65 replies to this topic

[Yokaiko]

yashmack, on 30 March 2013 - 02:07 AM, said:

CASE keeps the ammo explosion contained, it wont blow up the remaining ammo and it does limited damage to internals with CASE
that is my experience with it anyway...

The ammo still damages the internal structure, which means dead mech 9/10 times if you have ammo in a sidetorso, no torso the engine looses 3 crits...done.

CASE is a waste of tonnage/crit slots with an XL. You did it in tabletop to save the pilot, the mech was here nor there. Because if you have 100 point of AC20 ammo go up in a side torso, it would cascade LT>CT/head and kill the pilot.

[B E E L Z E B U B]

Roughneck45, on 30 March 2013 - 04:39 AM, said:

You have a low assault ELO and have been lucky with your teammates? Even you said you are only doing 250-300 damage.

good ELO, i hope , i have 3 mastered stalkers - i know it doesnt mean its good but those are killing machines espcially the 3F with 2 ERPPC, 1 SRM4 and 3 SRM6.

Edited by Karma Police, 30 March 2013 - 04:52 AM.

[Roughneck45]

Karma Police, on 30 March 2013 - 04:51 AM, said:

good ELO , have 3 mastered stalkers.

Which has nothing to do with whether your ELO is good or bad...

Edited by Roughneck45, 30 March 2013 - 04:53 AM.

[B E E L Z E B U B]

DerSpecht, on 30 March 2013 - 04:36 AM, said:

I do the same with my hunchback and have an average of 500 dmg per game.

you dont provide ECM to everyone

[Yokaiko]

Roughneck45, on 30 March 2013 - 04:39 AM, said:

You have a low assault ELO and have been lucky with your teammates? Even you said you are only doing 250-300 damage.

When you are running with good teamates I've seen it where the 8th guy had 210 damage and the top scorer had 420. Hell, I got 4 legit kills tonight with 240 damage 3 headshots and an atlas I caught from behind. Another one where I was in a Jenner -F against a team with 5 cicadas, 4 kills 180 damage.

The rest was random shooting at **** passing by.

[jeffsw6]

DerSpecht, on 30 March 2013 - 03:56 AM, said:

What i absolutely hate are single LRM assault supporters that stay back and fling LRM while the real supporters try to duke it out with the enemy team on their own.

Indeed, this is stupid. A salvo of 20 LRMs doesn't do much good these days. I tried 3xLRM15 a few matches since the missile patch, and even that does not do very much damage to enemies. So I use the 1 launcher I have to harass enemy snipers, and to encourage mechs to run inside of my LRM range, making my LPLs more effective. If nothing else, it keeps enemies on their toes. They do not want to stand in the open and risk LRM hits, so they have less opportunities to shoot my team.

I am trying to figure out if there is any reason I should bother with Artemis on this build. I might like 2xAC2 instead of the 1xUAC5 but I am not sure if I can make it fit. I have decided that I need at least some LRMs though, because it is a good way to deal with snipers / stand-off opponents who won't come close enough for me to kill them.

I played a bunch of rounds in my Fang with a Gauss Rifle. I still think it is massively OP and ammo is setup to encourage using it wrong. It's ********.

Karma Police, on 30 March 2013 - 04:33 AM, said:

i say i am a support mech because i never charge unless my whole team does, neither do i lead, i just see where the flock is going and i go too. now. 300 damage + 1 or maybe 2 kills per match + TAGing ECM targets + taking damage and drawing attention + countering light ecm and providing good ecm cover = good support mech.

I think the best front-men are ECM lights. Yes, they are squishy, but they draw enemies out who want to shoot their fragile legs, and the ECM disruption means enemies are unlikely to be able to fire missiles at your team. I have seen opposing teams do this many times, and it seems very effective.

[DerSpecht]

Karma Police, on 30 March 2013 - 04:55 AM, said:

you dont provide ECM to everyone

Same goes for a long range support assault harassing the enemy fro afar. The brawlers dont get any ECM as well.

[Yokaiko]

DerSpecht, on 30 March 2013 - 05:32 AM, said:

Same goes for a long range support assault harassing the enemy fro afar. The brawlers dont get any ECM as well.

Welcome to why I detest D-DC "support" builds.

Want a support atlas, drive an RS and don't tease me.

Edited by Yokaiko, 30 March 2013 - 05:40 AM.

[Goldhawk]

Karma Police, on 30 March 2013 - 12:38 AM, said:

i think this is my best support atlas build. 90% of the time that i will play this build my team will win and ill do about 250-300 damage, just because i never get to the targets in time to do more damge.

Dude that damage rate is super low. I usually do that much damage in my Spider. For an assault mech you should be racking up at least double that, but if you are a careful mechwarrior, you are probably avoiding shots, thus, if it works well for you. Great! Sincerely, thank you for sharing your interesting build.

[Flyby215]

I like it! You're putting a unique variety of weapons on a mech to suit your desired playstyle, something that tends to be lost on players in the upper elo brackets. Contrary to popular belief, you don't need a definitive cookie-cutter build to have fun. Personally I would want to try your design, but sadly I do not yet own an Atlas (my assault preference is the Stalker).

Let me ask you something though, how often do you lose your arms or legs in a match? I built your mech in an online mechlab and noticed that if you were to take your legs down to 75 points of armour each (still more armour than an individual side torso) and each arm down to 58 points (who shoots at an Atlas' arms anyway?) you could upgrade your engine to a 325XL and add an additional heat sink.

[Artgathan]

While you may do well with this build, it's really not that great. My Centurion has 1 less point of firepower and a higher DPS, while being able to outmaneuver something as sluggish as an Atlas with a 320 engine (also, you have extra tonnage, why not upgrade the engine?). I routinely do 500-600 damage in my Centurion. It's half the tonnage.

The problem with the build is that you can't really counter faster lights. Sure, you claim you can, but I know that any decent light pilot will stay at your back where you can't target them - and with a 320 engine you can't turn fast enough to catch them. I'm reasonably confident I could do it in my 50-ton mech.

Taking single-click potshots with an AC/2 is also a waste of their potential. If you're not going to go full-auto with them you're not making use of their high DPS.

The ERPPC + AC/2 combo is inferior to other builds that provide direct fire support (such as the Cataphracts with Gauss Rifles and 2 ERPPCs). An LRM20 is not particularly threatening in the game right now either, especially if someone has AMS. 2 X SSRM may be threatening to lights, but as mentioned, they'll just go where you can't target them.

I'd recommend a bigger engine to start with.

[jeffsw6]

Artgathan, on 30 March 2013 - 06:17 AM, said:

The problem with the build is that you can't really counter faster lights.

I do pretty well against lights in my XL350 Atlas. Commandos nearly always kill me (eventually) but all the other lights, if it's 1v1, it definitely comes down to my skill+luck against his skill+luck. Throw in a teammate on either side and the outcome is more predictable.

What angers me the most about fighting lights is that I can NEVER seem to hit them with guns. I can't wait for lag to be accounted for in gun fire. I think it will really change the game for lights again, because a lot more fire should be landing on them. Maybe that won't be a good thing (overall) but I would sure like if my guns could actually shoot a light mech.

Edited by jeffsw6, 30 March 2013 - 06:23 AM.

[Vahnn]

If you said you were doing 800 damage, that would be great. 500+ and it would be okay. But 300 or less? That's abysmal.

Since you say it's a long-range support build, why even bother with the SSRM? drop those and upgrade those AC/2 to UAC/5 for 6 extra tons (which you'll have because you don't even hit the 98 ton mark). This is the very least you could do to improve this build.

If you MUST stick with that crazy XL Engine, as everyone has said before me, CASE is 100% useless and literally doing absolutely nothing but taking up half a ton and a critical slot.

One other thing: When I use a TAG module, I set it to Weapon Group 2, which is my Right Mouse Button. my other groups are LMB, MMB, and Mouse 4 (thumb button), plus a couple number keys. This allows you to consistently and constantly use your TAG without hindering your aim or your ability to fire your other weapon groups.

[Artgathan]

jeffsw6, on 30 March 2013 - 06:22 AM, said:

I do pretty well against lights in my XL350 Atlas. Commandos nearly always kill me (eventually) but all the other lights, if it's 1v1, it definitely comes down to my skill+luck against his skill+luck. Throw in a teammate on either side and the outcome is more predictable.

What angers me the most about fighting lights is that I can NEVER seem to hit them with guns. I can't wait for lag to be accounted for in gun fire. I think it will really change the game for lights again, because a lot more fire should be landing on them. Maybe that won't be a good thing (overall) but I would sure like if my guns could actually shoot a light mech.

Assaults aren't really meant to fight lights: Assault mechs are meant to destroy medium / heavy / assault mechs. Think of them like a heavy tank destroyer from WWII - you wouldn't use them to destroy an armored car (you could, but if the car's moving at speed you probably won't hit it)

[jeffsw6]

How do you do 800dmg consistently? Make a group of 7 noobs and 1 epic player and hope for matches against other noobs?

If I do 800dmg in my Atlas it was luck or a LOSS where I tried and failed to carry my team. If I win, I usually have 300 - 500, and so do others on my team.

[TorturedPaladin]

I run an Atlas D-DC with 2 PPC's, AC/20(4tons of Ammo), and 3 SSRM's(1 ton ammo), I also try to stay "mid" range (approx 300~500m from targetsat onset) to allow a bublle that benefits most of my team, and keeps me from getting wolf-packed by lights. This is my first Assault, so I know I'm currently in ez-mode ELO right now, but averaging 700dmg is no problem. Chainfiring the PPC's so I can manage the heat output and lockout an ECM if necessary.

My Logic for a "Support Atlas" isn't sitting in the back with the light, auxilary tools that allow others to better target/do more damage, but being on/near the frontline denying the other team easy kills or the use of their ECM.

The main issue I'm running into is retraining myself to ignore lights unless they're the only target available.

[Rippthrough]

jeffsw6, on 30 March 2013 - 06:42 AM, said:

How do you do 800dmg consistently? Make a group of 7 noobs and 1 epic player and hope for matches against other noobs?

If I do 800dmg in my Atlas it was luck or a LOSS where I tried and failed to carry my team. If I win, I usually have 300 - 500, and so do others on my team.

I hit that fairly often in a jenner, hell, a few games per week in a spider too. Okay, you have to try like hell and have a bit of luck, but unless I was in an 8-man premade I'd be crying at 300-400 damage in a D-DC.

Edited by Rippthrough, 30 March 2013 - 07:38 AM.

[lordlazarus]

Quote

for instance imagine your reaction being surprised by a jenner, vs an atlas.

i have been surprised by a jenner imagine his surprise when my twin lbx10 3 srm6 build vaporised him

[Yokaiko]

lordlazarus, on 30 March 2013 - 07:47 AM, said:

i have been surprised by a jenner imagine his surprise when my twin lbx10 3 srm6 build vaporised him

LB10X lol

compared to an AC20 or gauss with someone that can shoot that is child's play

[lordlazarus]

Quote

compared to an AC20 or gauss with someone that can shoot that is child's play

i avoid gauss or ac20's because they tend to be delicate and destroyed easily . how many times have you had your glass hammers detonate with 90 % of your ammo remaining . gauss cannons explode far to readily for my liking as for your ac 20 builds , that will get you focused fired and alpha struck in a heart beat . i know the lb10 x is considered not worth the tonnage but 1 alpha strike with twin lbx and 3 srm 6 is going to ruin any light mechs days .. this coupled with some laser strikes to the legs and .. yeah im done arguing with it .