448 replies to this topic

[Hellboy561]

As an Atlas pilot i can tell you that the most effective thing about my Mech isn't its weapons or its armor. Its the pilot reading the information of the battlefield. If i have no idea what is going on infront of me then i'm going to walk into a **** storm and get blown to pieces in seconds, therefore being a complete waste.

Yes i may have the most armor, but the Atlas is designed to terrorise its opponents. So tell me what is more scary, fighting an Atlas or fighting the Atlas' friends when he turns up to ruin your day? Some of my best moments in my Atlas have been where i have seen the enemy pilots panic as I drop off a cliff next to them (Episilon, Forest Colony) and unleash Alpha after Alpha whilst soaking up all the damage.

Atlas' are designed to be the second line, send in the lights first to break up the lines then push hard through the gap with the Assaults! Works like a charm.

Also to the OP, do you Pilot an Atlas? if not **** and stop telling people how to pilot a Mech you've never tried.

Edited by Hellboy561, 13 March 2013 - 05:09 AM.

[Spawnsalot]

Dear small, fragile things,

While you rightfully acknowledge us as the superior, immortal constructs that we are, the Atlas Pantheon has deigned that we should "die" in battle upon taking a predetermined amount of fire from our opponents, for we are infinite, we are eternal and cannot truly die. This was decided, in our infinite wisdom, to give you who accomplish this feat a glimmer of hope while you scurry about you short, frantic lives.

Should you allow this to happen through your own negligence of service to your Atlas while it shields your weak frames, you and your companions will quickly find yourselves bereft of it's majesty and at a distinct disadvantage.

Do not shirk in your duty! Adhering to the will of the Pantheon will see you to victory! Support us as we support you on the field of conflict and you will survive, fail in this and you will surely perish.

Omnipotently,

The Atlas Pantheon






But seriously, my Fatlasses work fine up front and from the rear field thanks.
My D brawls with the best of them in the thick of it - bullying smaller mechs, grandstanding with the big 'uns and sheltering team mates when it can.
While my DDC protects other mechs with an ECM bubble, disables ECM on enemy mechs from range, TAGs mechs for the team *and* lays down a lethal barrage of Artemis warheads.

I don't need people telling me I should go and get focus fired while they run and hide, it's bad enough in a big scrap but on my lonesome or as a vanguard I die very quickly as I don't have the speed to escape if I stumble into 3 other mechs on my own.

Back me up in a brawl and focus my targets or make use of the TAG and disabled ECM window I provide and we're golden.

[Bounty Dogg]

The Atlas is NOT a tank!

Its an Aircraft Carrier.

Extremely powerful weapons and abilities, incredible armor.........and if she goes sailing into the fray alone, easy bait for every sub, gunner, Destroyer, and various other AC killers in the sea. An Aircraft Carrier needs her Battlegroup around her to bring out her full potential.

.....The SAME as an Atlas. its only at its most powerful when its TEAM is there to support it.

I think you have the wrong analogy when you look at an Atlas.

[Glythe]

KinLuu, on 13 March 2013 - 01:28 AM, said:

The job of an atlas is doing as much damage as possible. Drawing fire is the job of the fast lights - because in MWO evading damage is much better than taking damage. And much easier.

You're so close... but very right. The job of an Atlas is to deal a ton of damage before it finally goes down after lots of concentrated fire.

Fast mediums are actually the best "tanks" in the game because they evade the most and take longer to destroy than every light except the Raven. You'll never see a 12% Atlas unless you are griefing some guy who has lost all his weapons. I see mediums go down that low in health before dying all the time.


When I play the Atlas (not playing it right now because game is fked atm with PPC balance) my goal is to kill the enemy and not die. It is the mech responsible for my 4.4 KDR. I regularly out damage LRM boats without carrying any LRM myself. An average game for me in the Atlas is 600 damage and a good game is between 800-1000 (both happen quite often).

Edited by Glythe, 13 March 2013 - 05:20 AM.

[Yanlowen Cage]

Dragonkindred, on 13 March 2013 - 02:04 AM, said:

Technically all assault mechs are supposed to be damage soaks, so your post is bias.

Atlas's have a lot of hard points that can be used in lots of ways. I will not be dictated by you or any other. I've used LRMs, sniper builds and brawler builds. Guess what, they all work.

Have you ever considered using a D-DC to cover your support mechs? Would you want that D-DC to be spec'd as a brawler? No, you use a spec that complements the team you are working with. That may be a mixed spec or sniper or LRMs.

If weight limits are put in, then you can come here and complain.

Really! I often lead that charge in my 46.3 kph stalker whilst the atlasi hide behind the buildings and cringe. Do I die? quite often. Does it help my team blow a hole in the enemy line, yes. is that hole exploited. Only sometimes. Dang it, if I punch a hole cause the atlas is hiding again, please follow me and make my sacrifice mean something.

[Xelah]

As an Atlas-RS pilot that packs LRMs and quad LL's, I have this to say:

I will charge when either
A) my group on teamspeak informs me of a tactical advantage to press
I see the lights have drawn the enemy's attention and I can blindside someone... and telling my teamspeak group to come with
and sometimes
C) when I see the puggies doing their own charge and need backup

If there is no tactical advantage, I'm firing LRM's from my hiding spot until my team can tell me about more interesting developments or my LRM's make a tactical advantage. The mech is too slow to charge into a bad position. Soaking up damage does nothing but soak up damage if a couple of enemy mechs don't die as a result.


As a Centurion pilot I have this to say:
Get over yourself and L2P. A single centurion flanking can pull enemy mechs out of position. You don't have to be in a light to screw up the enemy's discipline. Pick a large enemy and plant some AC rounds in their face. Cataphract pilot: "I can take that centurion! you guys hold the line."

[Shredhead]

Onmyoudo, on 13 March 2013 - 12:46 AM, said:

An Atlas is a damage soak. It has the most armour, it has the most durability and in a lot of cases it has ECM. If you are not soaking damage, you are not doing your job. Did you get 600 damage? Great. Did you get 2 kills? Well done. Did the rest of your team die because they got alpha struck to death while you were playing coy buggers in the buildings? Then you're next, bucko, and the game has been lost. If you're winning, then it's likely because someone else has been soaking up the damage that you should have been sharing.

Due to the nature of how MWO works, an Atlas is always needed on the front lines. Massive burst damage and concentrated fire can and will annihilate members of your team that, if able to actually fire their weapons (perhaps due to the enemy team instead firing at the large 100 ton behemoth striding towards them) will allow your team to do more damage overall than you alone can manage. 400 + 400 is better than the 600 you will do by yourself.

Your Atlas is not an LRM boat. Get a Catapult. Your Atlas is not a sniper. Get a Stalker. If you want to use those weapons, by all means do so - on your way towards the battle lines. Your mech is one of the most important in any game you play and you must use its strengths to help your team succeed. Because it is your team that is important - if you yourself get blown up with only 200 damage done, but succeed in drawing enough fire to let your team win the match, then your role has been fulfilled and you can congratulate yourself on a job well done. That is your purpose. Start doing it.



Disclaimer: a Stalker could also arguably fill this role, but for several obvious reasons is not as effective.

OP's got it right. If you don't move up to the front and into the biggest brawl you are doing it wrong! If you boat LRMs in an Atlas, you are a liability to your team in a fail build, nothing more! And who would make a sniper out of an Atlas? You have to expose yourself completely and are not fast enough to get back in cover when needed!

Dornhal, on 13 March 2013 - 01:46 AM, said:

As an Atlas pilot that does charge in and take fire, I would like to say.

Dear team, when I say we are charging this position, and you are all following me, as soon as someone shoots a small laser at you, don't KITTENING RUN AWAY,

That's unfortunately the other side of the medal. I can't count the times I was left alone against a bunch of enemies because the rest of the team had their pubbie-senses tingling.

[silentD11]

Brown Hornet, on 13 March 2013 - 04:30 AM, said:

Atlas D-DCs shouldn't be a damage sponge. They r way too valuable with ECM to consider losing and a key part to a crushing victory so long as they stay alive. Atlas K is utter rubbish. This is the perfect damage sponge. Let it die. Atlas D is THE spearhead mech. This is the one to pop out of cover with heavies on its wing and punch through enemy lines. I like to think of it as the D-DC delivery mech. As for the RS, well that's best in a LR support role.

Here is the problem with D vs D-DC as spearhead punch... hardpoints. D has one more ballistic (pointless), and two energy in the torso. D-DC has an extra missile. In most cases the difference in ballistics goes out the window. You're probably only going to have one, or at max two AC5/UAC5, so the D's advantage here never comes into play.

In many cases, having the 3srm six two medium lasers as a brawler is preferable to having four medium lasers and 2srm six.

[Fut]

Luciain, on 13 March 2013 - 03:01 AM, said:

I normally play a DDC Brawler, and I like to get into the enemy and mic it up but the one thing I've learned is it never lead the charge while in a PUG cause no-one will back you up. If you really wanna see an Atlas tank then roll and Atlas and try 20 drops as a tank. It is perhaps one of the most fustrating experiences in the game.

I'm not trying to single you out here, Luciain, just using your comment as an example because it raises a good discussion point.
Have you ever tried to send a message to your team indicating that you're about to charge, and that you think some back-up would be beneficial? I'm quite certain that you'd get a few people to charge with you if they actually realized that's what going down.

Due to my schedule I don't have the spare time to play in anything but PUG matches (for now... hopefully), so I know your frustration. I really try to keep an eye on my Assault 'Mechs because I understand their limitations and downfalls. When I see the Atlai charging in, I'm right there with them... Most of the time though, I see what you're complaining about - half the team just sitting back watching and waiting.

So maybe what PUG Matches need is for people to communicate a little bit better. People might not be following the charge because they're tied up doing other things, or facing the wrong way...etc. A quick note asking for Back-Up might be enough to remedy this.

[Kill Dozer]

As others have said, it depends on the pilot, map and other factors. An Atlas (and any other assault mech really) aren't the end-all be-all of the battlefield. There are times when a brawler Atlas should be the center of an assault lance and there are times when it is used as a weapons platform to support a swarm of mediums. "Role Warfare" etc etc, team communication is key, if you don't have it, it makes things much more difficult.

[Glythe]

silentD11, on 13 March 2013 - 05:28 AM, said:

Here is the problem with D vs D-DC as spearhead punch... hardpoints. D has one more ballistic (pointless), and two energy in the torso. D-DC has an extra missile. In most cases the difference in ballistics goes out the window. You're probably only going to have one, or at max two AC5/UAC5, so the D's advantage here never comes into play.

Atlas 7D should have had 1 ballistic and one missile slot in each side torso. Or maybe the K should have had 1 ballistic in each side torso and no missile slot. Either way it's a shame there is no atlas with double AC/20.

[kalami]

I think the main complaint is about the Atlas pilots who stay at the base boating LRM's; yes you can play however you please, but there are a lot of better builds for boating if thats your thing; if our only Atlas is at base while the enemy team is pushing up on the other side of the map we are probably going to lose. Not to mention, if you are going to do that just call out "lets play D".

When I play in a group the Atlas is our pointman and we support him. Even in a pug; I will usually call out "follow the Atlas" if anyone asks for a plan. Now there are suicide Atlas pilots who just stompy stomp right ahead with no regard and die; but thats not really an effective way to play either and honestly doesn't seem to happen that often.

I understand the frustration in some pug matches, but overall Ive seen most people stick close to the team Atlas and support him more than any other mech.

[DogmeatX]

I've Master on 3 of the atlases and probably enough XP above that to master the 4th if I wanted it (which I don't)

I disagree that it's about charging in first and being the "tank" - because of your (lack of) speed and rather large hit box if you are the first one into the fight more often than not you're going to get focus fire and die rather quickly or at least end up badly crippled and then limp around for much of the match waiting to get picked off.

Atlas is actually more dependent on the group being smart than quite a few other mechs. What happens when the group is moving as a unit and they spot a lone jenner on the radar? Yes you guessed it, more often than not many people will peel off to chase the squirrel.

This leaves your lumbering brick of a mech alone and rather vulnerable if it should be unfortunate to encounter an enemy group (even a small number of lights can be problematic)

It's actually better for harrassers and lighter/faster mechs to go in first or go over the crest of a hill, they have more chance of evading fire and getting in/out.

I found while pilotting the Atlas, especially the DDC, I have to keep an eye on the minimap and try to best situate myself depending where the group is. You have to judge when it's best to make a push forward and when to unleash the burst damage, and hope the rest of the team piles in as well. If you just wade in right at the start most of the times I've found it's a losing proposition.

The best time to "tank" is when the engagement is already on and enemy mechs are distracted or not focus firing, you can then wade in and soak up some damage and help out your own guys who are in combat, killing things in short order or surviving enough vs 2-3 or maybe more enemies if possible so that your guys can get the drop on them.

Using buildings for cover, moving around "hiding" etc. is playing smart, waiting for the right moment to step in and either kill things or soak it up when needed. It can make a difference if you manage to surprise an enemy as they turn a corner and go face to face with an atlas - I've lost count the number of players who've gone into a panic and overheated etc.

Charging in from the start/lead is asking to be focus fired to death.

As for longer range stuff, well the maps are getting bigger. Short range brawler can only go so far, especially as they add in more bigger maps.

Edited by DogmeatX, 13 March 2013 - 06:12 AM.

[TheMadPoet]

I run an Atlas D that has 2xLRM15s and 3x ERLL. It is slow, but devestating to enemies in the open and at long range. If I kill 2-5 enemy mechs with it, which I often do, I'd say it IS doing it's job just fine, thanks.

I run an ECM Atlas as well (just started with it) and I try to follow the main group, providing cover and drawing fire. I run it with 1xAC10, 3XSRM4, and 2xERLL. I will do my best to TANK with it.

See? Even the mighty Atlas can have a few different roles.

Edited by TheMadPoet, 13 March 2013 - 06:22 AM.

[Taemien]

Here we are having yet more people telling others how to play THEIR way.

Here's the facts. The OP is just whining, don't listen to him, play your mechs how you wish to play. Let your score show how effective it is. The OP can't do anything about it except whine. If you want to put LRMs on your Atlas, go for it. If you want to laser boat a Catapult, go crazy. Do what you think is fun.

OP, get off your high horse. If you don't like what teammates take into the fight, then find a group of players to launch with that have what you want them to have, don't expect the community to play the game how YOU think it should be played. Do us a favor and stop whining at the very least about PUGs. Launching in a random PUG means getting random loadouts, deal with it, or go in a premade where you can decide who takes what in what mech.

[NocturnalBeast]

Filthy Dracs can't tell me what to do! :-)

[rdmgraziel]

You're mostly right, but the idea of "tank" needs to be closer to that of the real world variant (lots of armor and firepower) and not so much the video game version (damage sponge). Assaults are highly reliant on good positioning and support from their team to properly fulfill their role; a bad Atlas pilot will either wade into a blatantly bad situation (charging LRMs....over open ground, even if you're using a DDC, a single Tag and you're toast) but even a good Atlas pilot can be caught out (stuck in the open, moving TO cover, suddenly enemy team while your team ran off to leave you to fend for yourself).

The D is superior to the DDC for spearheading because (in theory) he has more weapons to cycle through. Arm lasers to ballistic to CT lasers to SRMs to arm lasers etc, vs arm lasers to ballistic to SRMs. I don't mention LRMs since due to how the tubes seem to work on an Atlas, boating them is a bit of a bad joke and you're outclassed by other mechs who are doing the same but with better tube/hardpoint layouts (You WILL fire in volleys of 10 unless god help you you're doing it in an RS, which is even lower for some godawful reason. If they fired in groups of 20 like they were supposed to it would be legit). Nothing wrong with having sniper weaponry, so long as you still advance like a hybrid sniper/brawler (just means you're at the back/center of the charge instead of front/center).

A good Atlas pilot with a pure brawler setup WILL end up just kind of...hanging out behind cover until there's a good chance to charge, since his weapons have limited range, barring some clever/cunning flanking. Personally I prefer having some long range punch mixed in so that I can at least help the team during the poke-fest that precedes the brawls.

Also, seriously people, follow the Atlas. Following a good Atlas on a charge gives you a substantially higher chance for victory.

[silentD11]

kalami, on 13 March 2013 - 05:57 AM, said:

I think the main complaint is about the Atlas pilots who stay at the base boating LRM's; yes you can play however you please, but there are a lot of better builds for boating if thats your thing; if our only Atlas is at base while the enemy team is pushing up on the other side of the map we are probably going to lose. Not to mention, if you are going to do that just call out "lets play D".

I always groan when I see an Atlas with LRMs, there are soo much better mechs for that. There are also better mechs for LRMs + long range direct fire support. It's obnoxious because we could either have had a better Atlas build, or a better support build. So it's a wash either way and not an efficient use of one of our 8 player slots.

[Golfin Man]

OP is angry that he gets one shotted by the poptart PPC/Guass combos. Guess what? It takes 2-3 direct hits with that to take out an Atlas torso, so Atlases can't just stand on a mountain and eat hundreds of damage while you slowly flank around in your 50kph dakkaphract or whatever nonsense you're piloting around. Flamer gets flamed

[Corpustroni]

As a fellow atlas pilot i love to "break the ice", mostly becouse i hate fights where mechs just shoot and take cover all the time. I choose to belive that its my role to open up the fight. And to those who say that atlases die as fast as any other mech is probably cuz that atlas was for some noob reason using an xl engine, cuz i have lost both my torsos and can keep going.