31 replies to this topic

[mekabuser]

We know the old system didnt work as intended.. My point is, even if it did, it sure seemed to me to be a simplistic immersion killing implementation of simulating how mechs interacted with the enviroment and each other..
Since we are being forced to play a combat game that involves , oh about 200 "collisions" per match... without collisions for the better part of the year, what exactly do you have planned...
?

How about an update for the collisions mechanic WIP?

Its my opinion far to few people realize that in the mechwarrior universe , collisions are everything..
They are immersion, they are strategy,, they are cool.. THink of all the iconic Battletech imagery, most of them are depicting collisions of one variety or another..

I think its borderling insane to state that collisions are something we will see after launch.. Ive said it before, but I think a fair analogy is to release a racing game<psuedo sim> with out drafting or drift..

So, how about a little info since we have to stand in the corner for another 6 months min.
Anyone else long for some type of complex collision dfa models that can actually attract players because .. " hey giant robots smashing into each other is cool dontcha know?"

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Such a long thread title...

[mekabuser]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 09 April 2013 - 09:55 AM, said:

Such a long thread title...

twas as long as it needed to be.
NOt nearly as long as we have to wait for collisions.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

mekabuser, on 09 April 2013 - 09:58 AM, said:

twas as long as it needed to be.
NOt nearly as long as we have to wait for collisions.

Point to you sir.

[Jetfire]

I think the key is 2 parts.

Knockdown:
Needs to be based on momentum, IE Mass x Velocity vs Mass x Velocity. Cryengine should be capable of this kind of physics.

Collision damage/DFA:
Damage conversion based on momentum. This is the hardest part to get right but is critical for DFA to work. Also likely why it is getting put on hold so long.

[irony1999]

Didn't they say in the #35 ask the dev q/a that its not coming till post launch (Fall/Winter 2013 at the earliest)?

[Megalosauroid]

irony1999, on 09 April 2013 - 10:04 AM, said:

Didn't they say in the #35 ask the dev q/a that its not coming till post launch (Fall/Winter 2013 at the earliest)?

Yeah, hence the "what are you planning to do in the next 7 months" part.

[General Taskeen]

The knockdown by running into people was exploitable. It allowed unscrupulous trolling by team mates to run into other team mates, and for enemies to perma-knockdown anyone.

My assumption is that knockdown as it was seen before mayl occur by heavy hitting weapons, like MW3 and MW4 based on certain factors. I assume collission damage itself will be tweaked, so ramming into someone will cause inreased damage (but not actual knocking them over) and probably Jump Jetting on to someone as well will have increased damage. That in itself would pave the way for testing grappling, punching, or attacks with melee weapons.

Edited by General Taskeen, 09 April 2013 - 10:15 AM.

[irony1999]

Megalosauroid, on 09 April 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

Yeah, hence the "what are you planning to do in the next 7 months" part.

Based off their answer, nothing. They're not looking at it till after launch.

[malibu43]

Megalosauroid, on 09 April 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

Yeah, hence the "what are you planning to do in the next 7 months" part.

My guess would be "work on implementing knock downs along with all the other stuff we have to work on." What kind of answer are you looking for? A detailed timeline with week by week tasks that it takes to get knockdown implemented?

Or do you just want a command chair post with a quick update on knockdowns? I think there are a lot of other things coming a lot sooner that I'd rather see command chair posts about. Given that it's 7 months away, there probably isn't a lot to update on at this point.

Edited by malibu43, 09 April 2013 - 10:23 AM.

[Megalosauroid]

If you guys have a problem with the title you should take it up with OP, i was merely answering irony1999's question.

[mekabuser]

Jetfire, on 09 April 2013 - 10:03 AM, said:

I think the key is 2 parts.

Knockdown:
Needs to be based on momentum, IE Mass x Velocity vs Mass x Velocity. Cryengine should be capable of this kind of physics.

Collision damage/DFA:
Damage conversion based on momentum. This is the hardest part to get right but is critical for DFA to work. Also likely why it is getting put on hold so long.

if they do indeed have something very nice in the works then i can completely deal with the timeline.. A rehash of what we had , no.
lets hope theyre working on something like you outlined.

irony1999, on 09 April 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

Based off their answer, nothing. They're not looking at it till after launch.

lets hope thats NOT the answer.. I assumed we wont be seeing collisions till after launch., but they will be working on it till then. Not.. theyre not touching it till after launch.. If thats the case, then I think its a scary proposition when we would actually see collisions in game.

[Belorion]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 09 April 2013 - 09:55 AM, said:

Such a long thread title...

I didn't even know they could be that long...

[Megalosauroid]

mekabuser, on 09 April 2013 - 11:24 AM, said:

if they do indeed have something very nice in the works then i can completely deal with the timeline.. A rehash of what we had , no.
lets hope theyre working on something like you outlined.


lets hope thats NOT the answer.. I assumed we wont be seeing collisions till after launch., but they will be working on it till then. Not.. theyre not touching it till after launch.. If thats the case, then I think its a scary proposition when we would actually see collisions in game.

If this is the case then i think we will see collisions neverTM

wait... i think i did that TM thing wrong

[Tennex]

the way i see it the just have more time to work on netcode/hit detection now

[Xizore]

General Taskeen, on 09 April 2013 - 10:14 AM, said:

The knockdown by running into people was exploitable. It allowed unscrupulous trolling by team mates to run into other team mates, and for enemies to perma-knockdown anyone.

Running through each other is exploitable, especially by light mechs that move faster anyways. It's still possible for teammates to troll you through Friendly Fire, and all-chat in game. Someone FF me and then claimed ecm was to blame for his stupid action.

Edit: My point is, if these concerns were the cause of collision removal, then the problem really hasn't been solved yet.

Edited by Xizore, 09 April 2013 - 12:42 PM.

[Kristov Kerensky]

I think they'll spend the next 6 months getting the netcode working properly so that collisions can be implemented properly purely in the what is where and when so that you don't what we saw in CB happening, a Mech that you see as 20m away somehow collided with you at that distance and you both fall down.

Then they'll start working on the actual physics of the collisions mass, velocity, what hits where, how much damage to impart to whom, calculating knockdown odds and so on.

What will they TELL us in this same time span? On collisions, probably not much, but we'll be getting other aspects of the actual core game between now and then, so we're not going to be lacking on information, it's just not always going to be the information we want

[NinetyProof]

They pretty much said: Not Right Now.

What developer in their right minds is going to get into nitty gritty with something that is 6 months down the road? Seriously?

So you can trounce it out in 9 months and say: Hey, 9 months ago you said X, now we are getting Y ... come here so I can smack you in the face with this flounder.

Really? Why would they want to even expose themselves? Furthermore, this is like the 3rd thread I have seen on this ... you are not posting multiple threads are you?

[DarkDevilDancer]

I wasnt playing when it was in game but it sounds like they had great reasons to remove it, i'd much rather have a fully working feature than something thats open to exploits.

Sure i wanna do some highlander burials with my new toy but when i cave in someones cockpit i want it to work properly first time every time.

[Joe Mallad]

Well... Early on, they had said we would get a CHARGE module that when equipped and used, it would allow your mech to do twice as much collision damage while your mech took less damage than it would normally take. I can see mechanics like this being one reason why its taking longer than we would like. I'd also like to see a module that would allow someone to use DFA to do twice as much damage while taking less damage than normal.

Edited by Yoseful Mallad, 09 April 2013 - 01:13 PM.