188 replies to this topic

[ApheX]

Bit of a dramatic post OP. You make it sound like you have been waging a personnal war with PGI on this. So tell me, Are the trences as bad as people say? I'm not suprised you're tired. Lol, joke. Personnally i think ECM is fine as it is. Just strap a PPC to your mech and blast away. Easy.

[Harmin]

I think ECM has the right feature set and the right amount of counters.

[WolvesX]

Shadowpunisher, on 07 March 2013 - 06:21 PM, said:

It has been 3 months since ECM has been implemented.

Three months of frustration playing against an obviously OP equipment, requiring NO skill at all to use but a lot of unfunny efforts to counter.

Three months trying to make YOU, PGI, change opinion and balance this equipment.

Now I'm tired, tired to see that YOU are just ignoring us, that their are still a majority of players unhappy with how ECM is working.

But it's fine YOU WON ! LRMS are now more imbalanced, Streaks are still too powerful against light mechs, ECM rule the game, and you are manipulating us with your Consumables changes surprisingly made in 1 day when it is something that need weeks to balance ...





But I'm not resigned, I will still continue to say that the game is imbalanced, but not here, because their are too many things that need to change [ECM, Missiles, Information sharing, Consumables, ...]

Yup, even I stop complaining about it, even though I hate it and its mechanic and its OPness and coise narrowness.

[Congzilla]

OP, your tears are delicious.

[Cpt Jason McCarthy]

Simple question 1 : Why ECM is not available for every mech in the game ?

Hypothesis 1 : ECM is an equipment designed to be used for scouting !

Question 2 : Why do the Atlas D-DC can equip an ECM ?

Hypothesis : ECM is an equipment designed to be used for scouting and for commander mechs ?

Question 3 : Why do other commander mechs like Dragons or Stalkers or Awesome can't equip an ECM ?

Hypothesis : No reason ...

[Teralitha]

Ursh, on 08 March 2013 - 02:01 AM, said:

"Learn to play. Learn to aim. Focus fire 3Ls." All these comments aren't constructive. You can focus fire any mech. A team shouldn't have to coordinate a strategy for taking out a 35 ton mech though.

The problem isnt even that though... coordinating a strategy to beat kind of mech isnt the deepest issue. Its that the meta game is centered on only one thing. The real problem is the depth of strategy in the meta game. Its very shallow and boring.

Things that make it shallow/boring/stale/repetitive

ECM
Base Caping Feature.
Poor LRM mechanics.(and I mean bad.. like - needs to go back to the drawing board bad.)
Overpowered weapons.
Overall speed and manueverability of mechs in general is a little too slow.
Map designs.

All of which I have lobbied for change since closed beta. I would love to see this game reach or come close to perfection in my lifetime... It just isnt happening. For every step foward, they take 2 steps backwards. And they seem to be content with this standard.

Yea these are not opinions. These are observations from the perspective of a 15 year hardcore very successful professional mechwarrior league team tactician and ace pilot.

Edited by Teralitha, 08 March 2013 - 06:54 AM.

[Star Captain Obvious Kerensky]

Teralitha, on 08 March 2013 - 06:34 AM, said:

Yea these are not opinions. These are observations from the perspective of a 15 year hardcore very successful professional mechwarrior league team tactician and ace pilot.

o·pin·ion (-pnyn)n.
1. A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof.
2. A judgment based on special knowledge and given by an expert.
3. A judgment or estimation of the merit of a person or thing.
4. The prevailing view: public opinion.

You might call yourself an expert, although its still an opinion. And no, you're not a professsional mechwarrior league pilot. There are no professional mechwarrior leagues.

[Teralitha]

I know how to use google too, troll.


ob·ser·va·tion
[ob-zur-vey-shuhn] Show IPA
noun
1. an act or instance of noticing or perceiving.
2. an act or instance of regarding attentively or watching.
3. the faculty or habit of observing or noticing.
4. notice: to escape a person's observation.
5. an act or instance of viewing or noting a fact or occurrence for some scientific or other special purpose

Definition of observation
noun

• 
  1the action or process of observing something or someone carefully or in order to gain information
  
• 
  the ability to notice things, especially significant details

A remark, statement, or comment based on something one has seen, heard, or noticed
__________________________________________________________________________

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." (<--- thats YOU)
George Bernard Shaw

boom

Edited by Teralitha, 08 March 2013 - 07:12 AM.

[Alois Hammer]

Eldragon, on 08 March 2013 - 06:56 AM, said:

You might call yourself an expert, although its still an opinion. And no, you're not a professsional mechwarrior league pilot. There are no professional mechwarrior leagues.

Dude...arguing with a self-proclaimed Legend in His Own Mind™ is insanity. Just don't do it. It's like arguing with a fool- he'll drag you down to his level then beat you with his greater experience.

[Livewyr]

all we really need is something we can counter ECM the way it counters other things...give me a 1ton piece of equipment to mount on my mech that disables ECM anywhere on the map. that way we can step up the meta arms race. /sarcasm.

Just fix ECM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Shadowpunisher, on 07 March 2013 - 06:21 PM, said:

Streaks are still too powerful against light mechs,

If streaks are so OP why have I missed with them 28% of the time? I have better accuracy with medium lasers!

[Hawks]

Maybe there should be a selectable game mode or something...like how we have the 'conquest only' or 'assault only' modes...there should be an optional 'no ECM' mode. Bam! People who want to play with ECM can play with ECM. People who want to play without ECM can play without ECM. Everyone's happy, everyone's a winner.

[Bubba Wilkins]

Tired of complaining?

I'm tired of hearing about it.

ECM is just a minor inconvenience at best. It's only effective on people who rely on the two types of guided weapons systems and those who refuse to pay attention to their systems and surroundings.

[Teralitha]

Alois Hammer, on 08 March 2013 - 07:31 AM, said:

Dude...arguing with a self-proclaimed Legend in His Own Mind™ is insanity.

Unless its actually true. Damn these trolls just dont quit! LOL

[Hawks]

Hawks, on 08 March 2013 - 07:40 AM, said:

Maybe there should be a selectable game mode or something...like how we have the 'conquest only' or 'assault only' modes...there should be an optional 'no ECM' mode. Bam! People who want to play with ECM can play with ECM. People who want to play without ECM can play without ECM. Everyone's happy, everyone's a winner.

Even better idea...instead of just 'no ECM', how about a 'level 1 tech only' mode? Keep it old-school...

[Thuzel]

Teralitha, on 08 March 2013 - 06:34 AM, said:

The problem isnt even that though... coordinating a strategy to beat kind of mech isnt the deepest issue. Its that the meta game is centered on only one thing. The real problem is the depth of strategy in the meta game. Its very shallow and boring.

...

This is exactly right. The real problem is shallow, repetitive game play lacking any real tactics of note. Ever watch the 8 mans? They typically center around just a few concepts: focus fire, limiting exposure, and scouting. I hardly ever see anything more involved than that. Nothing terribly complicated or advanced in any case.

But the truth is that this is a symptom of two things:

1. Smaller teams and maps. Short ranges and only 8 players lends itself to brawling and limited maneuvers.
2. Unbalanced items. Why should anyone try to play the hard way when it's been made easy? Just use the obviously overpowered items and play on their strength. ECM is a great example of that, and you see a lot of it because of that.

Now, 1 will be taken care of. We're getting larger maps and teams. But 2 is still a problem. Just look at indirect fire with LRM's as an example. ECM has marginalized indirect fire and turned 90% of MWO into a direct fire game where even mechs that should be capable of fantastic indirect fire support now tend to resort to self-tagging targets and direct fire instead.

Why should we care? Because it takes varied game play and curbstomps it. Every time it gets unbalanced, we tend to see less real game play and more of whatever tactic takes advantage of that item. SSRM2, ECM, Gauss (before it was re-balanced), and LRMs are examples of that and it gets incredibly boring. If I wanted something like that, I'd go out and play any one of the dozens of FPS out there...

But I don't want that, and you probably don't want that either. I want Mechwarrior. With tactics and skill and fun. What we've got right now is neat, but it's only half of that...

[Teralitha]

Eldragon, on 08 March 2013 - 06:56 AM, said:

There are no professional mechwarrior leagues.

Not currently, no. The leagues I speak of have ended.

[Lyrik]

Shadowpunisher, on 07 March 2013 - 06:21 PM, said:

It has been 3 months since ECM has been implemented.

Now I'm tired, tired to see that YOU are just ignoring us, that their are still a majority of players unhappy with how ECM is working.

No, they just ignored whiners like you. I like ECM.

D-DC are countered by PPC, Ravens are killed by lazors (thx state rewind) and Cicadas ...pfff

All the LRM spam ingame just means one thing: we need MORE Mechs with ECM. Or a nerf to Tag ;-)

[Mystere]

Shadowsword8, on 08 March 2013 - 01:51 AM, said:

A poll IS representative of the majority (minus the degree of inaccuracy associated with sample size).

Actually, the poll in question (and any poll in this forum for that matter) is not really valid because it is based solely on the views of people who bothered to respond.

Haven't you seen any of those news channels whose poll results are obtained by making responders press specific buttons on their cable remotes? Pay closer attention to the disclaimers they give regarding the validity of the poll results. There is a very good reason why they make such disclaimers.

Ursh, on 08 March 2013 - 02:01 AM, said:

A team shouldn't have to coordinate a strategy for taking out a 35 ton mech though.

But, a team should coordinate a strategy to take out an immediate threat. Do you see the difference?

[MaddMaxx]

Thuzel, on 08 March 2013 - 07:43 AM, said:

This is exactly right. The real problem is shallow, repetitive game play lacking any real tactics of note. Ever watch the 8 mans? They typically center around just a few concepts: focus fire, limiting exposure, and scouting. I hardly ever see anything more involved than that. Nothing terribly complicated or advanced in any case.

But the truth is that this is a symptom of two things:

1. Smaller teams and maps. Short ranges and only 8 players lends itself to brawling and limited maneuvers.
2. Unbalanced items. Why should anyone try to play the hard way when it's been made easy? Just use the obviously overpowered items and play on their strength. ECM is a great example of that, and you see a lot of it because of that.

Now, 1 will be taken care of. We're getting larger maps and teams. But 2 is still a problem. Just look at indirect fire with LRM's as an example. ECM has marginalized indirect fire and turned 90% of MWO into a direct fire game where even mechs that should be capable of fantastic indirect fire support now tend to resort to self-tagging targets and direct fire instead.

Why should we care? Because it takes varied game play and curbstomps it. Every time it gets unbalanced, we tend to see less real game play and more of whatever tactic takes advantage of that item. SSRM2, ECM, Gauss (before it was re-balanced), and LRMs are examples of that and it gets incredibly boring. If I wanted something like that, I'd go out and play any one of the dozens of FPS out there...

But I don't want that, and you probably don't want that either. I want Mechwarrior. With tactics and skill and fun. What we've got right now is neat, but it's only half of that...

And after reading that, well written piece btw, I can only comment by saying that over the past month, month and a half, I am seeing and playing off against a level of mixed weapons and Mechs way more diverse that was ever assembled previously. Now I am not sure why that is, bit I have to assume it not due to some increase in OP items. In fact, it would seem to point to a better balanced mix over-all.

There is one thing this Forum shows us over and over, if there is Cheese to be had, Cheese will stink the joint up bad. Other than the Ravel-3L (hit box issue imho, not ECM +Strks) and the added pain LRM's just got, things are not to bad in MWO land.

But no worries. I am but a whisper against the Gales of Woe and Strife that blow constantly around these parts and am enjoying MWO for what is currently is. Not something is yet to become.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 08 March 2013 - 08:09 AM.