228 replies to this topic

[Rushin Roulette]

hammerreborn, on 19 March 2013 - 09:04 PM, said:

Dear PGI. The Jenner seems to take too little cockpit damage as can be seen in this screenshot. Please fix this. NAOW!!!111ONEELEVEN

[Jakob Knight]

MWNoob, on 20 March 2013 - 02:08 AM, said:

i just did 1790 damage with 2xLRM20's and 2xLRM5's.

Well, if you were left alone the entire game, the other team didn't have any ECM, you had spotters doing their job, and were running a Stalker with nothing else but ammo to burn, why would this be unusual?

The problem with almost all the accounts is that the information is only how much damage total was done. It doesn't list the actual circumstances, nor how much time it took to do it, so a post like that above is really meaningless.

I'm all for fixing problems, and if the devs determine there is a bug, then they should fix it. However, using a bug to call for nerfs on LRMs is just another example of the Counterstrike people using any excuse to get LRMs removed as weapons (as they have been doing since day one). Certainly, the accounts of Heavy and Assault mechs being legged in one volley seem to point to something worth investigating.

However, a Commando complaining that a volley of LRMs can kill them is actually what should be the case. A light mech isn't supposed to be able to take that kind of damage, and two volleys would kill any light mech that was unlucky enough to get hit (or a Medium for that matter if it were more than 2xLRM20) in the original source material. This is in line with the original weapon system, so I'm not sure this is what should be used to justify claims.

People who don't want the discussion about balancing LRMs to be in this thread should read the title. The issue is about 'nerfing LRMs', not 'fix the bug with LRMs'. So, anything and everything dealing with LRMs and their use in the game is on the table with it. You don't want that discussion, then close the thread and make one about a bug with LRMs, not how they shouldn't be annoying people in the game by being dangerous.

[Anais Opal]

Linking my post as these issues are related

http://mwomercs.com/...m-all-missiles/

[Paeyvn]

Oh yeah, LRMs are definitely messed up right now. Just died in 2 LRM 15 shots from full armor/hp to dead. First one took off my armor on both legs and both arms as well as reduced all torso armor to red, second volley every single component on my mech was destroyed.

And when I say 2 LRM 15 shots, I don't mean 2 waves of boated LRM fire, I mean 30 missiles, aka an LRM 15 fired twice.

I was piloting a CDA-X5 with maxed armor.

There is no rolling to absorb impacts on these, it's "they hit and you die"

[Bident]

yea lrms online, same way when they first introduce artemis.
Now instead of DC brawler i have 2x20 lrm + lrm 10 having fun,but i canot said that to my targets.
Cheers PGI

[Clownwarlord]

You all are probably going to hat me, but I disagree with nerfing lrms. It is more like the Jager just needs to be adjusted for hit boxes. For example, I have a total of 35 tubes on my lrm boat (20 rack and 15 rack) I carry 8 tons of ammo with them. When I fire at a light it usually takes 3 to 5 racks to take him down (usually I am not the only one shooting at them as well). Which points to it being correct and that there needs no change. Now there has been a case (as in ONCE) I have fired one rack at a clean raven 3L and they hit right on the cockpit and killed it instantly. Which in truth that is correct 35 tubes right on the cockpit is a kill shot (almost an alpha which splat cats do to everyone all the time, one shot right to the core and pow I am down).

So again I state the only issue when it comes to lrms is the jager mech and its head box might need to be changed but all other mechs are basically correct, including the raven which was redesigned this past patch.

Also we all know how to kill an lrm boat. Get close ... you take out all the lrms with in 180 meters. So if you can't get that close sounds like a personal problem because every map has hills, buildings, and other cover for you to go behind (some can be shot over but not many due to the arc it still has to follow).

For your info I also play two centurians and both don't have lrms, so I do know what it is like to be hit by 4 lrms boats at the same time with out even getting a chance to fire back. This I blame on my own ignorance of not using cover and going out in the open.

Your mech is only as good as you are, good luck, and have fun.

Also one last tip, spread the damage out ... as in turn your body your core your head away from the lrms and take the shot in the side lossing maybe an arm and weapons but hey you are still alive and can cap and take more damage. Which you can also max out armour on your arms and that way you might still have them after taking a rack or two in the side leaving you with weapons and your core.

Some times it is not a game patch needed but your play style needs to change, and new mech ... newer ways of thinking on playing.

Edited by clownwarlord, 20 March 2013 - 03:24 AM.

[Paeyvn]

So for science, I set up my 4SP as a missile boat (only remotely missile happy mech I have, never been a big missile person).

2 LRM15s and a tag...this is my entire mech basically. I have one medium laser on there because I had to put it on to get it under 2.0 heat efficiency even with all the heat sinks stripped, but I never use it.

One shot a Raven 3L that I was tagging. Took a D-DC from 80% to 52% in one volley.

As someone who has never mounted an LRM launcher before today, my stats on my weapon page tell numbers solely since this patch.

411 Hits | 1247 Damage

Avg dmg per missile: 3.034

This is only after 3 rounds. I will continue further study for science.

Edited by Paeyvn, 20 March 2013 - 03:27 AM.

[BR0WN_H0RN3T]

This utterly ridiculous. Stupidity knows no bound. Is it my imagination or does every patch nowadays come with an auto-stupid feature?

[Vellinious]

LRM Warrior ftw

[Clownwarlord]

Paeyvn, on 20 March 2013 - 03:25 AM, said:

So for science, I set up my 4SP as a missile boat (only remotely missile happy mech I have, never been a big missile person).

2 LRM15s and a tag...this is my entire mech basically. I have one medium laser on there because I had to put it on to get it under 2.0 heat efficiency even with all the heat sinks stripped, but I never use it.

One shot a Raven 3L that I was tagging. Took a D-DC from 80% to 52% in one volley.

As someone who has never mounted an LRM launcher before today, my stats on my weapon page tell numbers solely since this patch.

411 Hits | 1247 Damage

Avg dmg per missile: 3.034

This is only after 3 rounds. I will continue further study for science.

Your science points out the splash damage issue which is in the works to be fixed next patch. Also 3.034 so times that by 30 for that being the ammount of tubes you have, and you get 91 for one rack of shooting and so yeah a light mech should die. Heck even if you take the standard damage of basiclly 2 and times that by 30 you get 60 damage so even this should one shot a light mech if they take all damage in core/head. But why would a light mech take this to the face? Common sense says be incover when you hear that alarm going off 'Missiles Incoming' which we all know it takes those missiles awhile to travel so you have time to get into cover. Which in turn all comes back to your play style would need to change. If you don't have time that means you are close to the boat and should get closer and get an easy kill. One medium laser to cover that 180m range isn't going to cut it ... and this is how most boats are setup (more tubes more ammo less defensive weapons).

Thanks for the data Paeyvn.

[Clownwarlord]

Sheraf, on 19 March 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

Got hit by LRM from 1000m away is .... impossible!!!!!

People complain about range, here it is.

1000 meters to 180 meters is effective range. If you are within 180 meters the missiles litterally bounce off you for no damage. Making lrm boats vunerable and easy kills for light mechs and other mechs who get that close. At 1000 meters you have snipers with ER PPCs and ACs (more importantly AC2s) which have ranges greatter then 1000 meters which can also core you if you let them.

Also last tip I give against lrms ... stay with the guy who has ECM it is an end all be all with streak and lrms. Same with cover if used properly.

[Clownwarlord]

Rykoo, on 19 March 2013 - 07:30 PM, said:

WHAT THE HOLY FUC***G SH*T IS GOING ON WITH THE 2+ DAMAGE PER MISSILE PGI?! YOU WANNA HOT FIX THIS NOW PLZ? Yes im talking in caps because this is bloody REDICULOUS! FIX IT FFS!

It was always 2 damage per missile ... and you give up alot of close range weapons and armour to carry more racks and more ammo. So get close, use cover, and spread the damage out amoung your body and not taking it all to the face or back.

[Accident]

Clown likes ez mode with LRMS, leave him alone.

-Accident

[KKRonkka]

USE COVER argument is invalid, as missiles are clearly broken. Ridiculous splash damages ---> hit to the front armour and your REAR armour is gone as well.

Any mech dealing absurd 1000+ damages per match are solely missile builds.

[Tallan]

I don't post often and tend to weather the ups and downs because it is beta. I've seen issues come and go with the game and, in general, the devs do a good job of trying to keep the game balanced. I don't even mind ECM too much, though I think it needs some balancing as well as it provides too much benefit for it's cost.

However, this last patch made something happen with LRMs that will cause me to take a break from the game until it is patched. I was just now running around in a Centurion 9-D from cover to cover taking an occasional hit and ended up getting legged from LRMs. Not only am I taking too much damage now, I'm taking it in areas that normally don't get it (in particular the legs). The amount of armor on the legs isn't the issue, and my speed should help me stay in cover, but it doesn't. I'm not the predator in these games - I'm the prey.

I tend to play scout or brawler builds so it has more of an impact on me than average, I suppose. However, I don't want to be one of the people who just then switches and says "I'll play LRMs too". I'd rather wait until it gets fixed. It will get fixed - remember when the angle of Artemis made one or two salvos of LRMs take the heads off mechs? They'll fix this too, but missing things like this in the testing process can break the game so they really should get caught more often.

I'll be watching for a hotfix and hoping it doesn't take 2+ weeks to fix. Until then, though, I'm unlikely to be in game. It's frustrating to play this way - not fun.

[Calem]

Guys, focus. We had 2 different issues, slash damage leading to too much damage and leg hitboxes resulting in not enough damage done - by missiles in general, not just LRMs. They fixed one, but not the other - of course that'll upset the balance.

The answer ist not reflexively yelling NUURF LRMS but instead hotpatching splash damage out - for all missiles. Then reevaluate as no-splash may well yield surprising results.

And maybe take a second look at the Jager's head hitbox.

[Hotthedd]

Jakob Knight, on 19 March 2013 - 07:53 PM, said:

I would like to see you TAG an enemy you have no line-of-sight on, or better yet, hold TAG on a unit through the entire launch-to-land process on a typical map. It doesn't work.

Further, I'd really like to see you TAG something in your CPLT-A1. I would very much like to see that.

I see. Your problem is not being able to kill things you cannot see, and cannot see you. Every OTHER weapon in the game requires this skill, however, so your point is moot. The A-1 as an LRM boat is a SUPPORT mech, btw.

[JudgeDeathCZ]

Serapth, on 19 March 2013 - 05:16 PM, said:

Nah something new is broken... LRMs are doing A LOT of damage... like people talking about 1800 damage rounds... levels of damage.

I never did 1,4k dmg in my CPTL-C4 2xLRM15+2xLRM5+2xMLas....untill today.

I play LRMs a LOT but this is like Artemis introduction patch back then...but its even worse bcuz in that times I didnt took down heavy mech in 1 volley bcuz there was not splash dmg....

[Ace Kaller]

Treckin, on 19 March 2013 - 07:44 PM, said:

I hate to say this but after I read that I decided you were either a troll, a moron, or both.

I guess someone had to take up the lower end of humanity's bell curve, might as well be you?

After reading Jakob's first post, it was obvious that he was either A) Trolling, or B ) Thought that LRM's worked correctly back during the days of the initial Artemis flight path bug.

Apparantly, he thinks that since you can stand behind a cliff and avoid LRM's, that you should be one-shotted by an LRM-5 when you are anywhere OTHER than behind a cliff.

[Gwaihir]

The issue right now is splash combined with missiles doing double the intended damage to heads. As such, it only takes 45 LRMS (Hm.. coincidentally the DDC can carry 45 LRMs...) to one shot your head.