30 replies to this topic

[Kell Morgan]

Ok, so I'm tired of the threads of people complaining about something but not making a serious effort to come up with any constructive ideas!

I honestly think the weapons balancing is pretty close in this game but I do have a few ideas!

Machine guns: Are a lot better than before I love stripping heat sinks off an open mech
Honestly though we need to do something about that pesky armor! I was thinking about armor penetrating ability, I was thinking 1/2 - 1/3 of the shots going though armor and hitting internals directly! that would allow us do do a little internal damage and maybe take out a few heat sinks BEFORE all the armor is gone!

I dont think this would be too over powered and would allow for another adjustment parameter to help with balancing. Changing damage of a weapon is always an option but I don't think it would be appropriate for MG.

BOATING: Ok, boating is an issue that not everyone agrees on. Well the problem is right now nerfing a weapon to prevent boating also hurts everyone else using 1 or 2. My thought was for every weapon above 2 of the same type (PPC, SRM, LRM) would mean extra heat! I.E. 10% per extra weapon. It makes sense in my mind firing multiple weapons next to each other should be more than the sum of each individually!

LRM: LRM's are a great way to soften up opponents at the start of a match but there are alot of teams using MASSIVE boats and taggers (good strategy I use it as well). This is another instance in witch I don't feel that changing the damage is going to work. HOWEVER If only one teammate where to be able to lock onto one enemy at a time.....? That might help a lot.

AMS: Ok AMS is seriously under powered in my opinion. I think that making your ams work harder for YOU than friendly's would be an interesting idea. After all your the one smart enough to bring it! That would allow AMS to be useful but not be able to blanket your entire team with it! Maby a shotgun type design to take out more than one missile at a time?

Another thought was the more missiles headed your way the harder and faster AMS works. That would allow LRM 5 and 10 still be useful but still have protection from LRM 15 and 20!

These are just some ideas that I think would help benefit the overall balance of the game but HOPEFULLY not make such a difference to make a weapon OP or useless!

I also understand that a lot of this does not correspond with TT or most peoples opinions. I also have programming experience and realize some of these would be a code writers nightmare. We all have to make sacrifices for the greater good of the IS.

[Corbon Zackery]

Its not my job to solve your problems I not employed by your company.

[Stygian Steel]

just give MGs/flamers/lbx's the component destroyed bonus(for destroying stuff like heatsinks weaons e.t.c)
, i think you;d see alot of ppl using then

Edited by Stygian Steel, 19 March 2013 - 12:31 PM.

[Kell Morgan]

Sorry for the long post usually I don't post very much, but I have played this game since closed beta and strongly feel that there are some things that need modified.

Stygian Steel, on 19 March 2013 - 12:31 PM, said:

just give MGs/flamers/lbx's the component destroyed bonus(for destroying stuff like heatsinks weaons e.t.c)
, i think you;d see alot of ppl using then

They did buff them already with the crit system. I noticed a Large increase in heat sink destruction though

[Stygian Steel]

i meant the xp/cbill bonus

[Kell Morgan]

Corbon Zackery, on 19 March 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:

Its not my job to solve your problems I not employed by your company.

Honestly don't know what your talking about I don't work for PGI. but whining and posting useless thoughtless posts on the forums don't help anybody! PGI has done well in the past at looking at concerns and trying to work through them (slowly but atleast they try and test stuff instead of knee jerk hot patching).

If you have nothing constructive to add or discuss please go to a different topic

Stygian Steel, on 19 March 2013 - 12:37 PM, said:

i meant the xp/cbill bonus

It would be nice to have more incentives for support fighting I agree. hopefully we will see more of that down the road!

[PANZERBUNNY]

LRMS are damaging my back when they are hitting the front.

Lets start with that shall we?

Also LRMS need a slight damage reduction.

I'm all for LRM mayhem....this is just a tad out of whack.

With Cool Shot consumables people will be dissipating heat faster thereby speeding up the game, meaning faster death for everything.

[Shumabot]

Increase MG damage to .6 dps, lower the ammo per ton by half.
Reduce AC2 heat.
Reduce SRM damage by 1/3
Reduce LRM damage by 1/3
Reduce streak damage by 1/3 and greatly reduce its tracking ability
Increase large pulse damage by 1
Increase medium pulse damage by 1
Increase small pulse damage by .5
increase ER-PPC heat by 1
Increase LBX-AC10 damage to 13 if all pellets hit
Increase AC-10 projectile speed
Allow Flamers to stack and increase their damage to .8 dps
ECM Increases lock on time and scrambles radar but doesn't prevent lock ons at any distance.

Most major issues fixed, LRMs and streaks still need a fundamental redesign. Just gotta change spread sheet numbers. PGI doesn't care about balance.

[Kell Morgan]

You know i thought about damage reduction on LRM's but the problem I had with that is it would make LRM 5 and 10 practically useless. Thats why I disagree with an overall damage reduction. Now if LRM's and SRM's had some other countering woking against them like the increased heat I suggested or the AMS design that fights 15's and 20's harder than 5 and 10's I think it would go further in balancing the game than just an overall reduction!

[CheezPanther]

Is OP crazy? 4 Mg's can crit out an open stalkers torso in seconds... Now we have the 6 ballistic jagermech.. 2/3 of mg shots bypassing armor could stripout an entire mech in under 5 -10 seconds prolly not just an arm or side torso..

I've seen the video of how fast things get knocked out without armor.. right now armors the only thing preventing this from being overly imbalanced and abused....

ITS a BAD IDEA.. YOU SHOULD FEEL BAD..

[Kell Morgan]

"[color=#959595]ECM Increases lock on time and scrambles radar but doesn't prevent lock ons at any distance."[/color]
[color=#959595]I fully agree with this statement as well![/color]

[Terror Teddy]

You know, why cant we give MG's the magical ability to actually do something about armor - like DAMAGE IT.

[FrostCollar]

Kell Morgan, on 19 March 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

Machine guns: Are a lot better than before I love stripping heat sinks off an open mech
Honestly though we need to do something about that pesky armor! I was thinking about armor penetrating ability, I was thinking 1/2 - 1/3 of the shots going though armor and hitting internals directly! that would allow us do do a little internal damage and maybe take out a few heat sinks BEFORE all the armor is gone!

Machine guns have trouble with armor, yes. The real solution is to increase their damage and perhaps just discard the crit-seeking. This idea really doesn't work, however. Whenever machine guns would be in play every single system on an enemy mech would be at the mercy of the random crit chance. This could, dare I say it, make machine guns overpowered. MGs need to be a viable damage dealer. We've tried one gimmick ("crit seeking") and I think it's time to increase conventional damage instead of adding another.

Kell Morgan, on 19 March 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

BOATING: Ok, boating is an issue that not everyone agrees on. Well the problem is right now nerfing a weapon to prevent boating also hurts everyone else using 1 or 2. My thought was for every weapon above 2 of the same type (PPC, SRM, LRM) would mean extra heat! I.E. 10% per extra weapon. It makes sense in my mind firing multiple weapons next to each other should be more than the sum of each individually!

It's my opinion that boating weapons exacerbates weapon imbalances that are already present. Missiles are currently broken due to splash issues and that should be mostly solved with the April 2nd patch. Increasing heat for large alphas is a more reasonable idea than some I've seen, but I'm still not sold on the idea.

Kell Morgan, on 19 March 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

LRM: LRM's are a great way to soften up opponents at the start of a match but there are alot of teams using MASSIVE boats and taggers (good strategy I use it as well). This is another instance in witch I don't feel that changing the damage is going to work. HOWEVER If only one teammate where to be able to lock onto one enemy at a time.....? That might help a lot.

Let's not have this. Intentional griefing is bad enough, but allowing for unintentional griefing is far worse. This system would allow that little LRM carrying RVN-2X to innocently deny the Catapult next to it target locks simply because it locked on first. Again, LRMs are affected by splash issues.

Kell Morgan, on 19 March 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

AMS: Ok AMS is seriously under powered in my opinion. I think that making your ams work harder for YOU than friendly's would be an interesting idea. After all your the one smart enough to bring it! That would allow AMS to be useful but not be able to blanket your entire team with it! Maby a shotgun type design to take out more than one missile at a time? Another thought was the more missiles headed your way the harder and faster AMS works. That would allow LRM 5 and 10 still be useful but still have protection from LRM 15 and 20!

Making AMS more effective for you might be an interesting idea. However, I doubt we'll see a shotgun type design. Anyways, it's not really needed. The devs could simply up AMS damage per shot if they wished, and it would be more effective.

Overall, I'm not convinced but you do identify some current problem spots. Also, this probably belongs in the "Game Balance" or "Suggestions" subforums.

[Shumabot]

Kell Morgan, on 19 March 2013 - 12:47 PM, said:

You know i thought about damage reduction on LRM's but the problem I had with that is it would make LRM 5 and 10 practically useless. Thats why I disagree with an overall damage reduction. Now if LRM's and SRM's had some other countering woking against them like the increased heat I suggested or the AMS design that fights 15's and 20's harder than 5 and 10's I think it would go further in balancing the game than just an overall reduction!

The LRM5 has the highest dps per ton of anything in the game. What makes it useless is the fundamental problem with LRMs, Opportunity cost. Nothing you will do that doesn't fundamentally alter how LRMs function (which is needed) will make them worth taking.

[Kell Morgan]

yea I realized it should be in a different place after I posted it (very tired....) but I still stand by my idea that changing damage its not always the best solution. We have already tried many things for LRM's.

I think the internal griefing is a good point though. The only thing is once they remove splash damage whats going to happen to all of the damage the missiles are suppose to do? Im worried that too much damage is going to be applied to the CT especially with the new artmies setup.

I think upgrading the heat for alphas would make people think about there weapon setup a little more.

[Shumabot]

Kell Morgan, on 19 March 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

yea I realized it should be in a different place after I posted it (very tired....) but I still stand by my idea that changing damage its not always the best solution. We have already tried many things for LRM's.

I think the internal griefing is a good point though. The only thing is once they remove splash damage whats going to happen to all of the damage the missiles are suppose to do? Im worried that too much damage is going to be applied to the CT especially with the new artmies setup.

I think upgrading the heat for alphas would make people think about there weapon setup a little more.

Missiles, without splash damage, already do far more damage than they should. People have been boating missiles for as long as this game has existed, and it's never been because they do extra damage to commandos. An SRM has a similar range profile and use scenario to a medium laser and does 300% the damage per ton. The Streak does 200% and can't miss. The LRM does ~300-400% more per ton and can fire at 3 times the range. The damage on missile weapons is ludicrously over the top.

Upping the heat isn't a good solution, you'd have to increase the heat tremendously to put them in line with similar weapon systems and the gameplay interaction of LRMs is already broken to the point where the entire thing needs a massive overhaul.

Edited by Shumabot, 19 March 2013 - 01:10 PM.

[shihku7]

give MGs the ability to shoot down LRMs. That would be fun

[krolmir]

Before any further balancing can or should occur, bugs should be taken care of.

1) PPC hit detection, though better, still needs tuning.

2) SRM's, LRM's, & SSRM's have a splash damage bug and are doing rediculous amounts of damage to certain chassis from the 80ton & down weight range ; Stalker and Atlas are minimally affected by the Splash damage bug, if anything on these chassis it's almost functioning as intended. April 2 they are removing Splash damage altogether, pending a future fix.

3) LBX spread needs to be tightened ( a spread similar to the current SRMs with Artimis grouping, would be nice) so at its max range most of the pellets will hit the torso and arms. meaning your 10 pts. of damage is actually going to make it on target, just not all in one place.

4) Host State Rewind has yet to be applied to balistics and missles. Meaning that these weapons are still not doing as intended damage, especially to Fast Movers.

I'm all for balancing, but to many bugs need to be fixed. This will lead to inaccurate balancing, which once the bugs fixes and changes are implemented, will lead to yet another series of balancing patches. Do the job once and DO it right, that should be the mantra being preached to the devs.

[MustrumRidcully]

I could also live with humorous weapon balance, as long as it's balance.

[PANZERBUNNY]

FrostCollar, on 19 March 2013 - 12:51 PM, said:

Machine guns have trouble with armor, yes. The real solution is to increase their damage and perhaps just discard the crit-seeking. This idea really doesn't work, however. Whenever machine guns would be in play every single system on an enemy mech would be at the mercy of the random crit chance. This could, dare I say it, make machine guns overpowered. MGs need to be a viable damage dealer. We've tried one gimmick ("crit seeking") and I think it's time to increase conventional damage instead of adding another.


It's my opinion that boating weapons exacerbates weapon imbalances that are already present. Missiles are currently broken due to splash issues and that should be mostly solved with the April 2nd patch. Increasing heat for large alphas is a more reasonable idea than some I've seen, but I'm still not sold on the idea.


Let's not have this. Intentional griefing is bad enough, but allowing for unintentional griefing is far worse. This system would allow that little LRM carrying RVN-2X to innocently deny the Catapult next to it target locks simply because it locked on first. Again, LRMs are affected by splash issues.


Making AMS more effective for you might be an interesting idea. However, I doubt we'll see a shotgun type design. Anyways, it's not really needed. The devs could simply up AMS damage per shot if they wished, and it would be more effective.

Overall, I'm not convinced but you do identify some current problem spots. Also, this probably belongs in the "Game Balance" or "Suggestions" subforums.

More ammo per ton would help in protracted engagements and raise its level of usefulness.