34 replies to this topic

[Rhent]

After reading the patch notes and seeing how LRM's are staying woefully below any kind of baseline damage, LRM's needs to be addressed.

Lets do the math:
Table Top: LRM = 1 damage
MWO: LRM = .7 damage

Table Top Armor: 1pt
MWO Armor: 2 pt

LRM's in MWO online does 0.35 damage of Table top. Now, lets factor in AMS, ECM, warnings to dodge, and abundant cover leads to a 33% hit rate. So, LRM's do a base damage of .35 * 33% hit rate means you do 0.12 damage in TT. LRM's are effectively useless.

Lets change LRM's seeing as PGI has completely fookered them over. Lets leave the damage at .7 but allow us to target our own teams and heal their armor. Why? Because healing 0.12 heal per missile would yield 2.4 armor heal in TT (4.8 in MWO).

I'm being tongue and cheek with this review of how bad PGI has turned LRM's. But frankly, PGI has earned it. I've never played a MWO game that was a brawling sewer until this abortion. Kudo's PGI, you made the first version of the Mechwarrior franchise that I hate.

[Demos]

Your math is wrong.
First, not all shots in TT hits.
Second, off all hits, in TT only 60% (at average) of the salvo actually hits the mech.
Third, comparision of armor TT and armor MWO sucks, as other weapons are also affected by the higher armor values (I admit, you can aim, but nevertheless missiles don't also spread over the mech like in TT).

Increase flight speed of missiles to increase the number of hits and allow lock-on on ECM protected targets and missiles will be fine.

Edited by Demos, 02 April 2013 - 10:44 AM.

[Trauglodyte]

Rhent, on 02 April 2013 - 10:25 AM, said:

After reading the patch notes and seeing how LRM's are staying woefully below any kind of baseline damage, LRM's needs to be addressed.

Lets do the math:
Table Top: LRM = 1 damage
MWO: LRM = .7 damage

Table Top Armor: 1pt
MWO Armor: 2 pt

LRM's in MWO online does 0.35 damage of Table top. Now, lets factor in AMS, ECM, warnings to dodge, and abundant cover leads to a 33% hit rate. So, LRM's do a base damage of .35 * 33% hit rate means you do 0.12 damage in TT. LRM's are effectively useless.

Lets change LRM's seeing as PGI has completely fookered them over. Lets leave the damage at .7 but allow us to target our own teams and heal their armor. Why? Because healing 0.12 heal per missile would yield 2.4 armor heal in TT (4.8 in MWO).

I'm being tongue and cheek with this review of how bad PGI has turned LRM's. But frankly, PGI has earned it. I've never played a MWO game that was a brawling sewer until this abortion. Kudo's PGI, you made the first version of the Mechwarrior franchise that I hate.

You're further wrong in the sense that it is 0.7 damage to the initial location plus another 0.35 splash damage to any location within range of the blast (1.4m). So, missiles are still doing 1.05 total damage which puts them at TT values. This will get fixed once they do away with splash and ratchet up the damage to where it should be - 1.0 damage per hit.

If you want to fix missiles, you need to increase the velocity to 200m/s instead of the current 100m/s (SRMs should go to 400m/s instead of the current 300m/s).

[Tetatae Squawkins]

Rhent, on 02 April 2013 - 10:25 AM, said:

After reading the patch notes and seeing how LRM's are staying woefully below any kind of baseline damage, LRM's needs to be addressed.

Lets do the math:
Table Top: LRM = 1 damage
MWO: LRM = .7 damage

Table Top Armor: 1pt
MWO Armor: 2 pt

LRM's in MWO online does 0.35 damage of Table top. Now, lets factor in AMS, ECM, warnings to dodge, and abundant cover leads to a 33% hit rate. So, LRM's do a base damage of .35 * 33% hit rate means you do 0.12 damage in TT. LRM's are effectively useless.

You completely ignore the fact that LRMs in MWO behave very differently than they do in TT.

Yet another example of why TT values should never be the basis for any argument.

Edited by crabcakes66, 02 April 2013 - 10:51 AM.

[Kdogg788]

1. Never rebalance according to tabletop
2. The reduction in damage is temporary until they can figure out how to remove splash without causing more bugs.
3. LRMs were like 1.7 and they reduced to 0.7. Increase them to 1.1 or 1.2 and it could work. This is what beta testing is for. We tweak these values until something works.

-k

[Henree]

wish they would tweak a little faster!

[Orzorn]

Don't forget, LRMs are also recycling at about a rate of 3.75 seconds, meaning your damage per 10 seconds will be much higher.

Also, don't forget that many other weapons still do the same damage per firing as well (AC/5, UAC/5, AC/2, AC/20, medium laser, etc), but fire more often as well.

LRMs doing 1 damage would be directly in line with any other weapon in terms of how MWO has treated their damage. LRMs just have spread and great travel time to deal with.

LRMs really should have their movement speed raised.

[Dimento Graven]

Increase their speed, and yes, I don't give a flying **** to what anyone one else says, INCREASE LRM angle of attack. No more of this BS smash into the side of a hill because of an overly low launch profile.

Also decrease the 'ghost reach' of solid objects like trees, lamp posts, buidling fragments, 'mech carcasses as the logic appears to default to, "...if there's even the slightest accidental possibility that the round fired can glance an intervening object by so much as one tenth of a micron, the entire shot hits said intervening object..." (this is true of EVERY weapon in the game, not just missles, unfortunately)...

Edited by Dimento Graven, 02 April 2013 - 11:19 AM.

[Grand Ayatollah Kerensky]

In my opinion, the problem with LRMs doing too much damage is that everyone boats the crap out of them and the game allows you to bring enough ammo to spend an entire round LRM spamming. What PGI needs to do is buff LRM damage massively, but make LRM ammo weigh one ton per 20 missiles. In this scenario, an LRM 40 boat with 6 tonnes of ammo would have 3 *very deadly* volleys.

In my mind, I picture battles starting off with a brief LRM skirmish followed by a brawl between the battered remains of each team.

Edited by Narcisoldier, 02 April 2013 - 11:32 AM.

[Mongoose Trueborn]

LRMs, SRMs, and SSRMs are great now and better than they have ever been before.

[MN03]

Narcisoldier, on 02 April 2013 - 11:20 AM, said:

In my opinion, the problem with LRMs doing too much damage is that everyone boats the crap out of them and the game allows you to bring enough ammo to spend an entire round LRM spamming. What PGI needs to do is buff LRM damage massively, but make LRM ammo weigh one ton per 40 missiles. In this scenario, an LRM 40 boat with 6 tonnes of ammo would have 6 *very deadly* volleys.

In my mind, I picture battles starting off with a brief LRM skirmish followed by a brawl between the battered remains of each team.

They should reduce AC/20 ammo so you can do 6 deadly ac/40 shots, that's it.

[Appogee]

LRMs are easy mode. You should be embarrassed to be using them at all, not arguing for them to do more damage

[Dimento Graven]

Appogee, on 02 April 2013 - 12:12 PM, said:

LRMs are easy mode. You should be embarrassed to be using them at all, not arguing for them to do more damage

Wow, such a magnificent troll post.

[Henree]

please fix the lrms!

[Rhent]

Orzorn, on 02 April 2013 - 11:13 AM, said:

Don't forget, LRMs are also recycling at about a rate of 3.75 seconds, meaning your damage per 10 seconds will be much higher.

Also, don't forget that many other weapons still do the same damage per firing as well (AC/5, UAC/5, AC/2, AC/20, medium laser, etc), but fire more often as well.

LRMs doing 1 damage would be directly in line with any other weapon in terms of how MWO has treated their damage. LRMs just have spread and great travel time to deal with.

LRMs really should have their movement speed raised.

LRM's recycle rate is really not a selling point, unless you are using LRM 5, which can be destroyed by 2 AMS. The LRM 10 is inline with most of the other weapon systems in the game for recycle. Once you get to LRM15's and LRM20's, they have the longest recycle in the game and arguably now do the worst damage per ton in the game.

[Rhent]

Appogee, on 02 April 2013 - 12:12 PM, said:

LRMs are easy mode. You should be embarrassed to be using them at all, not arguing for them to do more damage

LRM's are the hardest weapon system in the game to use. Once I switched over to my Trollololo LL Stalker or SRM Cat, direct fire weapons are the easiest weapon systems in the game to register a hit, especially in brawling. Only a fool would type LRM's are easy mode.

Easy Mode is:
1st) Keeping your target at 180M to 1000M to actually hit
2nd) Avoiding ECM
3rd) Keeping TAG on your target to allow you to hit
4th) Picking targets that will take actual damage before they can seek cover
5th) The only weapon system that has an alert and gives people time to avoid
6th) If a mech runs fast enough (132KPH), you can forget about landing any missiles on them.

Learn to Play the game before typing, you will save yourself embarrassment.

[Monkeystador]

OPs math is not correct.

This guys closer without math pulled from ***

Rhent, on 02 April 2013 - 02:50 PM, said:

LRM's are the hardest weapon system in the game to use. Once I switched over to my Trollololo LL Stalker or SRM Cat, direct fire weapons are the easiest weapon systems in the game to register a hit, especially in brawling. Only a fool would type LRM's are easy mode.

Easy Mode is:
1st) Keeping your target at 180M to 1000M to actually hit
2nd) Avoiding ECM
3rd) Keeping TAG on your target to allow you to hit
4th) Picking targets that will take actual damage before they can seek cover
5th) The only weapon system that has an alert and gives people time to avoid
6th) If a mech runs fast enough (132KPH), you can forget about landing any missiles on them.

Learn to Play the game before typing, you will save yourself embarrassment.

3. Tag isnt great and hard to use
4. The hardest thing about LRMs...
6. Even Mechs at 80kph avoid some of the LRMs as the hit point shifts towards the legs and feet.


Buff the LRM speed. Thats all whats needed for the first step. That should raise the hit rate alot.

Also fix the firing angle of the missiles if the target is below the firing mech. It affects the launching angle for some weird reason. The missiles should always arc. Having a higher ground is a tactial advandtage. If the missiles would keep that initial launching altitude and in the end would hit the target in a steeper angle from above would be nice.

Edited by Monkeystador, 02 April 2013 - 03:26 PM.

[Sheraf]

I want to be a healer mech When will we have playable mobile repair bay?

[MadAndrew]

Sheraf, on 02 April 2013 - 03:29 PM, said:

I want to be a healer mech When will we have playable mobile repair bay?

What would those repair bays do? Change batteries?

[Pygar]

They ARE fixed already...in TT LRM 20 would get an average of 12 damage, spread out over 3 hit locations. (Or in TT, they were not really great weapons unless you had really good luck on the dice...LRM20 launcher better to compare to a PPC weight/range/damage wise than to an AC20)

Seriously, I know it's a drag if you got used to them the way they were for a bit here...but right now LRMs are actually working closer to how they should than they have since I have been playing MWO.

Edited by Pygar, 02 April 2013 - 03:58 PM.