29 replies to this topic

[grayson marik]

As the current forum moderation policy seems to be to police all player made MWO projects down into the basement to die in silence, I'd like to discuss this behavior in this general forum.

As I see it:

This general forum is placed under "MWO UNIVERSE", which would validate all directly MWO related projects to be discussed here. Leagues and tournament projects are not "fan sites" for MWO! We do not provide fan blogs about how great MWO is, we organize general events for the MWO computer game!

While I do understand the need to border multi-threading for one and the same topic, I absolutely fail to see why such projects are locked away even faster than the most QQ threads about issues with the game that pop up for the 1000th time.

The value that such player created projects add to the MWO universe is such that they encurage players to commit themselves to MWO much much longer and more intense than just hobbing into matches for 1 or 2 month's and then leave the MWO train again.

The only reason for this policy could be that IGP/IGP sees those project as a direct competition to the upcoming CW and therefore instructed the moderators to be especially harsh to such project related threads.

Do you ( IGP/PGI) really think because we play in one or an other league, we wont play CW also? REALLY? *facepalm*


For those, who do not know what I am talking about :

please visit the fansite-jumpship and check out the multiple threads about:

• inofficial MWO - VOIP servers for ingame communication
  
• tournaments and new developments in such
  
• systems for ladder and planetary leagues
  
• general tips how to get a better gaming experience out of MWO than random pugging
  
• tools like player created lobbies, mechlabs etc.

Resume

As clearly stated, I think the current policy about how to deal with such player made events/tools and discussions about them is wrong.

IMHO either the general forum should allow this topics to be discussed here as all the other topics are allowed to.
Or the "Fansite Jumpship " needs to be listed almost next to the general discussion forums.


​All in all, the position of the whole "Community Hyperpulse Generator" IMHO shows IGP/PGI's attitude towards the more dedicated parts of MWO community. "Put it on the bottom, they should pay, not play (their own way)."

Edited by grayson marik, 11 April 2013 - 10:49 PM.

[AlexEss]

because they want to keep general from becoming just one big advertising board..?

All fan pages go in to the correct section on the forum.. it is just that simple. General are for talking about the game it self, not your fan-page about the game. So while you have valid points, they way you see it is simply not the way PGI see it. You are free to put a link in your sig and market it that way.

Edit: and as someone who have had several courses in the art of communication... Perhaps you woudl have abit more luck with foot traffic if you put something more then just a link in your sig. that way people will feel a lot better about clicking it.

Edited by AlexEss, 11 April 2013 - 11:05 PM.

[MadPanda]

Same goes for fan videos. They should be allowed in the GD. They don't do any harm and they roll out the first page naturally if there is nothing to discuss/comment, no harm done. The forum wasn't cluttered or anything as those threads get rarely posted. There's like me and mack and few random names who have posted video threads, let them have 15 minutes of fame in the GD. Moving them to the audio/video forum is a death blow. I created a video thread there once just to see how much views it will get there, it had like 7 views on that day and it's been a long time now and it has about 55 views (these are forum views, not youtube).

I pm'ed viterbi about this and his reply was that people who want to see videos will go to the video forum. Well that's definitely not the case. You got a ton more interest in the GD because people visit the forum. They don't visit the audio/video forum, not because they aren't interested but because they A) don't know it exist, forget that it exists, C) only check the GD cuz all topics get posted there.

[AlexEss]

problem is that if you let one part of the fan-page/made stuff in.. the rest will follow.

Once could argue that they should move the forum up a bit so it is easy to see. But i think keeping them out of the GD is a good move as it can get really cluttered very quickly

Edited by AlexEss, 11 April 2013 - 11:32 PM.

[Mk1Cursed]

Thank you for linking the fan jumpship folder, I didn't realise that was where the community VOIP threads had been hidden (they SHOULD be in "help for beginners" as far as I'm concerned. And with the forum search being broken I was struggling to give people directions to the Teamspeak servers.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Discussion of moderation always ends well

AlexEss, on 11 April 2013 - 11:32 PM, said:

problem is that if you let one part of the fan-page/made stuff in.. the trolls will follow.

fixt
imagine the penises that would flood into videos if we allowed them

[grayson marik]

Well,

AlexEss, on 11 April 2013 - 11:03 PM, said:

because they want to keep general from becoming just one big advertising board..?

All fan pages go in to the correct section on the forum.. it is just that simple. General are for talking about the game it self, not your fan-page about the game. So while you have valid points, they way you see it is simply not the way PGI see it. You are free to put a link in your sig and market it that way.

Edit: and as someone who have had several courses in the art of communication... Perhaps you woudl have abit more luck with foot traffic if you put something more then just a link in your sig. that way people will feel a lot better about clicking it.

Ok, you have some point. But I do not provide a fan page! I am no fan of MWO,but maybe thats just a matter of definition ^^ .

My point is this: The general forums ARE the point for cluttering. That is their very reason to exist. :-)
And the other point:
They let us talk about the biggest and greatest nonsense of the universe here. It is really fascinating what kind of BS sometimes is discussed here. And while they let a (example) discussion about garth's microwave go on and forth, everything remotely connected with user created content is policed to the basement right away!
An other example: We do have a game balance forum but threads get moved there either not at all or slowly.
So there IS some kind of cherry picking done on selecting which thread has to be closed/moved and which not.

And for your signature edit: yepp, you might be right on that ;-)

Edited by grayson marik, 12 April 2013 - 01:18 AM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

grayson marik, on 12 April 2013 - 01:10 AM, said:

They let us talk about the biggest and greatest nonsense of the universe here. )

except machineguns

[TruePoindexter]

MadPanda, on 11 April 2013 - 11:20 PM, said:

Same goes for fan videos. They should be allowed in the GD. They don't do any harm and they roll out the first page naturally if there is nothing to discuss/comment, no harm done. The forum wasn't cluttered or anything as those threads get rarely posted. There's like me and mack and few random names who have posted video threads, let them have 15 minutes of fame in the GD. Moving them to the audio/video forum is a death blow. I created a video thread there once just to see how much views it will get there, it had like 7 views on that day and it's been a long time now and it has about 55 views (these are forum views, not youtube).

I pm'ed viterbi about this and his reply was that people who want to see videos will go to the video forum. Well that's definitely not the case. You got a ton more interest in the GD because people visit the forum. They don't visit the audio/video forum, not because they aren't interested but because they A) don't know it exist, forget that it exists, C) only check the GD cuz all topics get posted there.

Indeed - the Fan Audio/Video forum is a wasteland. It's almost pointless to put things there. It probably doesn't help that the search function is broken.

[Purplefluffybunny]

Thank you for making this post grayson marik!

You know why they are doing this, they want a monopoly. You only need to look at NGNG and how that has been colonised by PGI, as well as all of the more popular 'public' TS3 servers, to see their intent.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

TruePoindexter, on 12 April 2013 - 01:38 AM, said:

Indeed - the Fan Audio/Video forum is a wasteland. It's almost pointless to put things there. It probably doesn't help that the search function is broken.

Its al;most pointless to do a lot of things here (saying I dont want 3rd person view comes to mind) but it doesnt stop people

[Elizander]

grayson marik, on 12 April 2013 - 01:10 AM, said:

My point is this: The general forums ARE the point for cluttering. That is their very reason to exist. :-)

I sorely disagree with this. I'd rather not have the General Forums be a cluster**** of random things that just make it a waste of time (more so than it was before proper moderation was applied).

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Elizander, on 12 April 2013 - 01:47 AM, said:

I sorely disagree with this. I'd rather not have the General Forums be a cluster**** of random things that just make it a waste of time (more so than it was before proper moderation was applied).

Ah, like it is on the weekends

or like this:

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 12 April 2013 - 01:50 AM.

[AlexEss]

So how about this...

They pin a post in the general forum that have a link to the fansub forum...? That would increase the foot traffic to the fansub forum without having 2.5 mil fan projects cluttering up the general (it is bad enough as it is)

Would that work?

Edited by AlexEss, 12 April 2013 - 02:03 AM.

[Elizander]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 12 April 2013 - 01:49 AM, said:

Ah, like it is on the weekends

or like this:

Did you use your phone to take that shot?

[Purplefluffybunny]

Oh! Just to add!. I have been told that the decisions to move certain posts, those that mention fan projects, particularly the third party leagues that work off MWO (i.e. relevant to MWO), came from the top i.e. an order most likely from Russ or Bryan.

Unfortunately there has been a little bias as most of us who were involved with MWLL are being overly targeted, some would say persecuted (just run the stats on these forums to see that) by PGI (let them burn eh Bryan?).

I feel sorry for our volunteer moderators, I believe some are actively sticking up for us so many thanks to them.

Edited by Purplefluffybunny, 12 April 2013 - 02:10 AM.

[grayson marik]

AlexEss, on 12 April 2013 - 02:03 AM, said:

So how about this...

They pin a post in the general forum that have a link to the fansub forum...? That would increase the foot traffic to the fansub forum without having 2.5 mil fan projects cluttering up the general (it is bad enough as it is)

Would that work?

Kind of. I'd like to have a Post with a short description and a link to the sub forums topic. but not pinned.
Just have it bumped on the general forum, whenever a post is added to the linked thread in the sub forum.

This would serve 2 things:
1. active topics in subforums would be more available to public
2. without a pinning madness in the general forums

Or a general news in the forums page where right on top, all topics with new posts are listed to a user. no matter from which subforum.

Purplefluffybunny, on 12 April 2013 - 02:09 AM, said:

Oh! Just to add!. I have been told that the decisions to move certain posts, those that mention fan projects, particularly the third party leagues that work off MWO (i.e. relevant to MWO), came from the top i.e. an order most likely from Russ or Bryan.

Unfortunately there has been a little bias as most of us who were involved with MWLL are being overly targeted, some would say persecuted (just run the stats on these forums to see that) by PGI (let them burn eh Bryan?).

I feel sorry for our volunteer moderators, I believe some are actively sticking up for us so many thanks to them.

Source?

While i absolutely fear, that PGI/IGP are under the impression that player run events do compete with PGI/IGP, I sincerely hope I am wrong!

Edited by grayson marik, 12 April 2013 - 03:00 AM.

[Moromillas]

So you think there might be a processing problem with moderation? Usually they post why the thread was locked, they didn't post anything? I can't imagine what rule might have been broken.

[grayson marik]

ahh Moro, they do post why they lock or move something. But still one could disagree, if a topic about something like "New Planetary Leage needs all Houses" belongs into fansite jumpship. And it bothers me that especially posts regarding content hitting remotely the direction of CW seem to be locked/moved even faster than others.

Lets bring it to the point:

The swiftness of moderation against player created content for MWO, suggests that PGI/IGP consider this content to be competing against MWO's upcomming CW.

Furthermore the announced implementation of lobbies that will explicitly NOT cater to the organized parts of MWO's community ( no group vs specific other group play), seem to make clear that PGI/IGP not only not supports organized team play but actively tries to prevent any kind of organized group play next to MWO's features.

If one takes into account how horribly simple it would be to at least provide some" group invites group for matchup" feature, that gives really something to discuss!

Because after all, PGI/IGP is limiting MWO's audience by doing so and is even discouraging their most dedicated and most paying branch of customers!

Edited by grayson marik, 12 April 2013 - 02:52 AM.

[Purplefluffybunny]

grayson marik, on 12 April 2013 - 02:27 AM, said:

[...]
Source?
[...]

I really don't want to get anyone into trouble so I can't name names. Yes, I do find that frustrating as it leaves me open to much denigration.