327 replies to this topic

[Mal]

Jackson Jax Teller, on 24 March 2013 - 07:16 PM, said:

the vocal minority are the beta testers in this game. The silent majority are the ones who dont play it. Yeah we should totally develop the game for them not the players.

The vocal minority, are NOT all the beta testers in this game though. There are quite a few players who do not ever come to these forums... neither your, nor Teralitha, should presume you speak for them.

[DrSecretStache]

Teralitha, on 24 March 2013 - 07:19 PM, said:

If you are able to play a different game mode, then you have no reason to care or debate the issue.



hey, this topic is for TDM, if you want to promote another mode, go start your own topic about it.

Not true, not if someone would like to randomize it with "any." Which I'm guessing is basically most new players.

If they could find a way to have DM not go down to light vs assault hiding match, then I suppose so. But of course, that would require different mechanics--you aren't going to fix that problem on a map like Tourmaline.

KotH would be a much better solution. Same amount of carnage, basically, except everyone is going for the same spot.

[Najonii]

I have always hated games that broke down to who can kill who first. If they added a TDM mode it would be no different than MW4, where the game is won by whoever brings the most/biggest guns. I prefer a game where even a Spider with only a ML and a MG can have a viable combat role. I like the added challenge of having objectives, that you often need to split your force and not just having everything break down into a gigantic melee in the center of the map.

Make my vote a No! I will be playing other modes and i still care!

[Mal]

Marj, on 24 March 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

Do you want to vote No because it will further split the player base and is therefore bad? I think a simple change like removing the bases would bring more people to 8 mans so it wouldn't be an issue. I rarely have to wait for a game when pugging, so there seems to be enough people to support a third mode. Do you have trouble getting matches in your timezone?

I want to vote no, because adding an additional game mode, runs the risk of further segregating the player base.

[Cubivorre]

Maybe try changing your poll to Yes or No, then I'll vote..

[Teralitha]

Zoughtbaj, on 24 March 2013 - 07:22 PM, said:

Not true, not if someone would like to randomize it with "any." Which I'm guessing is basically most new players.

If they could find a way to have DM not go down to light vs assault hiding match, then I suppose so. But of course, that would require different mechanics--you aren't going to fix that problem on a map like Tourmaline.

KotH would be a much better solution. Same amount of carnage, basically, except everyone is going for the same spot.

Please stick to the topic. koth is nothing like TDM. If you want to have a discussion about koth, pls start your own topic.

[Teralitha]

Najonii, on 24 March 2013 - 07:22 PM, said:

I have always hated games that broke down to who can kill who first. If they added a TDM mode it would be no different than MW4, where the game is won by whoever brings the most/biggest guns. I prefer a game where even a Spider with only a ML and a MG can have a viable combat role. I like the added challenge of having objectives, that you often need to split your force and not just having everything break down into a gigantic melee in the center of the map.

Make my vote a No! I will be playing other modes and i still care!

Pointless post. Any mech is still viable in TDM. Added objectives are no challenge and only distract you from the real purpose of driving a mech. The melee in the center of the map is the result of tactless players who dont use strategy, and such players would horribly lose every game to those who do. The size of the guns have no bearing.

[DrSecretStache]

Teralitha, on 24 March 2013 - 07:27 PM, said:

Please stick to the topic. koth is nothing like TDM. If you want to have a discussion about koth, pls start your own topic.

How, in this setting, would it not be anything like TDM? I'm trying to point out how there are better things than TDM for this game. KotH is one of them.

So how would you solve the light v assault problem? It's sort of paramount to whether or not TDM should be included.

[Oy of MidWorld]

Duncan Fisher, on 24 March 2013 - 05:57 PM, said:

It's said every time this thread comes up: when you have slow, ponderous robots and relatively large maps, you need another win condition other than "Destroy all mechs." That's not even accounting for the zero-motivation-to-move-forward meta you would get with a competitive TDM. Sure, they could change the objective mechanics, maybe prevent you from capping for the first 5 minutes or something, but if you take a moment to really think, you will realize that pure deathmatch style games do not fit in here.

Sorry Duncan, you have NO idea what you're talking about. Know what ****** me off most? You guys just won't stop to argue against something about half the playerbase wants. Why the **** would you do this, it'd take zero effort to implement, and you'd never have to play it. Why can't you just ****** leave these threads alone cast your vote and be gone. Nobody asked for your opinions on whether or not it'd work, or anything else, except if you'd like to play it.

I'm getting tired of these threads and those sissy *** reasons why we should not have something that you don't like.

Najonii, on 24 March 2013 - 07:22 PM, said:

Make my vote a No! I will be playing other modes and i still care!

And you have no business caring, unless you want to tell us we can't have it because you like to force us into playing what you like. In that case, **** you.

"I don't care" instead of "no" is exactly the right way to ask.

Edited by Oy of MidWorld, 24 March 2013 - 07:56 PM.

[Klaus]

Where is the "no" option?

[0X2A]

A simple team A attacks while Team B defends an objective would be better than TDM... I mean like think of BF:BC2 rush mode, just instead of dying like madmen you would have to say "Okay this objective is not worth saving, fall back"

[Mal]

Jackson Jax Teller, on 24 March 2013 - 07:39 PM, said:

lol dev alt detected. Bryan, that you?

So, someone who disagrees with you (or the rest of the 'TDM is the BESTSSSSZZZZ crowd), or might actually agree with the Devs... could only be working for PGI? Such amazing Logic!

[darkfall13]

Oy of MidWorld, on 24 March 2013 - 07:35 PM, said:

Sorry Duncan, you have NO idea what you're talking about. Know what ****** me off most? You guys just won't stop to argue against something about half the playerbase wants. Why the **** would you do this, it'd take zero effort to implement, and you'd never have to play it. Why can't you just ****** leave these threads alone cast your vote and be gone. Nobody asked for your opinions on wheather or not it'd work, or anything but if you'd like to play it.

I'm getting tired of these threads and those sissy *** reasons why we should not have something that you don't like.

Don't you DARE take that one of voice with THE Duncan Fisher

[Oy of MidWorld]

Jackson Jax Teller, on 24 March 2013 - 07:53 PM, said:

You remember the faces of your fathers, Oy of Midworld

Thankee Sai. I get that a lot lately. Usually i'm more polite, but after threads after threads of dumb unasked reasons why TDM supposedly sucks, when in my experience it doesn't, i'm simply ******.

Edited by Oy of MidWorld, 24 March 2013 - 08:02 PM.

[Teralitha]

Zoughtbaj, on 24 March 2013 - 07:31 PM, said:

How, in this setting, would it not be anything like TDM? I'm trying to point out how there are better things than TDM for this game. KotH is one of them.

So how would you solve the light v assault problem? It's sort of paramount to whether or not TDM should be included.

I really dont see it as a problem. MW4 league matches were 60 minutes long, and when a last enemy mech ran and hid somewhere, we searched for them. Its not like the maps were infinite. Plus the league had rules in place for this sort of thing. Sometimes we simply offered the last enemy the option to retreat and save their mech so we could end the match and start the next. Thats really why they ran and hid, was to save the mech. But if they ran and hid with the intention of waiting out the clock, refusing to fight, we could report them to the league, and those players could be banned from it. In public servers, there was a voting option to end matches for situations like this... but they were really unheard of, as there was no reason to hide. There were no stats to protect. Only league play had stats and assets to worry about, and like I said, the league play had rules in place for it.

So really... if the pug play had no stats currently, no one would ever run and hide. Right?

Edited by Teralitha, 24 March 2013 - 08:09 PM.

[Fiona Marshe]

Vote is invalid as there isn't a strait "NO" option.

Assault *is* Team Death Match, with a game-ending option if your opponents hide to avoid waiting out the clock.

[Teralitha]

Fiona Marshe, on 25 March 2013 - 02:54 AM, said:

Assault *is* Team Death Match, with a game-ending option if your opponents hide to avoid waiting out the clock.

Wrong. If Assault was TDM, then why would people be asking for it? Derp.. D derp.... d... derp........

[Teralitha]

Jackson Jax Teller, on 24 March 2013 - 08:14 PM, said:

then again hiding already happens. What, noone's seen a guy running of into the corner and shutting down? an the rest of the ppl in the game not wanting to cap cause you get less money?

Well if they see them running to hide, then its its pretty easy to find and kill them since you see where they went.

One match in league play I will describe had a situation similar to the fast light vs slower, heavier mech scenario.

It was a city map, and the match came down to me in a slow infighting bushwacker vs a fast clan light (Kit Fox) with CER Large lasers.

My CT was critical, the light was relatively undamaged. But my opponant didnt know about my damage... I think...

My options were pretty limited and defeat seemed inevitable. The light mech could run away and keep range and kill me. Now league rules stated that both teams must seek a resolution to a match through combat. ie, no running and hiding for the purpose of waiting out the clock.

I saw the enemy on radar and they saw me, but buildings were between us and all around us. The kit fox carried ECM so I could not see him on radar beyond 500 meters, but he could see me for 1000 meters. I had to take away his range advantage somehow if I was going to win this... I began switching to passive radar mode, on and off at odd intervals when the distance between us was roughly 500m to give him the illusion that I was operating in passive radar in the attempt to either get closer to him undetected enough to get in my weapon range or to make him think I was trying to flee in passive radar mode, because if I disappeared off his radar at less than aprox 500m he would know I was shutdown rather than moving. But the real purpose was to get him to run far enough away so that I could find a little hidey hole in the buildings and shut down without him thinking I shut down but that I was simply running away from him in passive radar, and he would have to come in my last known direction in order to pick me up on his radar again.

It was a gamble for me. Because its possible he would never pass by that way at all. But just as I had thought, he did indeed come in my direction to search for me on his radar. I turned up the volume so I could hear his stompy little feet approaching my hidey hole. When I heard him get close enough I powered up and ran to catch him. He was taken by surprise and immediately attempted to make a run for it to get range but I shot off his leg preventing his escape. He could still have won had he gotten a direct hit on my exposed center torso. But he failed to do so and I blew off his other leg, and ended the match.

These are the kind of competitive matches I used to love. So Intense and exhilerating, and such a deep level of thought process involved in outwitting your opponant. Time limit? Who the hell cares about a time limit when you have matches like this. Everyone on both teams was on the edge of their seats listening and waiting to see how it would end.

This is just a sample of the kind of high end competitive play that is missing from MWO Can this happen in MWO? technically its possible, but in that situation players generally just go to a base for capping rather than risk their stats being damaged.

The only stats we should be able to see, and the only one that really matters is Win/Loss. Only the other stats like KDR cause players to run and hide instead of fighting.

Edited by Teralitha, 25 March 2013 - 09:17 AM.

[Werewolf486 ScorpS]

If they'd just remove Cap on ASSAULT then we'd have TDM. Also it would stop the annoyance of people who'd rather cap then play the mode as most of us intend to play it, fight to the death in Team Death Match.

[Deathlike]

I don't think I'd enjoy TDM that much more than Assault (Conquest is more interesting IMO).

However, the only legit way (I think) of making TDM not devolve into "hunt the running away light mech" fest is to give the last mech on the field a reason to fight it out instead of running away.

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__2124004

Edited by Deathlike, 25 March 2013 - 07:37 AM.