39 replies to this topic

[Carrioncrows]

My X-5

300 XL - 133kph with speed tweak
12 DHS
Endo
268 FF Armor - 4 points shy of Max

x4 Medium lasers
x2 SRM6's with x3 tons of ammo.

Alternatively you can drop a ton of srm ammo for another heat sink, but honestly I run out of SRM ammo so quick otherwise.

I've solo'd Atlas's, Stalkers, to jenners and everything in between. Haven't gotten the chance to square off against a Craven-3L streaks solo yet.

[ShotgunWillie]

Beefer, on 05 March 2013 - 05:26 PM, said:

Wait, explain to me why mounting 2 SRM6s is a bad idea? I've played 3 matches in mine and have 2 Stalker kills and an Atlas, in addition to two light mechs. It's a Hunchie SP with less armor and +35kph - i've had ~300 damage twice and had a 689 dmg match. The multiple launches (there are three) aren't necessarily a bad thing if you know they're coming and you time them. Most of the time I can hit with one or two of the SRM flights even on light targets.

I'm new to Cicadas, so if there's something I'm missing please fill me in, but I'm liking the twin SRM6s.

The problem isn't the 2xSRM6 in and of itself. That's a deadly combo, as you've discovered. The problem is that the X-5 only has 2 missile tubes in each location that missiles can be mounted, meaning that for each SRM6, you'll fire 3 2-missile volleys rather than 1 6-missile volley.

I have a Stalker that has 5x SRM6s (very nasty in a brawl). One of those slots was originally designated for a Narc Beacon, so there's only 1 hole. This meant that there was a steady stream of 6 missiles coming out every time that SRM6 fired. PGI has since changed it so that all 6 missiles fire at once from that location, though that might be a bug.

[Isingdeath]

Can anyone confirm all this speculation. Just because the picture shows 2 missile tubes does not necessarily mean that they programed the mech to shoot only two missiles at a time.

[Carrioncrows]

The 2 missile tubes is a benefit in my opinion.

Though yes I lose some of the burst ability in all 1 hit, what I do gain is almost 100% accuracy up to max range.

The 3 waves are like autocannon shells.

The other point is that if I hit my target, great!. If i am slightly off I can quickly correct my aim to insure at least 66% of the SRM volley hits.

From my opinion there is no downside.

now 1 tube is vastly different from having 2 tubes, and yeah the 1 tube is brutal.

Isingdeath, on 05 March 2013 - 06:10 PM, said:

Can anyone confirm all this speculation. Just because the picture shows 2 missile tubes does not necessarily mean that they programed the mech to shoot only two missiles at a time.

yes it does. =)

And it does.

[Lynx7725]

Just some ideas I bounced around in another thread. Noticed this... the X-5's walking speed is 133.7 kph. Leet much? No AMS, I don't think this one would be worrying too much. 330XL, quite monstrous engine. I think it can hit the speed cap walking backwards. It's definitely different, now to see how the eventual (and cheap) refit of 3 Med Pulse, 1 TAG and 2 SSRM2s would work out for it. I think once people get used to it, it can be quite deadly.

Turns out once you drop to a 300XL, you still retain most of the speed (your top speed becomes 133.7 so you're still L33t, just less so...) but your world of making other people hurt opens up. Say..

• 2 ER PPC with good enough heat dissipation. Pepsicada? Or swap in LPL if you prefer.
  
• Or, 3 Large Lasers (or ER Large if you swing that way). FlashCada?
  
• Or 2 SRM6 with Large Laser or PPC, depending on how much ammo you take. SplatCada?
  
• For the Lol: 2 SRM6s, 4 Flamers.

Looks to be a fairly flexible plaform. Would have loved to have a B slot but that's not critical on a light medium.

[1453 R]

The 3M generally does Pepsicada better - it can carry ECM and thus become a mobile ghostly Pepsniper from the seventh ring of the Inferno. Same for the triple large configuration - my 2A can do that with all the lasers in the torso for better convergence and a more aesthetically pleasing grouping. Realistically, there's no beams-only configuration the X-5 can manage that another Cicada can't do better.

That's okay, though. We have beam Cicadas to do those configurations with, so the X-5 doesn't have to. It gets to huck missiles at the enemy while going all fast as bawlz and carrying over 260 points of armor and junk, instead. If one isn't using the missile hardpoints on their X-5, they're almost certainly doing X-5 wrong.

Beefer: I have a hard time keeping my guns on track long enough for lasers to hit the whole way. 3-round burst SRM launchers tax my p*ss-poor aiming skills too hard for me to reliably land more than half the salvo anyways. Even players with better aim than I've got tend to prefer getting all their warheads out in one big blast so they can twist away and start protecting themselves. I compromise and use SRM-4s so's I can do a chunk more damage to the big 'uns that need extra damage to go down anyways, as well as giving me a slightly better chance at putting something on a light 'Mech, but generally when one goes as fast as an X-5 goes, they don't do as well as they otherwise might at holding their crosshairs steady for a drive-by.

[Training Instructor]

I downgraded to a 320xl to fit 2xSRM. Loving it so far.

Had several losing matches where I was harassing the other team quite well, but the other people on my team weren't doing much. You know, typical game where you're running with some premade of 4 DDC on your side, but rather than being awesome, they're four really terrible DDC pilots.

Edited by Training Instructor, 05 March 2013 - 10:46 PM.

[Voyager I]

FrostCollar, on 05 March 2013 - 04:55 PM, said:

I've been on your side of the conversation before, so I feel obligated to mention the other side: that you have ten extra tons to pack in more armor and/or more weapons. You can't run 2 SRM 6s and 4 ML in a Jenner and go nearly as fast as in the X-5, IIRC.

As a matter of fact, due to the way engine weights scale, a Cicada that tries to match the speed of a 300 XL Jenner will have almost the exact same weight to fit a payload after engine and armor, which means that those extra five tons aren't actually letting you bring anything extra to the table (other than a bit of extra armor and structure, which are a dubious trade for the significantly larger hitbox). If you want a Medium with SRMs that goes fast, but not quite that fast, we've got better options on Centurions (and maybe some Trebuchets).

The super-fast dual SRM-6 option would still be intriguing, but it's held back by the missile tubes being unsuited to the driveby maneuvers the rest of the mech is begging to perform. I'd even go so far as to say that the Jenner's ability to dump out two SRM-4s in a single volley gives it an advantage in that role.

That's basically my point about this mech. It's not really bad, because the Jenner D is an amazing ride and will go right back to being awesome as soon as ECM/Streak combos stop winning light fights by default, and this is basically just an awkward replica. It just trades a lot of the Jenner's little advantages (jump jets, unified lasers, four-tube missiles, smaller hitbox) for a C-Bill bonus. Depending on your priorities that might still be worth it, but people should be realistic about what they're getting for a pile of real money.

If you have a Founder's Jenner, though, I would say definitely don't buy this thing because aside from an extra 5% on the C-Bills you already have everything it does and a little more.

Edited by Voyager I, 06 March 2013 - 02:04 AM.

[Devil Fox]

Well I don't have a founder Jenner, or another hero mech. But being a Medium mech pilot I couldn't pass this up to test and run around in... I dropped my Jenners along the roadside 3 month's back because of their lackluster survival in general with ECM and other mechs to level.

At present I tried the SRM's... alot more annoying to try and use with lag-less lasers, so I rounded up a spider ecm buddy, slapped in a BAP and SSRM2's with a 300XL and went hunting amongst heavies and assaults hurting any foolish light's.

[Training Instructor]

Uhm, the Jenner D only has four missile tubes, so if you put 2xSRM4 in it you still get two volleys, just like the X5. Also, I don't like Jenners. I elited out three of them when I first started playing this game, and they were just too boring.

The X5 isn't going to show up much in the competitive 8 mans, just like the other hero mechs already don't, but it's a blast to drive in 4 mans or when solo.

It's also much more flexible than the Jenners are.

[Devil Fox]

The Jenner D would be single salvo shot, the missiles will come out of the maximum amount of launch tubes at the same time. It's how I abuse my Treb 7K arm mounted twin SRM4's, 2 salvo's of 4 missile each fro them 2 slot launcher.

Without ECM this hero mech isn't 8man material unlike the Muromets.

[Chrithu]

Just fiddled the builds together that I will run once I unlocked Elite on the X-5:

X-5 maxed Alpha build

X-5 cool running DPS build.

[OneEyed Jack]

I have no plans to get an X-5, but I thought I'd pipe in that I actually like the 2 tube launcher on the TBT-7K for SRM6's. The build I think I'm going to stick with doesn't have the tonnage for it, but I ran with 2xSRM6 there for awhile and found it to be stupid accurate.

[Wytchwood]

Grey Ghost, on 05 March 2013 - 02:13 PM, said:

Yeah it appears to be the first Mech without an AMS slot.

Would be nice to get reaffirmation by the Devs if this was a bug.

[locilocisu]

So far I'm liking it. I put a smaller engine (250xl, still hit a bit above 100kph) and swap the SRM2s with SRM6s.

It rocks. The 2 tube slot allows me to direct pinpoint damage at any range. I don't shoot the missiles all the time, only when someone's in a straight right, don't realize i'm behind them or overheating.

The missiles hit for total of 30 damage if you manage to make all 3 volleys hit. This by itself is more damage than anything that the other Cicada can manage. This is the DPS Cicada.

The missiles are not harder to use than say the UAC5. I find myself in close distance when in a cicada that's going 100+ kph. So far... liking the srm6s to the face.

[1453 R]

Voyager I, on 06 March 2013 - 02:02 AM, said:

As a matter of fact, due to the way engine weights scale, a Cicada that tries to match the speed of a 300 XL Jenner will have almost the exact same weight to fit a payload after engine and armor, which means that those extra five tons aren't actually letting you bring anything extra to the table (other than a bit of extra armor and structure, which are a dubious trade for the significantly larger hitbox). If you want a Medium with SRMs that goes fast, but not quite that fast, we've got better options on Centurions (and maybe some Trebuchets).

The super-fast dual SRM-6 option would still be intriguing, but it's held back by the missile tubes being unsuited to the driveby maneuvers the rest of the mech is begging to perform. I'd even go so far as to say that the Jenner's ability to dump out two SRM-4s in a single volley gives it an advantage in that role.

That's basically my point about this mech. It's not really bad, because the Jenner D is an amazing ride and will go right back to being awesome as soon as ECM/Streak combos stop winning light fights by default, and this is basically just an awkward replica. It just trades a lot of the Jenner's little advantages (jump jets, unified lasers, four-tube missiles, smaller hitbox) for a C-Bill bonus. Depending on your priorities that might still be worth it, but people should be realistic about what they're getting for a pile of real money.

If you have a Founder's Jenner, though, I would say definitely don't buy this thing because aside from an extra 5% on the C-Bills you already have everything it does and a little more.

By that logic the entire Cicada chassis is basically an awkward Jenner replica. Which, for some pilots, is absolutely true - I totally get the folks who're baffled by the Cicada's existence and wonder what it can possibly do that a Jenner can't do better. I know I was baffled by it when I first got into the game - the list of iconic medium 'Mechs of the late Fourth Succession War/War of 3039 era doesn't generally bother to include 'Cicada'. Generally for good reason.

That said...the Jenner is also the most powerful light 'Mech of its day, pretty much period. At least insofar as I can remember. You yourself mentioned that being an awkward Jenner replica isn't exactly a bad thing, and you also have to remember that the current matchmaking system is trying to match by weight class rather than raw tonnage. For some folks, such as myself, the idea of generally matching against other mediums rather than other lights is a nontrivial advantage of the Cicada chassis. I hate light-hunting and generally only try (and, as a general rule, fail) to do it when there's no other choice. Hunchies, Cents and Trenchbuckets? I'll go after them any time you want me to, without hesitation. I can actually hit those guys.

As for the rest, it's mostly a matter of style, I suppose. Some folks just like the Cicada better, or prefer the options a Cicada gives them that a Jenner can't (ECM, high-speed ballistics platform for the gutsy and better-than-I-am). Certainly a Founder's Jenner does most everything the X-5 does, but a lot of us don't have the option of a Founder's Jenner, and I see nothing wrong with PGI offering similar options to folks who didn't/couldn't jump on the Founder's offers. The X-5 doesn't really take anything away from the Jenner, and it adds a lot of diversity to a Cicada pilot's hangar. Frankly, if one is already piloting Cicadas over Jenners, as I am, I don't see the harm in it.

[Phoenix Gray]

Part of the reason I like the Cicada is that no one else seems to. Like wanting to keep flying my Wildcat when everyone else is screaming for Corsairs.

[DegeneratePervert]

Totally picking one up tomorrow. Probably going to stick with the stock engine, but swap armor values around until I can fit two SRM-6 in there with 2 tons of ammo. I wish this thing had an AMS slot, that'd be the icing on the cake, but whatever.

[1453 R]

That's cutting out four tons of armor, man...like, over half the 'Mech's supply.

Really, if you want SRM-6's in your X-5, I'd recommend dropping two heat sinks and two medium lasers, instead. Perhaps cut one ton of armor to put back one of those mediums, or pick up a couple of smalls instead, but if you keep all the sinks and all the lasers and just cut armor in order to upgrade the launchers, ye're down to 125 points of armor. Seriously, I just cut four tons of armor off of the stock config in Smurfy. It...didn't leave much.

That's not a 'Mech I'd really trust in a fight. 125 points of armor is kinda piddling by Commando standards. Dem Cicadas are just a mite easier to hit than Commandos.

[Beefer]

Rather than dropping all that armor, drop the engine size slightly. I dropped mine to a 300xl (121kph without tweak) and dropped 1/2 ton of armor and a heat sink to fit the SRM6s. If you find that doesn't work for you, I also used one SRM6 and one SRM4 for a while, the drop off is noticeable but not really that significant.