69 replies to this topic

[NinetyProof]

Imperial X, on 22 March 2013 - 09:07 AM, said:

You apparently don't know what your talking about.

And it would appear, that neither to you. you don't KNOW what you will or won't be able to do in 3rd person. You don't know how it will affect play at all.

You don't know how far out you can zoom.

You don't know if you can move the camera.

You don't know if the camera will even work well.

You don't know if your going to have the same accuracy, target lock time, target retention time, etc, etc in 3rd person view.

I think we can all agree that being "forced into" 3rd person because it's soooo much better would be a bad thing.

I would guess there will be trade off's ... such as accuracy or lock time or other things when running in 3rd person. I would further assume that the camera will not be allowed to zoom out to a birds eye view either.

I can think of a ton of ways to balance the OP of 3rd person with FPS so that it's a tactical decision.

[Solomon Ward]

They say i can queue with 1st person view people - so i am fine with it.

To each his own.

As long as i don´t have to wait several minutes because no one queues 1st person view.

[NinetyProof]

Rutok, on 22 March 2013 - 08:22 AM, said:

If noobs get their legs confused they could just add a toogle that would auto - center the legs to the torso direction (maybe after a delay).

They just added that ... you can now either center torso to legs, or legs to torso. No delay, outside of the actual time to for the legs to move.

[B E E L Z E B U B]

i dont agree, i think pgi did the study needed for this move.
i guess they arent making enough money, or maybe they arent getting enough new players. if this thing opens up the market and brings new players so be it...
id rather the game steered off its course and be popular with good funding and a big player base, than watching this game die slowly and pgi go bankrupt.
f2p games have to follow the money, they have no choice.
we should support pgi because obviously they arent doing so good.
im afraid they might cancel the game the way things are going.
the more success this game gets the better it will be for us in the long run..
you dont have to play third person, i know i wont, but having the option is the correct move.
the more options the better.
the more the game is versatile the bigger the player base will be the better the game will get.
i dont mind 3d person, i worry about games like this becoming p2w.
pgi - you guys are working hard but make sure you release the correct content at the correct time.. and more of it!!

[Aesthetech]

Third person view can eat a giant d... onut until I see that it offers 0 competitive advantage to using it. This should include:

1) The exact same field of view as first person (not sure how to pull that off, but go for it).

2) The parts of the screen that would be visually blocked by cockpit elements should likewise be visually obscured in 3rd person mode.

3) Going with the current plan of different queues for first person only, but I hate to see so much development wasted on such an unnecessary feature when there are so many current outstanding issues with the game.

[Dishevel]

malibu43, on 22 March 2013 - 09:26 AM, said:

To all of you saying "but the community doesn't want this!"

People need to read and comprehend what Bryan writes. He states in plain English that the folks that post on these forums (and vote in user made polls) represent a demographic that is a small portion of the total player base. So the rage threads and polls aren't the definitive source of information that people think they are. Tough cookies. Get over it. You aren't as important as you think.

3rd person isn't that big of a deal.

Cool.
So we are the minority. I get it.
So how are they hearing from the majority that are not communicating?
What do the silent masses who are currently playing in first person think about this?

[Kraven Kor]

3rd Person View divides community.

ECM divides community.

LRM's divides community.

New mechs divide community.

Ad infinitum.

Nothing they do is dividing the community; we are already a community divided.

At this point, PGI is the parent in the front seat threatening to separate us if we can't get along

Still, I don't want 3rd Person, I don't want Coolant Flush... *sigh*

[KuruptU4Fun]

One, if PGI thinks it will bring customers, they have every right to try and draw them in despite what we were told previously.
Two, in games where it's done correctly, the only thing a player using 3rd person (directly over the shoulder) view gets a better view of the sky while sacrificing sight when face to face with another mech.

This is a good example of 3rd person implemented well:


This is a bad example:

[NinetyProof]

FrupertApricot, on 22 March 2013 - 05:55 AM, said:

How are you going to run a game as a competitive venture when you are splitting the community with a feature only about 5 percent of the community seem to actually want?

Where do you come up with 5%? Oh wait ... you've talked to every single person in the player base.

Don't you realize that the vocal majority on the forums is really an extremely small percentage of the player base? So not only don't you have any *real* numbers on the exact percentage of the forum "visitors" that like / dislike this idea ... you have even less of idea of how the entire player base likes / dislikes the idea.

Sure you can kind of get a feel for the pattern of the vocal hardcore forum posters ... but you really have no idea how the playerbase at large *thinks* about the idea.

And of course you have absolutely NO IDEA how folks will like the finished implementation ... as that could be vastly different then peoples "pre-conceived, yet ignorant" idea of how this will be implemented.

So ... Straw Man Argument is made of Straw?

[malibu43]

Dishevel, on 22 March 2013 - 09:36 AM, said:

Cool. So we are the minority. I get it. So how are they hearing from the majority that are not communicating? What do the silent masses who are currently playing in first person think about this?

Bryan Ekman, on 21 March 2013 - 04:39 PM, said:

Honest answer. The analysis on those who voted, showed that the majority of votes came from a very narrow demographic of our player base. And while they represent some of core players, they did not necessarily represent the opinion of the general user base. The majority of our players never visit, post, or read the forum content, so the poll could be considered weighted in favour of a specific demographic. Since the majority of players who have an issue with 3rd person come generally from the core players, we elected to address this issue via this forum post to collect all of the concerns and ideas that this group faces or has with 3rd person.

Bryan Ekman, on 21 March 2013 - 05:03 PM, said:

We did an analysis of our data and found that players in general were having a hard time learning how to control their BattleMechs. We spent time studying their behaviours, observing, and then formulated a series of improvements. You have already seen some of them (new user controls). We did some market research, looked at the target demographic that we engaged initially but did not retain (played a few matches and left), and found that many players were not able to easily grasp the concepts of their `Mech, especially movement. 3rd person will help solve some of these issues, along with a new UI, training and testing grounds, and other features coming down the pipeline. Hope that answers your question.

Edited by malibu43, 22 March 2013 - 09:45 AM.

[KuruptU4Fun]

Kraven Kor, on 22 March 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

3rd Person View divides community.

Can't divide the community in half when the people calling for it are a minority and people are not being forced to go to that view. We're only required to play AGAINST people who choose to use it.

Kraven Kor, on 22 March 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

ECM divides community.

It's being reviewed for changes, or did you just fail to impart that when you decided to whine about it?

Kraven Kor, on 22 March 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

LRM's divides community.

Wow, you really have a single, uninformed point of view don't you. They've dropped it down to baseline so they can in turn build it back up without it being overpowered like it was before the hotfix patch.

Kraven Kor, on 22 March 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

New mechs divide community.

New mechs (or anything added to any MMO for that matter) always come with a FOTM timeframe, you'd have some understanding of that if you actually look at game development instead of stonewalling it to suit your arguments

Kraven Kor, on 22 March 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

Nothing they do is dividing the community; we are already a community divided.

At this point, PGI is the parent in the front seat threatening to separate us if we can't get along

Still, I don't want 3rd Person, I don't want Coolant Flush... *sigh*

Stop thinking this is the Bloods vs. the Crips or the Hatfields vs. the McCoy's dude

[KarrRadane]

Well I am happy to wait and see how it pans out and it adds another dimension to the game if it works as outlined and there's no issues re numbers or split community.

I will try all the variations to give it ago and report back.

No real fuss as far as I am concerned.

Edited by KarrRadane, 22 March 2013 - 09:51 AM.

[paladin yst]

Well ecm ruined the game, still in game. Hows that for community divided? nothing happened.

Anyway I`m extremely happen for 3rd person, been waiting for it since close beta. No more boring light strafing with ecm

[Kraven Kor]

KuruptU4Fun, on 22 March 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

Can't divide the community in half when the people calling for it are a minority and people are not being forced to go to that view. We're only required to play AGAINST people who choose to use it.


It's being reviewed for changes, or did you just fail to impart that when you decided to whine about it?


Wow, you really have a single, uninformed point of view don't you. They've dropped it down to baseline so they can in turn build it back up without it being overpowered like it was before the hotfix patch.



New mechs (or anything added to any MMO for that matter) always come with a FOTM timeframe, you'd have some understanding of that if you actually look at game development instead of stonewalling it to suit your arguments



Stop thinking this is the Bloods vs. the Crips or the Hatfields vs. the McCoy's dude

The point of my post... I think you missed it... in a hilariously ironic and slightly ****-ish way, at that.

But that's OK.

I hardly matter.

Edited by Kraven Kor, 22 March 2013 - 11:06 AM.

[KuruptU4Fun]

Kraven Kor, on 22 March 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

The point of my post... I think you missed it... in a hilariously ironic and slightly ****-ish way, at that.

But that's OK.

I hardly matter.

Does anyone use [/sarcasm] anymore?

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Gregory Owen, on 22 March 2013 - 06:21 AM, said:

i completely agree also,

http://mwomercs.com/...12#entry2104012

this thread makes it pretty clear, Brian does not care what the community wants and still thinks 3rd person should be added even at the cost of dividing the player base.

he completely dismissed the poll, that when i saw had 900+ votes against 3rd person and under 100 for it.

he also told us that the people posting here essentially dont matter to them comparend to people who arent currently giving them money and playing the game.

[YouMadQuiaff]

people who want 3rd person view also think that having consumables will somehow 'enhance' the gameplay of MWO.

[Pater Mors]

I don't really want to see 3rd person added to the game, but as long as 3rd person players have zero advantages over 1st person then I don't really care that much.

[PANZERBUNNY]

Gregory Owen, on 22 March 2013 - 06:21 AM, said:

i completely agree also,

http://mwomercs.com/...12#entry2104012

this thread makes it pretty clear, Brian does not care what the community wants and still thinks 3rd person should be added even at the cost of dividing the player base.

he completely dismissed the poll, that when i saw had 900+ votes against 3rd person and under 100 for it.

Pride and arrogance in the face of overwhelming odds. I wonder what that feels like...

Pater Mors, on 22 March 2013 - 11:27 AM, said:

I don't really want to see 3rd person added to the game, but as long as 3rd person players have zero advantages over 1st person then I don't really care that much.

You mean like being able to see around them, over hills and around corners?

Those kind of advantages?

[von Pilsner]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 March 2013 - 11:20 AM, said:

he also told us that the people posting here essentially dont matter to them comparend to people who arent currently giving them money and playing the game.

I think it is more impactful to read the drama in order... This is one if the descriptions that really sold me on the gameplay (from the MWO site).



and we have been repeatedly told:


and



and


Which led to this...


So I guess it feels pretty bait-and-switch of you to push 3pv on the game at this point, thankfully nobody is actually working on the 3pv project...


Or maybe it gets clarified...


I hope this works out...

Edited by von Pilsner, 22 March 2013 - 11:34 AM.