31 replies to this topic

[Valdez Raptor]

FireSlade, on 21 March 2013 - 10:11 AM, said:

A rebalance to the Gauss Rifle isn't a bad idea. 3hp for a weapon that can easily be destroyed and does additional damage to the mech sucks. It's already one of the heaviest weapons and almost has the least amount of ammo. You're better off using a AC/20 than Gauss Rifle, if you have the crit space, and you can use that extra ton for another ton of ammo. I'd keep the damage the same add more impulse hit seeing it's kinetic weapon. Also I was under the impression that heat was a result of the reactor having to produce more energy not the weapon making heat, so shouldn't the Gauss Rifle produce heat? Since it uses capacitors to provide the energy to fire the round, it should have a slight and slow increase, in heat, as the caps recharge. But I guess if they had the heat work like it would in the cannon(books) then they'd have to redesign the weapons and heat system; like make all ballistic weapons produce no heat except the Gauss Rifle. They can keep missiles the same since the heat can be the cause of the jet exhaust and energy weapons will still produce the most heat. The other thing is if they use "the capacitors exploding" excuse to keep the damage that the exploding Gauss Rifle causes, then energy weapons should do the same since they would all use capacitors, hence the need for a cycle time.

Thank you for your words of wisdom. I agree there needs to be some more tweaking and rebalancing PGI loves to nerf hit things that got of hand instead of adjusting them. Having the weapon explode like you're carrying nitroglycerin isn't the answer.

[Tesunie]

Gauss rifles didn't normally explode when destroyed, but tend to have a nasty habit of providing neural feedback to the pilot if the capacitors where damaged fully charged or while charging. This neural feed back could cause vertigo, brain damage or even death. This is by the novels from my knowledge. In game, it does 20 points of damage because it has very large capacitors that store a lot of energy. (By novel standards, this energy could feed back into the neural systems of the mech and into the neurohelmet.)

As for projectile speed, a gauss rifle speeds it's ferronickle slug at such speeds they break the sound barrier. And one near a discharging rifle with no protection would burst their eardrums and bleed from their ears. I agree that the projectile speed should be increased for the rifle. Rest of the OPs points I don't agree with. Energy weapons damage dissipate faster than kinetic driven weapons, so kinetic weapons should have longer damage potential, with that damage quickly dropping the farther away it travels. AC2s and Gauss Rifles are weapons known for snipping targets on the horizon, so each should have enough range and velocity to reach that far. Neither are known to be brawling weapons, and rifle mechanics are known to be frail but deadly. Rifles are also known head hunting weapons too.

[Tesunie]

PS: I too feel 3 HP is a little low, but I think 5 would be reasonable. It is a complex and fragile weapon, which that fragility is its big counter to all its strengths. Half base health still gives that feeling. Of course I'm saying this with no information or stats on how the 3 health effects it in game. Actually, I haven't used a rifle yet, though I intend to soon.

[Deathlike]

FireSlade, on 21 March 2013 - 10:11 AM, said:

A rebalance to the Gauss Rifle isn't a bad idea. 3hp for a weapon that can easily be destroyed and does additional damage to the mech sucks. It's already one of the heaviest weapons and almost has the least amount of ammo. You're better off using a AC/20 than Gauss Rifle, if you have the crit space, and you can use that extra ton for another ton of ammo. I'd keep the damage the same add more impulse hit seeing it's kinetic weapon. Also I was under the impression that heat was a result of the reactor having to produce more energy not the weapon making heat, so shouldn't the Gauss Rifle produce heat? Since it uses capacitors to provide the energy to fire the round, it should have a slight and slow increase, in heat, as the caps recharge. But I guess if they had the heat work like it would in the cannon(books) then they'd have to redesign the weapons and heat system; like make all ballistic weapons produce no heat except the Gauss Rifle. They can keep missiles the same since the heat can be the cause of the jet exhaust and energy weapons will still produce the most heat. The other thing is if they use "the capacitors exploding" excuse to keep the damage that the exploding Gauss Rifle causes, then energy weapons should do the same since they would all use capacitors, hence the need for a cycle time.

Saying that you could use an AC20 is technically a viable option in some ways (400m with an AC20 will match its damage, but not projectile speed), but there are issues trying to do that w/o a STD engine and arm actuators that are in the way... it's not always practical. Gauss doesn't have those limitations.

Tesunie, on 21 March 2013 - 11:22 AM, said:

PS: I too feel 3 HP is a little low, but I think 5 would be reasonable. It is a complex and fragile weapon, which that fragility is its big counter to all its strengths. Half base health still gives that feeling. Of course I'm saying this with no information or stats on how the 3 health effects it in game. Actually, I haven't used a rifle yet, though I intend to soon.

3HP might be too low. ECM has the same HP. If you put ECM in your CT, as soon as your armor is exposed, it's literally one of the first things to go, despite the engine crits and built in 15HP. It may be better to put the ECM on the leg than the CT on light mechs (when you're legged, you're dead either way).

Edited by Deathlike, 21 March 2013 - 12:19 PM.

[Das Wudone]

i think the only thing the gauss rifle needs tweaking at is their muzzle velocity / bullet speed. other than that its fragility and explosive damage is ok to me. reason being that gauss users were rampant back in the day and it was often compared to ppcs and ac20s where gauss was king cos of same component hp and heat generation. the rebalancing on gauss made quite a number turn away from them but it is still being used by a fair large number of ppl which i think is right cos ppl invested in other weapons. if gauss didnt get rebalanced u would see gauss rifles on every mech thats capable of using ballistics and barely any ppc / ac5 / ac10 users.

[Valdez Raptor]

Das Wudone, on 21 March 2013 - 06:29 PM, said:

i think the only thing the gauss rifle needs tweaking at is their muzzle velocity / bullet speed. other than that its fragility and explosive damage is ok to me. reason being that gauss users were rampant back in the day and it was often compared to ppcs and ac20s where gauss was king cos of same component hp and heat generation. the rebalancing on gauss made quite a number turn away from them but it is still being used by a fair large number of ppl which i think is right cos ppl invested in other weapons. if gauss didnt get rebalanced u would see gauss rifles on every mech thats capable of using ballistics and barely any ppc / ac5 / ac10 users.

Gauss' were nerfed into oblivion due to Gausscat's nothing more than that. AC20 cat can do the same damn thing actually. Now I am nto saying return it to what it was, but UAC5's can easily do what a guass could before faster with more durability and same heat regeneration (and that's per UAC5 you can put a few on a mech I've seen them they are retardly fast shooting)

Anyway they needed to be retooled. What they did instead of actually balancing the weapon is to make the weapon a liability with it so fragile and having it explode for no apparent reason. It has no explosive componants to it. The capacitor logic won't work as someone pointed lasers don't explode, and most other weapons when they explode don't explode THIS BAD. Now have them more fragile fine, but 3 hp is ********. It should be 6 maybe 8 hp. It be far under what other weapons have but not someone sneezes on you and it breaks. And lower it's explosion damage. It shouldn't be the only weapon in the game that when it goes that it does more damage to you than the enemy.

Also for balancing have a small min range to it so it has more give and take to the weapon. There are ways to balance a weapon so it's not OP other than making it into a bomb. That's my major grief. Make changes that are balancing and make sense not becuase the developers are far too lazy to actually program a compentant balance to a weapon. Just look at how they balance LRM's. They are fine, OP for 2 days! Nerf to hell. several weeks later okay LRM's are almost back to what they were. OP for 1 Day due to bug! *nerf LRM's to hell again." PGI doesn't balance they NERF things to heck and back. They need to balance the weapon.

[Terror Teddy]

Deathlike, on 21 March 2013 - 09:36 AM, said:

Fortunately, noone in the right mind carries MGs to make that viable.

I do.

MG's ARE great as a crit assistant (when used on 50+ tonne mechs besides a heavier main gun) BUT COMPLETE **** for anything at 35 tonnes or less as a primary ballistic weapon.

They really need to take a look at that weapon because just comparing them (and the flamer) to other weapons between 0,5 to 1 tonne makes them useless when you dont have the space without gimping yourself horribly just to carry ONE AC/2.

And never carry more than 1 tonne of MG ammo as a crit seeker assistant for 2 MG's.

Edited by Terror Teddy, 24 March 2013 - 02:27 AM.

[Shaddock]

I agree I would like to see more balancing, and less nerfing from PGI. Gauss rifles were being abused before and needed changes, but to have less than a third of the damage of small lasers, machine guns, etc is a bit harsh. Up the HP to something like 8, half the explosive damage, change its heat to 1.5 or 2, slightly increase its cooldown, and make its max range shorter would be better options. As it stands now your just walking around with a bomb strapped to your mech waiting for somebody to light the fuse.

[Valdez Raptor]

Shaddock, on 25 March 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

I agree I would like to see more balancing, and less nerfing from PGI. Gauss rifles were being abused before and needed changes, but to have less than a third of the damage of small lasers, machine guns, etc is a bit harsh. Up the HP to something like 8, half the explosive damage, change its heat to 1.5 or 2, slightly increase its cooldown, and make its max range shorter would be better options. As it stands now your just walking around with a bomb strapped to your mech waiting for somebody to light the fuse.

I can't agree with this sentiment more. Fragility fine (though 3 is way too low) but the reasoning to have it explode as it does with so much damage is beyond retardedness. They were nerfed bad and becuase people were sour about the gauss cats they feel it should stay that way. Gauss rifles are icon weapon of Mechwarrior they needed to be treated better than they are. Balanced but not nerfed with little thought into HOW to balance them.

[Tesunie]

It only explodes for 20 damage. An ammo explosion does more damage than that. 20 damage shouldn't kill you unless you are almost dead anyway. Should the health of the weapon be higher? Probably. But I feel it rests well at the moment. First they need to finish the crit system so I don't lose all my weapons with one shot from an enemy. Getting tired of one hit taking out 2 missile systems, and a third system on another component (section).

Gauss could use a velocity increase more if you asked me. That about should be one of the fastest moving projectiles in the game. It's suppose to break the sound barrier after all. Health increase is another change it could possibly need as well, especially if it has a change to explode on you. (PS: case can be used to keep the gauss exploding damage contained in one torso just like with ammo.)

[Corvus Antaka]

C A S E

[Valdez Raptor]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 25 March 2013 - 09:45 PM, said:

C A S E

Yes I know all about a case, but that isn't my point is it? Was I asking how to prevent the weapon to be like a time bomb, and even with a case it still is. What I am refering to is how it's ******** they give the gauss so little HP and make it into a massive bomb instead of balancing a weapon correctly. PGI nerfs instead of balances way too often.