313 replies to this topic

[Metallis]

yashmack, on 03 April 2013 - 09:47 PM, said:

I think you may misunderstand this
it will hide all friendlies within the ECM bubble from those on the opposing team, those on the same team wil however still be able to see friendly mechs on radar and still have IFF info for them

I was initially going to sound off against this. But after thinking about it I am 50/50 on this. I have a background as a radar operator from my time in the military. ECM was a common threat. The enemy using ECM to mask a large number of incoming aircraft was a real threat. We had to create counter-measures to find and destroy the ECM aircraft. ECM affects radars by disrupting radio frequencies. Some ECM cover a wide range of freqs. So if one side of mechs are on the same freq as the opposition, the ECM would affect friend as well as foe. I know the devs are not breaking ECM freq down in this game, so I sort of had to side with you on all parties should be affected. Now if the Devs state that the two sides operate on different freqs, then I will side with the ECM having effect on the enemy forces only.But overall I think ECM is working just they way it is supposed to. With effective counter-measures in place along with the requirement of teamwork to combat ECM.

[DocBach]

Thontor, on 12 April 2013 - 11:55 AM, said:

true, .. whatever is closest to your reticle... even if it's behind you, lol

so i see no need to have a separate key to target something under your reticle, if R already does that... if something is under your reticle.

Well, right now R doesn't target ECM shrouded 'Mechs at all, even if you are pointing your crosshair directly on it. Pretty much suggesting that ECM 'Mechs can be targeted, if you have made direct line of sight with them, and have aimed your crosshairs over them. Still would support ECM hiding status of the target like variant, damage, and loadout, though.

[Shumabot]

DocBach, on 12 April 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

Well, right now R doesn't target ECM shrouded 'Mechs at all, even if you are pointing your crosshair directly on it. Pretty much suggesting that ECM 'Mechs can be targeted, if you have made direct line of sight with them, and have aimed your crosshairs over them. Still would support ECM hiding status of the target like variant, damage, and loadout, though.

The number of scenarios where that mechanic would be useful is low, and the number of realistic ones is practically zero. An atlas, in the open, unmoving and unable to get to cover would be targetable if you keep yourself continuously exposed and have a wide open lane of fire between the both of you.

That sounds like suicide for the negligible hope that the atlas doesn't get behind a hill. It would never work against an ecm light.

Edited by Shumabot, 12 April 2013 - 12:08 PM.

[hammerreborn]

DocBach, on 12 April 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

Well, right now R doesn't target ECM shrouded 'Mechs at all, even if you are pointing your crosshair directly on it. Pretty much suggesting that ECM 'Mechs can be targeted, if you have made direct line of sight with them, and have aimed your crosshairs over them. Still would support ECM hiding status of the target like variant, damage, and loadout, though.

Then you aren't targeting.

Are you suggesting that placing your reticle on a disguised mech can still give you a lockon (reticle only, and I would also add at a greatly increased lock on time without TAG/Artemis support and a slight delay before missile lock starts so you can't just sweep terrain and look for the lock to start)? Cause I'm okay with that. As soon as you move your target off target though that lock needs to disappear though.

Getting a full lock on with target info I don't support.

Edited by hammerreborn, 12 April 2013 - 12:10 PM.

[Kristov Kerensky]

I have a Stalker with 4 LRM15s, 5 meds and 1 TAG on it, I have yet to find ECM to be more then a minor annoyance when using that Stalker. See, it's about as hard to keep TAG on a running Light as it is to keep TAG on a stationary Atlas.

And there ladies and gentlemen is the REAL heart of the problem.

If you can't keep TAG on a target, you sure as hells can't take them out with any direct fire weapons because all it takes is LITERALLY keeping your ret on the target and that's anything but hard to do...at least for me and people like Hammer(who I KNOW has great aim because he's one of the few SoBs I fear and loathe in a Jenner) it's not hard. But it would seem that many others can't do such a simple thing so ECM is super OP and totally destroys the game. If you can't aim well enough to TAG a moving target, how the hells can you be expected to put direct fire weapons on target? You can't, so you use lockons that don't REQUIRE you to aim! But..ECM blocks those...unless you use TAG or ER/PPCs or ECM yourself. And we've already been told repeatedly that it's IMPOSSIBLE to TAG a Light so they are left with..well, if they can't hit with TAG then ER/PPCs are right out aren't they? So that leaves ECM to counter ECM...only there's not really any LRM boats that can make use of ECM in such a manner, min distance and all that with LRMs, so they are left high and dry and unable to compete because their only viable weapon choice is USELESS!

Does ECM render some of the Trail Mechs useless? No, for multiple reasons.
1) You CAN dumbfire LRMs and they'll hit and do damage just fine, I do it a lot when I've got a target just around a corner or I can't see enough to get a TAG hit but the missiles CAN arc in just fine to hit them behind that rock/building/whatever. Amazing what you can do without having to get a lock!
2) You don't drop alone, this is NOT a 1v1 game. We currently drop with 7 others on our side, soon to be 11 others, and that means that someone ELSE can take care of ECM if you can't. I know, I know, how messed up is THAT? You actually have to rely on someone ELSE in a video game so you can do well! That's just...just...it's...wow..how about that, a TEAM game that actually puts real meaning behind the word TEAM...fracking amazing isn't it?

[Livewyr]

Zynithra Akutenshi, on 12 April 2013 - 09:11 AM, said:

Funny thing is, you're right!

And then there's everyone with a clue.

2/10 not clever, easily reversible.

[Mr 144]

Teralitha, on 04 April 2013 - 10:42 AM, said:

Why do you think ECM is fine? Id like someone who says this to give a very detailed and lengthy logical explanation why you think ECM is fine. Otherwise your opinions are worthless. Make it constructive and actually have a point that debunks all the reasons why everyone else thinks its a bad thing. What is the logic behind the reason.

You see all these guys in the feedback forum giving detailed explanations on why ECM is bad for the game that are many paragraphs long? Yea... lets see you do that.

Been there, done that with you on more than one occasion. Not many people I'm guessing want to deal with the Tera-Poster-Child for ECM nerfs...Seriously, ECM just isn't that big of a deal. All of the supposed over-powerd reason you claim start with the premise that anything ECM does is any significant threat to a decent player or team. Not once...ever...have I been in any match where someone has called out 'watch out! he's got ECM!' Oddly enough, people identify and call out (yes, even in pugs) AC/40s...Poptarts...PPC Boats...Etc...but again, not once 'Oh no, he's got ECM!' huh...imagine that...a passive system being passive.

Btw, run some 8s...Jenners are back 3v3 Jenner vs 3L....putting my money on the jenners all day everyday. Get over your irrational fear people. Pug/4-man Queues...no one either bothers following the D-Dc anymore. Forum QQers have lost the ECM battle...move on.

Mr 144

Edit: Oh! I see moving on to Jettisoned has already happened! sweet!

Edited by Mr 144, 12 April 2013 - 02:29 PM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 12 April 2013 - 09:37 AM, said:

you forgot:

4.) People who think "learn to counter LRMs in game" isnt a valid argument

also 5.) People who find that its vastly easier to get the devs to break a weapon by coming here and QQing than it is to counter it in game. And that PFI falls apart in the face of that QQing so fast people are killed by the shrapnel

Niko Snow, on 12 April 2013 - 01:05 PM, said:

in short: let them eat cake
Further proof they dont give two figs what we think on the forums.
Thank you for further proving that point, Niko

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 12 April 2013 - 03:47 PM.

[DocBach]

Mr 144, on 12 April 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

Edit: Oh! I see moving on to Jettisoned has already happened! sweet!

ah yes, because negative opinion should be kept out of public eye.

[Forestal]

Thontor, on 09 April 2013 - 04:51 PM, said:

good thing the PPC's cooldown is less than 4 seconds so you can keep the ECM disabled indefinitely if they stay in line of sight. and if they aren't in line of sight to hit with a PPC anymore, you would've lost the lock anyway, even with no ECM involved.

But I don't have coolshot consumbles to keep the heat down from chain-firing PPCs forever, my bad... OMG, the legions of the PGI defense force is growing by leaps and bounds-- I guess this community is not dying, it is changing into precisely what PGI wanted it to be (but not for me)!

Edited by Forestal, 12 April 2013 - 05:32 PM.

[Forestal]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 12 April 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

I think the devs suffer from the idea that since they dont USE LRMs then ECM doesnt affect them so its balanced

I don't think it's only the Devs, the whole PGI Defense Force has been gifted with the secret of the SEP (Somebody Else's Problem) Field Generators developed by Douglas Adams-- and there's no hard counter for it unless you already know the problem (which you can't due to the SEP, so there's no hard counter for it unless...)!

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Shumabot, on 12 April 2013 - 12:04 PM, said:

An atlas, in the open,

THERES yer problem