234 replies to this topic

[Koniving]

Esplodin, on 09 April 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

HSR fixees this for beams. People still suck at aiming. HSR for ballistics suppposedly in this next patch. People will still suck at aiming. There is no exploit, and your slower builds means you drive a heavy or assault. Nailed it in one go.
I pilot Spider, but reading comprehension and rational thought are aparently not your strong suit.
Assault troll. I Nailed it, as I said, first go.

You didn't read either. You pilot a spider, but before the spider you likely started with the speed demon 3-L.
Also, assault troll?

You didn't watch any of the 20 or so youtube videos that I posted in that same response to you of me running UAC-5 Spiders to kill Atlai, ER PPC Spider 5-Ds that slaughter streak using speed demons Raven 3-L in the fog of Frozen City, in the distance, WITHOUT Thermal?

What about the vids posted in that response of the slow AC-20 Ravens potshotting super fast spiders at 30 to 180 meters as they scurry around and harass me? The AC-20 Ravens killing mediums, heavies, and assaults in face to face brawls with me focusing my fire at them and travelling at 70 kph or slower with the XL engine? Or the vids of Gauss Spider, or even the Jenners with FLAMERS ONLY using them to fight alone with and kill TWO Atlas back to back? (Yes the first was afk, but the second was not). Just to note, that Jenner had single heatsinks and a standard engine. I spent most of my time at 40 kph during that fight.

Speed is not everything. Just because you are fast does not entitle you to be useful. There is more to combat than speed. There's firepower. There's skill. There's teamwork. There's coordination. There's the ability to aim and focus your damage. These things get lost when all you have is speed. These things get lost by people using fast mechs with machine guns, who don't focus their shots and thus spread their bullets all over the place. They get lost by fast mechs using SRMs who think they're weak now when they are not. These things get lost by the people who cry that their lasers aren't strong enough, or who don't understand the value of a well placed shot. These get lost on people who think that the Ravens 2x, 4x, and the Spiders 5k and 5v are worthless. Trust me. The 4x is far more powerful than the 3-L. The 5v? Okay, I'll admit that spider hasn't got a lot going for it. But the 5K spider.. Nothing is more fun than making loads of heavies and assaults run as you chase them through River City with an AC-2+UAC-5 combo.

Please don't reply unless you go back and watch at least some of those videos and then come back with a little more respect. I get that you think speed is everything. It's good that you have an opinion but you need not attack someone else for having theirs. You have snapshots of scores. I have videos of practicality. Please grow up a little bit, take your cockpit out of your gyro, and then I would welcome your intelligent reply. Or don't reply at all.

I wasn't originally speaking to you when you attacked me for my opinion that speed isn't everything. Quite frankly if you're going too fast you will have too much trouble doing anything really useful other than being a difficult-to-hit-target. Nor am I an "assault troll." I use lights, mediums, heavies, and assault mechs. I use a variety of builds and many include flamers and machine guns, which can be truly devastating when used correctly. With an LPL and MGs I can strip the armor off an Atlas, fire into its body parts, and destroy all of its weapons without destroying a single limb. It's quite funny, actually, when you read chat about "hack" this and "annoying" that. It's even better when you take a moment to stand on their head afterward and dance for a moment, before flying off to tear apart the next sucker that thinks MGs aren't a threat.

You say the Spider 5D is the only one worth anything. Those videos would show you to be wrong. Ever taken on a splat cat in a spider at only 80 kph with a UAC-5 as it jams over and over again with no help from your team? There is no running away, when you can't go faster than him. There is only fighting. That's what I do. I fight, and I win. If I don't win, I do all the damage that I can, even if it means jamming the override and firing until I explode. I won that fight, though I did not have to do any overrides or explode to do so. I simply shot his head, and blasted him into oblivion. Here's my proposal. When you fight a splat cat in a spider that is slower than the catapult and win, then you can troll or attack people for their opinions or whatever. But first know what you're trolling. I pilot all weight classes and I do well with them.

I am the first and only Gauss Spider known to this date. (Do message me when someone else makes this extremely fragile but gloriously fun mech).
I am the only spider -- for that matter the only player -- to ever reach the highest point in frozen city and stand above the frozen city caves. (Footnote 1)
Quite frankly I am confident that my spider will likely fry your 2 ML, 1 MPL 5-D. I've seen and killed the cookie cutter build several times before.
And I would only need 30 kph to do it with my spider 5k or 0 kph in my Ravens 4x or 2x.

Watch some vids. Get some build ideas to make the other "worthless" spiders useful. Try not going so fast, and maybe you can kill something instead of just spamming damage; as clearly yours is too spread out by the scores you gave. High damage scores are sometimes good, but it only takes 27 damage to kill any enemy, even if you're piloting a spider.

My 5V says hi.


Footnote 1: Reaching the highest point in Frozen City and anywhere in MWO as of the time of Spider's Release.
(Note: No longer possible, sent this to the devs. It's been fixed.)

But yes, as I said, the 5V hasn't got a lot going for it. The best one can do is twin medium pulse lasers.
Interestingly enough back then when I just bought the spiders, I fought as you do now. Thinking speed was everything. From the conclusion I'm certain you can see the realization that I had. Speed means nothing. It's one aspect to the equation, and sometimes to balance out you need to trade it for something more useful.

Edited by Koniving, 09 April 2013 - 08:04 PM.

[Deathlike]

As much I disagree with what Koniving thinks of MGs, but the insight to "out of the box" thinking is better than a lot of the stuff that goes around here.

Besides... there's still plenty of stuff about MWO that could be learned from these vids.

[NocturnalBeast]

Keep your word, this time, and implement 3rd person as a game-mode option, so those of us who don't want to use it, or play against people using it don't have to. Otherwise, you may find that your current player base will "exclude" itself. In the latest PC Gamer interview something like "...once people start to play MWO, they find themselves addicted...", well forcing us to play against people who use 3rd person is like putting battery acid in our needles.

Edited by Edward Steiner, 09 April 2013 - 08:26 PM.

[Snoopy]

I have some questions regarding the MWO server infrastructure PGI is planning.

If I read and interpret the answer correct concerning multiple MWO server and a global account. It looks like there is not a discussion if this option should be used, it looks like it already definite.
Is it correct to reckon that each server will have it's own population that can not transfer pilot&mech information to other servers?
Will server location and player server-choice be based on national licensing agreements between PGI and sub-contractors?

Regarding the effects on CW:
Can we get a confirm/answer/hint by the Devs if there will be multiple different and independent IS masto conquer by means of CW? Or will the results of each regional server IS map merged into one global IS map?

Can you please give us some information about your elimination of risks regarding server population? How would this work with the discussed addition of 1st/3rd view and maybe more queues?

Do you see any risk of fighting the same group of opponents again and again because of different server splits / queurs ?

Thanks

[grayson marik]

Machine guns really?
Have you also noticed, that with 12v12, the sync dropping of multiple 4 men groups will have its golden rise ?
Have you noticed, that group play will not happen anymore ( even less than now) because the nightmare of having 12 ppl online, ready and grouped ..and on the other side 12 ppl again rdy and grouped?
Have you considered, that the lobby implementation that is coming down the road will specifically NOT include the ability to drop one group of players against a specific other group of players?

[CG Oglethorpe Kerensky]

STJobe is pretty spot on with his crit analysis.

But something else to consider.
Non-destructible items in a location soak crit damage.
Take the Atlas-D with the two medium lasers in the CT.
If you look at it on paper you have a location with 12 critical slots, 1-10 are Engine/Gyro locations and 11-12 are your medium lasers. An AC/10 round that crits will roll to see where it hits and any result from 1-10 will absorb the crit but won't do anything else because those items can't be destroyed. The same is true with actuators, sensors, life support, etc.

[TheRulesLawyer]

[color=#959595]When a location, such as the right torso, is destroyed, each ammo bin in that location that had not already been destroyed by crit hits has an individual 10% chance to explode. [/color]

[color=#959595]Wow- This is a horribly broken mechanic. Free crit chances for something that will likely destroy your mech? [/color]

[Akule]

Bryan Ekman, on 08 April 2013 - 11:36 AM, said:

CCQ 3: Why is Machine Gun damage so low?
A: Partly due to the nature of how MGs work in the TT rules, partially due to how we chose to make it useful. When equipping a MG, keep in mind that it is not meant to burn through armor but is very useful for tearing up internals (crits). Bumping MG damage will turn it into a laser that can be kept on with no heat penalty until it runs out of ammo. Now imagine the devastating effect that a 6 MG spider could do to the back of an Atlas! We are still investigating balance of the MG but don’t expect any significant increase in damage.

I can't imagine that, because none of the variants of Spider currently available have six ballistic hardpoints.

Still, 0.04? Even that figure requires a constant stream that stays on a particular location. A spider is frequently moving (or it is a DEAD spider), which means that it would be difficult to keep a sustained amount of damage going on a single location.

Machine guns doing over 0.04 per second in a 90 meter range? HOW DARE YOU SIR!

AC/2s on the other hand with their max range of 2160? "We find this is as intended". http://mwomercs.com/...acro-in-action/

Mkay.

Edited by Akule, 10 April 2013 - 07:03 PM.

[Koniving]

Akule, on 10 April 2013 - 07:02 PM, said:

I can't imagine that, because none of the variants of Spider currently available have six ballistic hardpoints.
Mkay.

I just had a thought about this.

What if the Spider 5k is getting a change to 6 ballistic slots?

[Colonel Jaime Wolf]

EitherWay, on 08 April 2013 - 12:27 PM, said:

After launch? This is not what I wanted to hear.

this just tells me that they're still figuring it out coz its something hard to do right

[Akule]

Koniving, on 10 April 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

I just had a thought about this.

What if the Spider 5k is getting a change to 6 ballistic slots?

That could be possible. I certainly would like that.

Thontor, on 10 April 2013 - 07:18 PM, said:

a machine gun does 0.04 damage per bullet, and it fires 10 times a second for a damage per second of 0.4 to armor

each machine gun actually does just over 5 damage per second to items (weapons, equipment), once the armor is gone

Yes, however, they are talking about how a spider with six machine guns is going to be a constant, serious threat to Atlases. It very well could be, in the hands of an experienced pilot who knows what they are doing.

On the other hand, how much skill is required to use six AC/2s with a macro, and how fast can they kill the same Atlas, from the front?

Edited by Akule, 10 April 2013 - 07:23 PM.

[Deathlike]

Koniving, on 10 April 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

I just had a thought about this.

What if the Spider 5k is getting a change to 6 ballistic slots?

/facepalm

[Deathlike]

I've done a little thinking with respect to using the Spider as a "solo Gauss Rifle" platform (or UAC5/AC2 one for that matter)... and although I would never even ponder of building that platform, there is a method to the madness.

1) You simply cannot run a traditional light mech mentality. It just won't work. What would work is some sort of "alternative" sniper mentality.. like how some Spider pilots operate with just 1 ERPPC. It's doable, but you have to commit to it.

2) If you are doing the traditional run+scout, you're using the build wrong. The mech is not there to brawl ever. It's not even there to really defend a cap. If your teammates are good enough to support you, you can probably do what you want... for the most part.

3) The mech's size is a benefit. Consider that most mechs on Alpine still look "big enough" to be shot by a PPC. A spider by contrast is very difficult to shoot it. The weapon is on the arm, so getting rid of the "rifle arm" at distance becomes a very difficult chore. The only way to engage a mech is generally through surprise and surrounding. Speed is not its true function... just mobility from jjs is enough.

Anyways, it's doable, but running slow in a light mech makes me ineffective.

[Tennex]

Any plans to change the size of current mechs? Right now the centurion/trebuche are as tall as mechs weigh two classes above them. It seems a bit like an unfair for the lighter mech to be as big of a target as larger mechs.

Could you also go into some of the ways the mech artists decide how tall a mech will be?

Edited by Tennex, 10 April 2013 - 09:07 PM.

[Vaan]

May i ask what's the spec of the MG that is able to.. damage a thick armour of a mech? Unless we have AP bullets? And why people like to compare MG to a small laser?

[FupDup]

Vaan, on 10 April 2013 - 11:08 PM, said:

May i ask what's the spec of the MG that is able to.. damage a thick armour of a mech? Unless we have AP bullets? And why people like to compare MG to a small laser?

Because they weigh similar (MG is 0.5 tons and needs 1 ton of ammo) and there are three small mech variants that tend to see little use as a result of not having anything game-changing in their ballistic slots.


We aren't firing Kalashnikov-47's. This is a 20mm Gatling Gun that weighs five hundred kilograms (it specifies this caliber in the Battletech wiki) used against ablative armor (which is designed specifically to flake off its outer layers when hit so that it deflects energy away from the unit). The Battletech designers made the unfortunate decision of naming it the Machine Gun instead of Autocannon 1, and that is what is causing this whole debate--semantics.

Edited by FupDup, 11 April 2013 - 01:45 PM.

[Starliter]

Question: Will you re-balance the three groups: laser / rockets / ballistic weapons as is was 4 weeks ago (or as in the table-top!) the way we all loved it, not one of em totally OP?

Background:
I usually never visit the forum except for release notes.
Now I stoppt playing the game frequently because the balancing is totally out of control.

Recently, its been quite a rollercoaster with Mechwarrior. We have no chance of getting accustomed and no chance of sympathize with the characters of our mechs anymore, because they are changed around (laser / ballistic / rockets balance) EVERY week.
Just when I found the way I like it, when I thought this is the types of mechs I love playing, the roles totally change.

Everything was quite balanced between weapon groups. About 3 weeks ago LRMs got totally overpowered, two weeks ago laser weapons got overpowered, plus in addition coolant became available.
Since then me and my friend are dying instant deaths every match. Rounds become very much one-sided. Its up to whether you play an alpha-strike ppc boat and blast the s... out of someone with the blink of an eye.
I noticed not 1 or two zones are shot critical after a match. The whole mech is erradicated. Dependend on what hard-slots a mech has, one week it is either totally OP and another week dying in a hard-beat.

That is not the tactical and strategic cooperative game we were playing 4 weeks ago. It became only more annoying to a degree of simply not playing anymore, despite having premium time.

One sidenote: Take Blizzard Games or early Nintendo (s*** graphics, but the games rock as hell) as a good example for balancing and gameplay. They are the game gods of gameplay and well balance! They make carefull moves and take month years to bring these two factors to perfection, not changing the whole experience. Thats why they got a splendid reputation.

Second Sidenote: You need to water down coolant and not 'milk' players MCs too much. By the way, I would buy more if the in-game pricing wasnt so ridiculus (Example colours! Camo!). We are very aware how publishers/studios market their games and the US-Dollar/Euro Exchange Rates you are using! If it has the same price tag in USD and EUR something went commercially horrible wrong (Bad example Apple).

Since now I payed for Mechwarrior twice what a normal purchase game would cost (30 - 40 EUR) and got only a beta version. We give you the time to make it right, and your budget is now more than enough to accomplish that goal. Make it good. Make it awsome. Make it unforgettable.

A negative example for us was Battlefield 3 (the only EA game I own) where some add-ons where almost the price level of the original game. Same with Warhammer 40000 Dawn of War. At some point its become only commercial and lost its soul.
Another bad example was Mechwarrior 4 as compared to Mechwarrior 1, 2 and 3. When Microsoft took over, they just killed the essence of what Mechwarrior was about.

Some very good free to play example were Lord of the Rings and League of Legends. They did a good job regarding in-game pricing! And we did actually constantly purchase content.

Kind regards and lets hope this project will have a great future, will actually reach the highest heights of the gaming industry.

[Starliter]

Thontor, on 12 April 2013 - 12:03 PM, said:

This is an "answers" thread. Asking a question here has almost no chance of it getting answered by the devs. Unfortunately you just missed the latest Ask the Devs questions thread, which now locked and will be answered next friday. you'll have to wait about a week and a half before a new questions thread is open.

Thx

[Vulkan]

3rd person won't do a single thing to make this game accessible. Mechwarrior by its nature is not accessible, that's why it's always been niche. What a waste of time.

[Minos Murdoc]

Bryan Ekman, on 08 April 2013 - 11:36 AM, said:

Asaru: Will we be seeing the return soon of the ability to drop in premade groups of various sizes and have pugs fill out the remainder of the team like it was in closed beta? Or has there been a conscious decision to not bring this back at all?
A: This is conscious to help balance out matches. The max team size in a public match is 4 and we continue to improve the matchmaker to create a more balanced experience. When 12 v 12 rolls out, 8 player teams will be replaced by 12 player teams.

with the increase to 12v12 why will you not give us the option to have groups of 4, 6, 8 and 12. I play with a group that finds it hard to get 8 players on at times, and we normally have 4-6 people on which mean that we either have to try and sync drop (as ad 3+3 or 4+2) and 9/10 times end up against each other. You are alienating some of your player base. Why not do something similar to the 4man group.

4 mech - between 2-4 players
8 mech - between 5-8 players
12 mech - 12 players

This is one of the main reason we've had players leave as we can not play at the same time.