowing up" just damage, and it also mentions a safety feature, that I also mentioned in my first sentiment...not about PPC's specifically, but whatever, carry that over.

Edited by Penance, 27 February 2013 - 07:18 AM.

[Sheraf]

Doobles, on 27 February 2013 - 07:12 AM, said:

Minimum range needs to be nerfed!

Make ECM disrupts the PPC and increase the minimum range

[xRatas]

Sheraf, on 27 February 2013 - 07:18 AM, said:

Make ECM disrupts the PPC and increase the minimum range

Just make it so that PPC can not fire, if under 180m from ECM. And maybe make ECM reflect PPC damage back to shooter, as it kind of makes sense, right?

[Tikkamasala]

xRatas, on 27 February 2013 - 08:00 AM, said:

Just make it so that PPC can not fire, if under 180m from ECM. And maybe make ECM reflect PPC damage back to shooter, as it kind of makes sense, right?

^ That's settled then. Now to fine tune the command console...

Edit: A lot of these (perceived) problems stem from taking multiple weapons and letting them hit the same spot on the enemy mech. That's quite unlike the TT situation that was used as a balance starting point.

Edited by Tikkamasala, 27 February 2013 - 08:11 AM.

[Mystere]

Did people finally tire of the "nerf cat", "nerf ECM', and "nerf SSRM2" threads?

Or are ECM-carrying players now feeling a whole load of bvtt hurt goodness?


(Really, is that word censored too that I now have to replace the "u" with a "v"?)

Edited by Mystere, 27 February 2013 - 08:16 AM.

[BunnyWabbit]

Meh I never thought the ppc needed a heat reduction. It was already an average weapon before the heat capactity change. Now its a really good weapon. The erppc on the other hand was horrible and went from a lackluster weapon to a good weapon with the heat capacity change.

Overall they arent gamebreaking though so I'd just live with it.