70 replies to this topic

[One Medic Army]

Royalewithcheese, on 19 April 2013 - 06:45 AM, said:

Have you seen the heat generation on those things?

It's 20 SHS to heat neutrality. Per AC/2.

A 4 AC/2 build would need 40 "true" DHS to run heat neutral, and will overheat in ~10 seconds with a 14 DHS build.

[Jasen]

watch the video I posted on page 2... that dude was overheating in a few seconds. (wasn't doing great damage either, which is why I chose to solo him in a jenner)

[Jonathan Paine]

I don't agree, Bishop. Fast fire lets you keep close to the same fire rate with one less ac2. Leaves six tons for other gear.

[Tekadept]

I dont think AC2's need a nerf, yes they can be macro'd. but you can stick your tongue to the side and click like mad as well for the same effect. If the argument that people who can macro have an advantage and hence the AC2 needs nerfing, then where do we stop? do we nerf people who have High end Gfx cards as well who have a smoother gameplay experience over somebody who struggles to get 20fps?? the macro for UAC5 was a different story though.

BTW i dont use 6 AC2 jagermechs let alone a macro for em.

[Culler]

Bishop Steiner, on 19 April 2013 - 06:54 AM, said:

which is the trick. Mashing down 8 seconds of fire on a moving opponent, shooting back, accurately. 8 Seconds, conversely, is about what it takes to core out any Jagermech made with a decent payload. And it's also actually better to NOT master it, as the Fast Fire overheats you faster, largely negating anything from Cool Run.

I wouldn't strictly say it's better to not master anything. Sure, you get more heat from fast fire but also more DPS. The 8 seconds includes all masteries with basics doubled. You can always not hold the button down when you get close to overheat, it results in the same total number of shots over any period of time but fast-fire lets you do more earlier with less later rather than being even over the time.

[Bishop Steiner]

Jonathan Paine, on 19 April 2013 - 06:59 AM, said:

I don't agree, Bishop. Fast fire lets you keep close to the same fire rate with one less ac2. Leaves six tons for other gear.

That is true, I'm talking with all 6, where I regularly watch my lancemate overheat in 5-6 seconds.

[Endgame124]

I actually think the AC/2 could use a slight stealth buff. 1 ton AC 2 Ammo is substantially more than you need for a TT game, even if you're running more than 1 ac/2. In MWO, they doubled armor AND made the AC/2 fire silly fast (which I appreciate), but they only gave it 50% more ammo. At the very least, the AC/2 should get 100 shots / ton, if not 150 shots / ton.

[Loler skates]

Ragashar, on 19 April 2013 - 06:18 AM, said:

You guys do realise thay the AC2 has a ridiculous firing rate? You can get 16 points of damage from one of them in the 4 seconds it takes to fire a Gauss or AC20... And with the long range it is actually really good on paper... The fact is that you need bullets and lots of them and the damage is spread all over the Mech, but coming face to face with one AC2 boat its not fun.

I like my N5 Dragon running with 3 AC2's... It ain't the most efficient build but it sure is fun and dakka-dakka. And it tends to raise the heat level unlike other slug throwers in the game. So it is in no way OP, but the good thing is that it is not totally irrelevant.

At the cost of **** loads of heat, yes...

Edited by Loler skates, 19 April 2013 - 07:14 AM.

[Hedonism Robot]

There is a chance the OP is serious and doesnt realize the macro on firing these weapons is entirely for look and fell, does nothing if not make you output in dmg a little lower.

[tarlison2k11]

here we go again I got killed by an AC 2 nerf it .... the shame factor is too high .....nerf the SHAME FACTOR

[Jonathan Paine]

As long as the "I got killed by xyz" is balanced by cries of "xyz" and "yyy" and and and... we'll be ok.

[RainbowToh]

Sephlock, on 19 April 2013 - 06:44 AM, said:

They need to lower the tonnage on ac/2s (lets say... by HALF ) so that my Jager DD can get MOAR DAKKA.

You can only put 6 of them anyway. It is better to ask for more ammo per ton

[Willie Sauerland]

The only mech I use the AC/2 on is my Jager A.
But I also have the joy of 4xSRM6s and speed to go with the 2 AC/2
to get behind whatever I am going to kill.
It is a fun mech to run but I wouldn't run it competitively.

[MustrumRidcully]

AC/2 in the table top did too little damage for their weight. in MW:O, they deal too much damage at too much heat for their size. Half the cooldown, half the heat per shot, and maybe you get a weapon that's somewhat reasonable. But in the end, it doesn'T matter, because high alpha damage builds work better in MW:O. You got 50+ points of heat to fill, better do it quickly before the enemy pumped you full with his weapons.

[Royalewithcheese]

Culler, on 19 April 2013 - 06:51 AM, said:

Yes, it's way too hot. The best build I can come up with on 5x AC/2s gets you about 8 seconds of constant fire before overheating, after mastering your pilot trees. Now, that is 160 damage in 8 seconds, which is a lot. That's enough to kill any mech if you can deliver it accurately.

In theory, definitely. I'm not sure how I feel about dakka builds (vs. alpha builds) on the jagger yet - I'm trying one out with 3xUAC/5 and I'm really not a fan of how you have to stay pointed at the thing you're trying to kill if you want to be laying down constant damage.

[Willie Sauerland]

MustrumRidcully, on 19 April 2013 - 09:34 AM, said:

AC/2 in the table top did too little damage for their weight. in MW:O, they deal too much damage at too much heat for their size. Half the cooldown, half the heat per shot, and maybe you get a weapon that's somewhat reasonable. But in the end, it doesn'T matter, because high alpha damage builds work better in MW:O. You got 50+ points of heat to fill, better do it quickly before the enemy pumped you full with his weapons.

So, buff the AC/2 by fixing the meta?

[Major Scumbag]

Like everything. It has its strenghts and weakness. Fast rate of fire and long range. Only 2 damage per ammo shot, runs very hot and needs tons of heatsinks. Wich takes up tonnage that could have used for more ammo. By the time AC/2's done 16 damage. There is a good chance you are running hot if not shutdown. The guass is 1 heat but waits for the re-cycle. To me its about even.

Edited by Major Scumbag, 19 April 2013 - 09:52 AM.

[Trauglodyte]

Dropping the heat down to 0.66-0.75 per shot would be fine. No need to change the firing rate as the other ACs, save the 10, have a DPS of 4.0-5.0

[ArmageddonKnight]

Some of you on here may have seen me ingame, since the jagermech was introduced iv been playing only my JM6-DD, its setup with Ac2's using macrofire.

i before the HSR i NEVER met any1 else running a macro fire ac2 setup, since the HSR i have seen a couple, its to be expected ofcourse..til lthose people realise ow awfull a Ac2 boat actually is.

They sound cool...they look cool ..but ..they run HOT ..burn through ammo like crazy, and in more casses than not, can be beat 1 on 1 with alpha builds. They can be used, and u can get some nice kills, since hte high RoF can mean u get the lats hit in ..but to boat 5 or 6 Ac2's u hav to sacrifice loads of armo, and loads of speed..and u end up making urslef a walking ammo crate. Not only that, even though the DPs is nice, by the time u have done neough damage to equal or beat a alpha build , ur unlikely to still be aiming and getitng all shots to hit the point ur trying to hit ..i.e CT.

A AC2 boat ist not an effectiv build ..its a fun one.

They do NOT need a nerf, infact they despritly need a buff ...not in damage ..but in Ammo stack size and reduced heat, that way they may well be a much more effective build to be used as supression, and if buffed enough ..maybe even be able ot go toe to toe with alpha builds.

Till then ..enjoy the dakka dakka, but dont expect great performance ..its all show no go bassicaly.

Edited by ArmageddonKnight, 19 April 2013 - 10:12 AM.

[DrSecretStache]

Sheezus man. I mean, it's an incredible weapon, but it hardly needs a nerf. Just cause I've done 850 dmg in a a match with a quad build doesn't mean it needs nerfs

But seriously. Jagger -s. XL300. quads, and 8 frikken tons of ammo. I eat up every scrap of it.

It's fun, it slaughters light mechs, and it keeps poptarts annoyed as ever. It's insanely fun, even with just two fire groups.

But it has so many downsides, like the insane heat it generates, and the lack of a big alpha, that it really needs a buff. The heat I can live with, but if they even so much as dropped the weight by half a ton, that would mean I could have 10 tons of ammo. I'd be in mech heaven.