101 replies to this topic

[Aim-Bot]

maybe its paying PGI for beta testing their game but there is one issue. I dont have to pay so in my opinion its more donating PGI because i like their beta and i have high hopes in the finished product. the game wont improve with compliments

[Noobzorz]

I can paraphrase the OP as "Watch as I explain the completely obsolete 2004 definition of Open Beta to you as a way of justifying how broken this last patch was!"

F2P looks like it's going to continue to become increasingly important, and this ridiculous anachronism some of the less sensible people are peddling will look incredibly stupid, even to them, ten years hence.

[Love Rhino]

Sorry, no. This is not a beta. A beta is where I would play test a product in order to improve its release. In a free to play mmo that would include access to content that would normally be paid. This is a pay to play game currently open for paid play but still in a beta state. That is why this discussion even happens; there is a charge for content, but still the excuse of 'beta' state for its quality.

[Aim-Bot]

Love Rhino, on 03 April 2013 - 03:49 PM, said:

Sorry, no. This is not a beta. A beta is where I would play test a product in order to improve its release. In a free to play mmo that would include access to content that would normally be paid. This is a pay to play game currently open for paid play but still in a beta state. That is why this discussion even happens; there is a charge for content, but still the excuse of 'beta' state for its quality.

i like to lead you guys to another topic. this pretty much says what i would answer to you.
Its not pay to play and not pay to win.
You already said it yourself in the first sentence.It is an open beta because its not released right now the simple reason is that key elements are not implemented at the moment.

http://mwomercs.com/...0225-face-palm/

Edited by KuritaGuard, 03 April 2013 - 04:02 PM.

[Tenzek]

Green Mamba, on 03 April 2013 - 02:49 PM, said:

Which Year?

Well, technically they didn't promise it before 3050 if you think about it. I say we give them till then.

[Joe Mallad]

KuritaGuard, on 03 April 2013 - 02:34 PM, said:

I am

The only reason why this project could fail is because the comunity let pgi fall because of things are bugged atm.
In any case i often have the feeling that people often dont know what they want.
At first everyone was happy about the highlander now where the heavy metal is out and it cant mount 3 ppc and 1 gauss+ jumpjets people are angry and dissapointed.
But i swear if it could mount 3 ppc+1 gauss+ jumpjets people would sream : OVERPOWERED!

this is the problem... PGI has allowed most of the larger mech to be able to mount loads of big weapons, and now with each new mech... Everyone wants it to be able to mount EVERYTHING.

[Love Rhino]

KuritaGuard, on 03 April 2013 - 03:55 PM, said:

i like to lead you guys to another topic. this pretty much says what i would answer to you.
Its not pay to play and not pay to win.
You already said it yourself in the first sentence.It is an open beta because its not released right now the simple reason is that key elements are not implemented at the moment.

http://mwomercs.com/...0225-face-palm/

Kurita, the PAY elements are in fact in place. Thus, not a beta. Once the product is on sale, it is no longer considered to be in the testing phase. You have only stated once again that the quality is currently 'beta', which was my point. The micro transactions are not being shown as donations, but as end game purchases. End game money, beta game product.

[guidedbyvoices]

well said, OP.

[fharoah]

Thanks for the self explanatory post. And which is spelled with an H.

[Stargazer86]

Eyup. Once they implemented their business model and started accepting money in exchange for in-game items, it essentially became a release. A release that's still suffering from beta issues, but a release nonetheless.

[slimebucket]

lol this post will get moved or locked soon I can tell

People hate the truth around here



I have been a part of many many beta projects


The moment they stop resetting, and charge real money for in game items and credits, the game is considered out of beta.

It is beta in name only. They are not TESTING the game for the last few months, they have been maintaining it like it was released.

They are just using it as a marketing tactic to "release" the game multiple times.

Edited by slimebucket, 03 April 2013 - 07:31 PM.

[Tenri]

I agree to a certain extent to this and in the past this definition would be correct. However, in modern times the definition of open beta has changed. More and more games are being released as a full game WITH a micro transaction whilst being called open beta. Sure you can continue and use the old definition of the word 'beta', but most will expect a full game once open beta + micro transaction are in place because that is how the games of this generation has been released as. e.g. "We XXXX, publishing XXXX game is in open beta! Has cash shop, no wipe!"

And to be honest, in my opinion once a game has a type of micro transaction in place it is NOT in beta any longer... At least in the old sense of the the meaning the OP has posted... (ahh the good ole times of being a beta tester... aka testing the game with no cash shop)
Magicman from MMObomb has talked about recent beta @ 31:00 ish link
Edit: Summary of video: It's not a beta anymore if you have any sort of payment process in there.

Sure you can still say "but we are testing the game!" Yea we are... but we have the option of using REAL money to buy mechs that COULD be tweaked, for better or for worse, later... Oh and don't forget there will be no refunds/wipes. And don't pull the old "you don't have to buy anything" card. Yea yea, thank you, for glazing over the main issue, the cash shop, in this so called open "beta" testing phase.

On positive note. I love the game I pay for mechs/ mech bays I don't care if this is an incomplete game, I got mechs that can shoot and explode, I'm happy. Just throwing my opinion of what a beta is.

Edited by Tenri, 03 April 2013 - 08:26 PM.

[Forestal]

People, people: we can easily clear up all the semantics by saying it's an "MWO open-beta" compared to say, an "Airmech open-beta"-- where they get patches/updates almost every other day or so for minor bugs or specific balance issues, cos the game is already FULLY PLAYABLE (for free)... and I bring up Airmech only because their players also don't consider or care if it's a beta-- though for completely opposite reasons (i.e. Carbongames merely FULFILLING more promises vs PGI merely MAKING more promises)-- cos I know Airmech is a relatively simple endeavour compared to the supposed EPICNESS of MWO undertaken by PGI.

Edited by Forestal, 03 April 2013 - 08:40 PM.

[MischiefSC]

So if you're not comfortable paying for a beta product.....


DON'T.


It's the most amazing concept.

Yes, it's in beta. It's still being funded in fact for more development. Wait a year if that bugs you. Go somewhere else. Play something else. Or stay and play and don't spend any money.

Pretending however that because someone is willing to give money for something that the developers are somehow required to just.... not be in beta anymore is bordering on irrational.

[slimebucket]

MischiefSC, on 03 April 2013 - 09:09 PM, said:

So if you're not comfortable paying for a beta product.....


DON'T.


It's the most amazing concept.

Yes, it's in beta. It's still being funded in fact for more development. Wait a year if that bugs you. Go somewhere else. Play something else. Or stay and play and don't spend any money.

Pretending however that because someone is willing to give money for something that the developers are somehow required to just.... not be in beta anymore is bordering on irrational.

You sir are the one pretending

You argue to the ends of the earth, but you cannot deny that once a game implements its methods for charging for in game stuff and NO LONGER WILL EVER DO A server wipe that the game IS NOT in BETA.


Word terms don't CHANGE. People saying "In the past betas ment this, now it's different"

No it is not! They should come up with a new term then, because BETA testing MEANS testing the game before release.

They should call it a GAMMA release or something. Beta is NOT FOR ENJOYING THE GAME. It is for stricly testing it, where this "open beta" for MW:O is geared toward getting players and having them enjoy the game. The point of this "open beta" is not to track down bugs and problems in the game.
ANYONE can access MW: O, use the store to buy stuff, and game credit, you do not need a beta key to get in, and also there isn't anywhere IN GAME that makes it easy to report bugs.

If you honestly think that this "open beta" is anything more than a PR stunt to give the game multiple releases then you are seriously the one pretending.

This "beta" isn't for testing the game, it is for testing the community

Edited by slimebucket, 03 April 2013 - 11:23 PM.

[Panimu]

You lose the "it's beta" defence when you start taking money for your game.

[Aim-Bot]

Only because you can pay money for a game its not declaired to be a finished product wich MWO not is.
If we just say that : if you can pay for a game its not beta anymore ,then we have to say that this game was already a finished product in closed beta because you was able to buy founders package.No matter if they give your MC back after the open beta reset they still keep your money.

Edited by KuritaGuard, 04 April 2013 - 01:31 AM.

[matux]

KuritaGuard, on 04 April 2013 - 01:28 AM, said:

Only because you can pay money for a game its not declaired to be a finished product wich MWO not is.
If we just say that : if you can pay for a game its not beta anymore ,then we have to say that this game was already a finished product in closed beta because you was able to buy founders package.No matter if they give your MC back after the open beta reset they still keep your money.

You don't seem to understand what has happened.... PGI/IGP have taken our money, they are supplying a product that is not finished, they have no set date for a finished product (summer is not a date is a season), They give no warranty for the product at any point of its development, or choice of compensation if they DONT finish, for what ever reason they do not finish you are left with nothing.

The difference between closed and open, is closed had several account resets, we were GIVEN GXP to play with, MC was reset.

When the Game when open "beta" the accounts were reset, we will never be given GXP (or refunded for features that are plain ****), your MC will not be restored at final release,

So your right, its not a beta anymore, its a huge gamble, had i known this i wouldn't have brought a founders account I'm not one to gamble with my money, nor will i spend anymore money till this hits a final release version and maybe a few months after that.

[Thorn Hallis]

Their game, their rules. PGI could call MWO a medical experiment (most concentrated collection of heightend blood pressure outside of **** sites) if they wish.

[l4Dl]

KuritaGuard, on 03 April 2013 - 02:20 PM, said:

Whats a closed beta?

Whats an open beta?

Leaving open beta.

Your post is correct, but, in my personal experience, i see it differently where this game is concerned:


Whats a closed beta?
A chance to pull in all the MechWarrior fans and give them 5.2% of mechs for $120. Make 5+ million in the process

Whats an open beta?
A chance to keep the current MechWarrior player base, and, make new mechs which cost $30+ a pop.
Make drastic changes to the game which will probably remove some of the original "paying playerbase". On the risk of "Hey, these people paid money, what happens if we make 3rd person view and get their money instead?"

Leaving open beta.
Hope to god that the current MechWarrior player base is willing to keep spending high prices on new hero mechs/items. If that fails, then realise it and make another game with the money thats left over.

I'am just so glad this game has a F2P element, i wont feel "cheated" if this game goes down the pan