188 replies to this topic

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Mystere, on 08 March 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

Are you both (Nicholas and Shadowsword8) telling me that a "voluntary" poll (i.e. one in which results are determined solely by people who choose to participate) is not much worse than the real thing?

If so, I apologize beforehand, but, I will have to respond in a way that I normally do in such circumstances: Please show me the math.

A link or set of links should be enough top get me started.

Every poll is voluntary.

Does everyone in the United States vote for president?

Do all people who own shares in a company vote for board members?

What poll isn't voluntary?

Skaroth, on 08 March 2013 - 10:39 AM, said:

You make the assumption that most players of this game are on the forum and voted in the poll.

That and... I thought you said you had resigned from complaining... yet here you continue...

What is being said is, that if 1000 people voted, that is enough people to get an idea of where the majority of people stand.

That is how polls are sampled in every facet of life. Whether it's for products, presidents or allstar games.

[Vilheim]

Shadowpunisher, on 07 March 2013 - 06:21 PM, said:

It has been 3 months since ECM has been implemented.

Three months of frustration playing against an obviously OP equipment, requiring NO skill at all to use but a lot of unfunny efforts to counter.

Three months trying to make YOU, PGI, change opinion and balance this equipment.

Now I'm tired, tired to see that YOU are just ignoring us, that their are still a majority of players unhappy with how ECM is working.

But it's fine YOU WON ! LRMS are now more imbalanced, Streaks are still too powerful against light mechs, ECM rule the game, and you are manipulating us with your Consumables changes surprisingly made in 1 day when it is something that need weeks to balance ...





But I'm not resigned, I will still continue to say that the game is imbalanced, but not here, because their are too many things that need to change [ECM, Missiles, Information sharing, Consumables, ...]

[Ghogiel]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 08 March 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

That is how polls are sampled in every facet of life. Whether it's for products, presidents or allstar games.

I did my own poll. It concluded this forum is full of QQ and deluded neckbeards.

[Glythe]

yashmack, on 07 March 2013 - 06:59 PM, said:

ECM is just fine...

It just needs to weigh about +5 tons and use more critical slots then there wouldn't be too much of a problem.... you'd still need to give any mech using it a -10% heat penalty and it would be out of place in the time line (but that last part is just "fluff").

Edited by Glythe, 08 March 2013 - 11:02 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Ghogiel, on 08 March 2013 - 11:00 AM, said:

I did my own poll. It concluded this forum is full of QQ and deluded neckbeards.

That is possibly a very valid point. I will have to research this and get back to you.

[Mystere]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 08 March 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

Every poll is voluntary.
Does everyone in the United States vote for president?
Do all people who own shares in a company vote for board members?
What poll isn't voluntary?

What is being said is, that if 1000 people voted, that is enough people to get an idea of where the majority of people stand.
That is how polls are sampled in every facet of life. Whether it's for products, presidents or allstar games.

Argh! Obviously, I did not describe what I meant well enough. Maybe going straight to a source such as this should hopefully make it clear what type of poll I was referring to.

But still, please show me the math.

Edited by Mystere, 08 March 2013 - 11:18 AM.

[Mystere]

Shadowpunisher, on 07 March 2013 - 06:39 PM, said:

How I know majority of players are unhappy with it ? Last poll I saw said it.

I don't have any problems to play against it, but it's not fun at all. And when I'm using a Raven 3L or a DDC I feel dirty, its too easy.
It's a GAME it should be fun to play against each others.

Well, I made it fun by specifically hunting them down. But that's just who I am.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

http://theweek.com/a...-how-polls-work

This is a pretty good article on how it works.

It's a bit hard to compare their polling to ours. Because they focus on getting enough men, women, races, ages, etc.

When it's basically one giant mush here.

But they mention they like to get a 1500 person sample for a national poll.

Just think about how many people there are in the United States.

If you have 1000 people answering a poll here, that is like 10 times the amount you would need math-wise.

[MaddMaxx]

Ghogiel, on 08 March 2013 - 11:00 AM, said:

I did my own poll. It concluded this forum is full of QQ and deluded neckbeards.

And 4 out of Dentists agreed. You win.

[Ursh]

Bubba Wilkins, on 08 March 2013 - 07:41 AM, said:

Tired of complaining?

I'm tired of hearing about it.

ECM is just a minor inconvenience at best. It's only effective on people who rely on the two types of guided weapons systems and those who refuse to pay attention to their systems and surroundings.

Oh really? Is that why the Raven 3L buildout in competitive 8 mans and Lonewolf matches is almost exactly the same? WoW, those solo guys are really sharp and perceptive. 2xSSRM2, 3xMlas.

It's not rocket science, and it's been a problem for months, but PGI says it's working as intended.

[RG Notch]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 08 March 2013 - 11:26 AM, said:

http://theweek.com/a...-how-polls-work

This is a pretty good article on how it works.

It's a bit hard to compare their polling to ours. Because they focus on getting enough men, women, races, ages, etc.

When it's basically one giant mush here.

But they mention they like to get a 1500 person sample for a national poll.

Just think about how many people there are in the United States.

If you have 1000 people answering a poll here, that is like 10 times the amount you would need math-wise.

Yeah except for the whole scientific part, but don't let logic and science slow you down.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

See that's the fun thing about being the owners of the boards.

The devs could if they wanted, take the poll. And then take a look at all the people who voted, then establish who was playing a lot, a little, what mechs they were in, whether they were in premades, whether they were PUG's.

And if after looking at their data they see that the poll was a terrible misrepresentation, they could say that and we'd have to eat our hats.

But I have an odd feeling that is not the case. Because if we were wrong, they would've said something already.

[War Council]

The original game had the option for anyone to mount it on their mech. And why not? For 1.5 tons shouldn't every 31st century mech be outfitted with ECM since it is this important? It is not even remotely realistic that it would have been limited to certain mechs. Limiting such an obvious piece of must have hardware not only breaks the lore, but breaks the game. It would be better to throw it out altogether than continue with the current restrictions.

[Mystere]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 08 March 2013 - 11:26 AM, said:

http://theweek.com/a...-how-polls-work

Thanks!

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Sure thing. Thanks for not freaking out while we talk.

I don't mind a good conversation even if we don't agree.

[LoneUnknown]

PGI has a really messed up mindset going on, I'll let you in on it.

They actually think building frustration and hate are good things.

When I think back, there was a time that I found this game FUN. Now it is actually painful, overall not a pleasant experience. ECM is the main reason right now, but small additions and changes here and there, pretentious customer service and moderators, and a caustic community (from all the dicking around) all add to the pot.

Reminds me of those impish troll type GMs back in the tabletop days, who loved causing distress in the players... and kinda got off on it. It is like a form of mental sadism.,

In other words, they think that their game is "fun" if you are somehow suffering.... and that's messed up.

YOU HAVE BEEN DESTROYED
YOU HAVE BEEN DESTROYED
YOU HAVE BEEN DESTROYED
YOU HAVE BEEN DESTROYED
YOU HAVE BEEN DESTROYED

[DaisuSaikoro Nagasawa]

Shadowpunisher, on 07 March 2013 - 06:39 PM, said:

How I know majority of players are unhappy with it ? Last poll I saw said it.

I don't have any problems to play against it, but it's not fun at all. And when I'm using a Raven 3L or a DDC I feel dirty, its too easy.
It's a GAME it should be fun to play against each others.

Polls here are biased. An argument can be made that there's a select group of people who come to the forums and even a more select group who'd bother to complain on the forums.

[Noth]

Daisu Saikoro, on 08 March 2013 - 12:33 PM, said:

Polls here are biased. An argument can be made that there's a select group of people who come to the forums and even a more select group who'd bother to complain on the forums.

All polls are biased.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Daisu Saikoro, on 08 March 2013 - 12:33 PM, said:

Polls here are biased. An argument can be made that there's a select group of people who come to the forums and even a more select group who'd bother to complain on the forums.

What arguement?

Do you have some special ability to see who is posting and why?

How do you know who posts here?

Seems like it's a lot of people who are highly invested in the game, like to learn about, and spend money on it posting here to me.

[WardenWolf]

I will call ECM balanced the day that *every* mech can equip it equally.

A lot of folks in this thread have ideas I strongly support, and I agree that ECM is not where I think it should be. I think the very fact that some mechs can mount it and others cannot is proof that it is not balanced.