87 replies to this topic

[Terror Teddy]

I've been wanting a penalty system for ages. There are many ways to implement it but I really think the simplest is to simply having it affecting ALL aspects of your mech at the same time depending on heat.

If the problems accumulate in pace with heat we could have multiple effects at the same time.

-Slower targeting computer
-Faster target loss
-AMS tracking system speed loss
-Sensor range decrease
-ECM 'bubble' shrinkage due to heat affecting the ecm
-slower gyros (twist/tilt/arm)
-Acceleration/decelleration speed slowed
-Slower weapon convergence
-Heatsink efficiency less effective the higher heat you have
-Slower weapon cycle speed
-Ammo explosion risk (ammo cook off)
-Missile lock range
-Jump jet fuel recharge speed
-Jump jet misfiring
-IFF system screw up
-Vision mode malfunctions
-HUD flicker
-Sensor ghosts
-Temporary weapon shut down (disconnects from the computer)

LOTS of fun malfunction potentials.

[GODzillaGSPB]

Khanublikhan, on 11 April 2013 - 11:37 AM, said:

[...]

• Inside cockpit: visual effect of steam / heat shimmer effects in air over consoles / condensation trickles down cockpit glass, distracting warning light revolves).

[...]

I'd LOVE that. Current-gen games have a lot of those "full screen lense" effects, but there are gamers who absolutely detest them and ask for an option to turn them off. Lates example: Tomb Raider. The option was added with a patch.

They can't just put this into the game. Maybe a few of those as default, but camera-effects should be optional. People will demand it and otherwise stop the game if they get motion sickness from it. Or eye-cancer lol.

[Khanublikhan]

@ Kitk.

Thank you for showing that chart! That was intriguing to look at, to see someone elses point of view.

I noticed a few things from that.

You mentioned a movement decrease. Was that a work in progress, with you thinking about top speed only, or acceleration and torso twist as well?

Also, I noticed your movement speed decreases topped out at 20%. Was that intended to be a cumulative penalty, for each heat point passed?

Edited by Khanublikhan, 11 April 2013 - 02:10 PM.

[KitK]

Khanublikhan, on 11 April 2013 - 02:05 PM, said:

@ Kitk.

Thank you for showing that chart! That was intriguing to look at, to see someone elses point of view.

I noticed a few things from that.

You mentioned a movement decrease. Was that a work in progress, with you thinking about top speed only, or acceleration and torso twist as well?

Also, I noticed your movement speed decreases topped out at 20%. Was that intended to be a cumulative penalty, for each heat point passed?

Yeah, it is a work in progress, just some quick ideas aimed at being simple, true to table and functional in game. I had thought of twist speed and acceleration, but only in terms of negating efficencies,not so much going negative too far. Same with the 20%. The first couple of hits are just aimed at Speed Tweak. Though this one I did take into the negative. It is kind of arbitrary but seemed playable.

One interesting problem will be how fast one jumps right into the top end of the scale, as well as how much change would be constantly going on. By my suggestions, speed, fire rate, and reticle speed would be constantly in flux - it could be super annoying. There may just be too many effects jammed in there to use all the TT effect levels.

Edited by KitK, 11 April 2013 - 02:25 PM.

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

All the previous MW titles had this, so I suspect MWO will too at one point.

But hopefully it'll be a curved scale and not a linear scale like in TT. In TT, once you hit 15% heat, you started to be negatively affected. I hope they wouldn't add negative effects until 50%. I would also try to keep it very simple.

-50% heat: 10% speed reduction
-65% heat: HUD flickers
-75% heat: 25% speed reduction, electronic suites shutdown, modules shutdown, HUD jitters and flickers
-80% heat: loss of HUD, loss of thermal and NV imaging
-90% heat: 50% speed reduction, loss of C3 network, 25% chance of shutdown
-95% heat: 33% chance of ammo explosion (25% chance of Gauss rifle exploding)
-100% heat: Shutdown
-Over 100%: Internals start frying themselves even if shutdown. 1 point of damage per 2 seconds while shutdown and 2 points of damage per second if shutdown was overridden.

The dynamics of the fight and roles would change pretty drastically. Lights armed, armored, and engined to the max usually run pretty hot. Having them hit the 50% heat threshold (which quite a few do on one to two alphas) they'd basically lose their speed tweak, 75% heat would be a pretty heavy penalty, and 90% heat is basically guaranteed death. And you'd see many lights start dropping some excess weapons for heatsinks.

Large mechs like the Cataphract, Awesome, Atlas, and Stalkers wouldn't alpha all the time, every time. Because it's pretty hard to snipe when your HUD is flickering and jitters all over the place.

With a the damaging of internals even while shutdown, the quad-ERPPC Atlas, hexa-PPC stalker, or hexa-LLaser Stalker would be more hesitant to fire another alpha strike at 80% heat.

[Khanublikhan]

KitK, on 11 April 2013 - 02:23 PM, said:

Yeah, it is a work in progress, just some quick ideas aimed at being simple, true to table and functional in game. I had thought of twist speed and acceleration, but only in terms of negating efficencies,not so much going negative too far. Same with the 20%. The first couple of hits are just aimed at Speed Tweak. Though this one I did take into the negative. It is kind of arbitrary but seemed playable.

One interesting problem will be how fast one jumps right into the top end of the scale, as well as how much change would be constantly going on. By my suggestions, speed, fire rate, and reticle speed would be constantly in flux - it could be super annoying. There may just be too many effects jammed in there to use all the TT effect levels.

I was thinking about that myself. I think the high end equipment like BAP, ECM and MASC should definitely be altered in performance. Maybe the catchall of movement effects could be simply one effect chosen from a list of possibilities - making it more a random malfunction due to heat.

[DCLXVI]

Stoicblitzer, on 11 April 2013 - 11:04 AM, said:

fool me once shame on you, fool me twice.... ummmmm... ummmm...

[Khanublikhan]

JohanssenJr, on 11 April 2013 - 02:24 PM, said:

All the previous MW titles had this, so I suspect MWO will too at one point.

But hopefully it'll be a curved scale and not a linear scale like in TT. In TT, once you hit 15% heat, you started to be negatively affected. I hope they wouldn't add negative effects until 50%. I would also try to keep it very simple.

-50% heat: 10% speed reduction
-65% heat: HUD flickers
-75% heat: 25% speed reduction, electronic suites shutdown, modules shutdown, HUD jitters and flickers
-80% heat: loss of HUD, loss of thermal and NV imaging
-90% heat: 50% speed reduction, loss of C3 network, 25% chance of shutdown
-95% heat: 33% chance of ammo explosion (25% chance of Gauss rifle exploding)
-100% heat: Shutdown
-Over 100%: Internals start frying themselves even if shutdown. 1 point of damage per 2 seconds while shutdown and 2 points of damage per second if shutdown was overridden.

The dynamics of the fight and roles would change pretty drastically. Lights armed, armored, and engined to the max usually run pretty hot. Having them hit the 50% heat threshold (which quite a few do on one to two alphas) they'd basically lose their speed tweak, 75% heat would be a pretty heavy penalty, and 90% heat is basically guaranteed death. And you'd see many lights start dropping some excess weapons for heatsinks.

Large mechs like the Cataphract, Awesome, Atlas, and Stalkers wouldn't alpha all the time, every time. Because it's pretty hard to snipe when your HUD is flickering and jitters all over the place.

With a the damaging of internals even while shutdown, the quad-ERPPC Atlas, hexa-PPC stalker, or hexa-LLaser Stalker would be more hesitant to fire another alpha strike at 80% heat.

Your Keep it Simple approach is a good one, I think. Thank you for the post.