119 replies to this topic

[Frostiken]

Okay, maybe not, but bear with me on this. Myself and just about every other pragmatic individual (as evidenced by some poll somewhere) are worried that newbies to the Mechwarrior franchise (MechAssault scrubs and given by the fact that Mechwarrior's hardly been around for the last decade, just about anyone who's picked up gaming since then) are going to flood this game en masse.

You get to pick your first, singular mech free, right? Well, what do you think most people, who don't know anything about this game, are going to do? Pick the squishy-yet-adorable Raven and 'scout'? Most of us are pretty certain there's going to be a tremendous influx of Assault mechs, probably Atlases, as nubs are more likely to go with the BIGGER = BETTER mentality.

My worry is this - you aren't going to get your second mech until you either pay or play a lot, and I presume there won't be a way to trade in your original free mech. I'm concerned that for the early parts of this game's life, nubs are going to flood servers enmasse and we're going to be facing wave after wave of assaults on assaults. Newbies are going to get tired of their mech being so slow and probably less effective than they hoped, they're going to get tired of seeing nothing but other assaults everywhere, other people are going to get sick of it, etc. and it's going to hurt this game. Maybe not a lot, but it will.

Now, this is all conjecture based on assuming that because people are stupid they're going to pick the stupidest mechs to play. So with that in mind, if this is going to be a problem and degrade the quality of the game, what kind of countermeasures can be taken to torpedo overuse of Assaults?

I wouldn't object to allowing any / all mech purchases to be refunded within a few days, to allow you to take it for a few test drives to see if you like it, so people could exchange their stupid Atlases for something more practical.


Am I completely off my rocker here?

[Stormdragon]

Me thinks you are going by the arms race Mechwarrior games of old.

Watching a few interviews and reading the FAQ might clear things up for you.

[Frostiken]

Stormdragon, on 03 June 2012 - 06:50 AM, said:

Watching a few interviews and reading the FAQ might clear things up for you.

Whether or not other chassis weights are going to be viable is irrelevant. The point is noobs aren't going to know this. Imagine if you allowed a Dire Wolf as your starting mech choice, what do you think you're going to see, besides a 12v12 game where one team has 8 of the damn things? It doesn't matter if they're useful or not, the nubs aren't going to have any other mechs to use and thus, Direwolves everywhere.

Edited by Frostiken, 03 June 2012 - 06:54 AM.

[Spleenslitta]

The developers did say they would make a matchmaking system. They would also make it so that a 12vs12 would have a maximum total weight on each side.
But where did i see it? I don't want to go reading through all of those interviews to find it.

[Toothman]

Frostiken, on 03 June 2012 - 06:52 AM, said:

Whether or not other chassis weights are going to be viable is irrelevant. The point is noobs aren't going to know this. Imagine if you allowed a Dire Wolf as your starting mech choice, what do you think you're going to see, besides a 12v12 game where one team has 8 of the damn things? It doesn't matter if they're useful or not, the nubs aren't going to have any other mechs to use and thus, Direwolves everywhere.

Won't last for long when the mixed force on the other side rips them a new one and they can only afford to repair half their armor and one med laser.

[Frostiken]

Toothman, on 03 June 2012 - 06:55 AM, said:

Won't last for long when the mixed force on the other side rips them a new one and they can only afford to repair half their armor and one med laser.

Surely the game is going to have a mechanic in place where you cannot 'lose', though. What happens when you run out of money, the game IP bans you and deletes your account?

My point is, if all these idiots do pick Atlases or whatever, what is going to allow that ridiculous balance in power to shift back towards the middle? I don't really care to 'punish' newcomers because they made a dumb decision when they started playing, and had to spend so much money fixing their useless mech that they never get a chance to advance. That's just going to make people quit.

Hell, what if I pick a Raven as my starter mech and I do terrible in it?

Edited by Frostiken, 03 June 2012 - 06:59 AM.

[Kazzamo]

Honestly I think new people coming in are expected to pick the assault mech, I forget where but PGI said assault mechs will give a new player a larger margin of error due to all the armor and such. I just think this will sorta be balanced out by the new players mixed in with the old fans. What I'd be more worried about is we only have one of each weight class to pick from for the start, so unless it's not hard to get the money for a new mech everybody will see the same 4 mechs for a while.

[Athena Hart]

I'm not too worried TBH. Alot of us playing "Will" be longtime players of the Battletech/Mechwarrior franchise and thus will already know what role(s) we will like to be playing as. As for an entire "Team" being in all assaults? Just makes them easier targets for faster mechs like Lights and Mediums. I have beaten an Atlas with a light mech before.. ok.. only twice...once in a Wasp and once in a Spider (Stayed right behind him the whole time). I'm sure I could have done it an one of any other number of lights though.. Jenner comes to mind. And Mediums can kill Assaults 1 on 1 with the right pilot as the Assasult can't maneuver like a Medium.

[5150warpig]

nubs may be extremely dumb but not all of them go for the biggest baddest mech, sure there will be alot of them but also alot of peps will be jjust smart enough to relize hey every1 is getting the big slow mech, lets get this small fast one and play hide and go boom.

have some faith in nubs, it may be hard but they all arent completly brainless

[Nick Makiaveli]

Stormdragon, on 03 June 2012 - 06:50 AM, said:

Me thinks you are going by the arms race Mechwarrior games of old.

Watching a few interviews and reading the FAQ might clear things up for you.

Yea I don't think you read his whole post, I think you saw the title and assumed.


OT: I suspect it will play out as you suspect, at least in the beginning. Once things get moving, anyone with any brains will work toward buying a lighter mech, or learning to use their assault mech.

To anyone who doubts what Frostiken is saying, look at the number of posts from people who ask stupid crap like Is this game free? Where can I dl it? etc. No clue, and no attempt to get one.

What I would like to see is the option to trade in your starter mech one time. This way if you start with something you don't like, or are a seriously casual gamer and thus having trouble saving for a second mech, you can still give something different a try and thus hoping increase the retention rate.

Spleenslitta, on 03 June 2012 - 06:55 AM, said:

The developers did say they would make a matchmaking system. They would also make it so that a 12vs12 would have a maximum total weight on each side.
But where did i see it? I don't want to go reading through all of those interviews to find it.

Matchmaking system yes, but they haven't clarified the details. They did say that weight was one thing they were looking at. But skill goes a long way, and pitting 12 assaults vs 12 random mechs isn't automatically a blowout. Assault scouts...yea right.

[Sassori]

The more atlas's the better. That means the lighter mech chassis will get more games quickly due to the match making system. I imagine it'll end up like a dungeon finder in a lot of other games where it looks for specific roles before actually forming the group.

Say each match has a limit of 1000 tons:

100 tons must be light mechs. 150 tons must be medium mechs, 200 tons must be heavy mechs, and 300 tons must be assault. That leaves 250 tons of 'variable' which can be any size mech.

This is just off the top of my head and without much thought, but it's not to difficult to imagine that lighter chassis will have an easier time getting games than the assaults will, if as you suggest every noob picks an assault.

[Steel Prophet]

Toothman, on 03 June 2012 - 06:55 AM, said:

Won't last for long when the mixed force on the other side rips them a new one

Says it all... time will take care of that "issue" if it will arise at all.

[SwollenSac]

I don't think there will be an issue. Look at it this way. Do you really want a noob in a scout mech when all they will probably do is hide behind all the bigger mechs?

I say let the noobs take the lerger mechs and let the more experienced take the mechs that will decide the outcome of the battle. I highly doubt assault mechs are what is going to win the game every time.

[Sporkosophy]

To this, I counter with, "There are mechs other then assault?"; Steiner pride.

[Nick Makiaveli]

Frostiken, on 03 June 2012 - 06:57 AM, said:

Surely the game is going to have a mechanic in place where you cannot 'lose', though. What happens when you run out of money, the game IP bans you and deletes your account?

My point is, if all these idiots do pick Atlases or whatever, what is going to allow that ridiculous balance in power to shift back towards the middle? I don't really care to 'punish' newcomers because they made a dumb decision when they started playing, and had to spend so much money fixing their useless mech that they never get a chance to advance. That's just going to make people quit.

Hell, what if I pick a Raven as my starter mech and I do terrible in it?

Your mech is automatically repaired to a bare minimum state after a battle. They further stated you can enter a battle in this state. You would be of limited usefulness. Which is another reason to run a recon mech....

[Frostiken]

I'm not really concerned with the gameplay inso much as the impact on the way players perceive the game and their willingness to stick with it / put money into it.

[Phaid Knott]

Don't think they will as much as you think. One of the things with earier MW games were the number of "no heat" servers with 100 ton jumpjet alphastrike lazboats. As MWO will be on a server with setting that can't be changed by players mean that they will be in control (and man it was hard to find populated heat servers after a while with MW4).

[Youngblood]

If I might add in something really quick....

"nubs", if they actually cared for this game enough to realize their mistakes and adapt, would create a new account to pick a new starting 'Mech. Despite that being somewhat of a drastic measure, it's fast and it would work. That's why I added in the condition of "if they cared", because frankly, the adaptable players will be the only players who will play the game enough to become part of the paying fanbase for MWO.

[Nick Makiaveli]

Frostiken, on 03 June 2012 - 07:06 AM, said:

I'm not really concerned with the gameplay inso much as the impact on the way players perceive the game and their willingness to stick with it / put money into it.

This is a valid concern, but at the same time it applies to every game out there. So in a way, it's probably already been factored into the calculations as to what percentage of gamers will stick with it.

That's not to say that the devs shouldn't look into ways to ease this issue, but at the same time, some people need to move on and play something else...

[Tombstone Jackson]

I have faith the devs have this covered.