51 replies to this topic

[Sybreed]

Pepperidge Farm remembers..


Although, a mech game with only brawling isn't more balanced IMO.

MWO, if balanced, is a perfect mix of brawling, sniping, LRM firing, scouting.

Right now, it's sniping, only.

[Mawai]

Ghost Bear, on 19 April 2013 - 11:01 AM, said:

When mechs brawled?.. god.. it brings a tear to my eye.

The golden age of Mwo.

The match I just finished was a melee between both teams mostly in the 100 to 400m range ... moving in and out of cover ... firing ... trying to focus targets without getting exposed ... it was a good match (ended 8 to 4 I think) ... it was a brawl (at least by my definition). On the other hand, if you mean mechs running straight at each other while firing at point blank ranges less than 100m ... then it wasn't ... but that is pretty boring for me anyway.

How do you define a "brawl"?

[Mawai]

Sybreed, on 19 April 2013 - 02:06 PM, said:

Pepperidge Farm remembers..


Although, a mech game with only brawling isn't more balanced IMO.

MWO, if balanced, is a perfect mix of brawling, sniping, LRM firing, scouting.

Right now, it's sniping, only.

Is a long range mech automatically a sniper? At what range does sniping turn into brawling?

Most of the time the difference relies on using terrain to close the distance with your opponents without taking fire so you can engage at closer ranges. The weapons you put on the mech do not control this ... the pilot does. It's just too bad most folks take the most direct line toward the enemy rather than trying to choose the best line to get them to the range they would prefer.

All of the small scale maps are easy to get into a fight at ranges less than 270m without being blown away first. Alpine and Tourmaline need some thought on how to move and some idea of where your opponent is but you can usually still close the range to 500m or less before they have a shot.

[Sybreed]

Mawai, on 19 April 2013 - 02:20 PM, said:

Is a long range mech automatically a sniper? At what range does sniping turn into brawling?

Most of the time the difference relies on using terrain to close the distance with your opponents without taking fire so you can engage at closer ranges. The weapons you put on the mech do not control this ... the pilot does. It's just too bad most folks take the most direct line toward the enemy rather than trying to choose the best line to get them to the range they would prefer.

All of the small scale maps are easy to get into a fight at ranges less than 270m without being blown away first. Alpine and Tourmaline need some thought on how to move and some idea of where your opponent is but you can usually still close the range to 500m or less before they have a shot.

In short: yes

Take other FPS games for examples, like CoD, CS or even Tribes: Ascend

Snipers that get closed quarter kill with their sniper rifles are still considered snipers.

It's just that in MWO, sniping weapons are a lot more effective at brawling.

[Ranek Blackstone]

Willie Sauerland, on 19 April 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

I disagree.
If PGIGP would change the meta by rewarding team play
instead of the almighty KDR, things would change
significantly...

How would you shift the meta to encourage team play I wonder?

Sniping is a fad for a bit longer then most, just because both the Highlander and the upcoming blackjack both have jumpjets. Once people remember the fine art of using cover to hide their approach, jump sniping will taper off because they are getting killed more then they kill.

[Willie Sauerland]

Ranek Blackstone, on 19 April 2013 - 02:29 PM, said:

How would you shift the meta to encourage team play I wonder?

Sniping is a fad for a bit longer then most, just because both the Highlander and the upcoming blackjack both have jumpjets. Once people remember the fine art of using cover to hide their approach, jump sniping will taper off because they are getting killed more then they kill.

The game is supposed to be centered around team warfare.
Make the roles viable and more people will play them.
Why do people not scout?
Because a scout is not going to get the damage or kills
a brawler is going to get which means they can't level
their scouting mechs as fast or generate the necessary
CBills that their high DPS teammate can.

There is simply no real incentive to play anything other
than the FOTM builds or the high DPS builds.

[Lord de Seis]

PPCwarrior is faaaaaaaaaar more fun.....
*note sarcasim*

[Ranek Blackstone]

Willie Sauerland, on 19 April 2013 - 02:32 PM, said:

The game is supposed to be centered around team warfare.
Make the roles viable and more people will play them.
Why do people not scout?
Because a scout is not going to get the damage or kills
a brawler is going to get which means they can't level
their scouting mechs as fast or generate the necessary
CBills that their high DPS teammate can.

There is simply no real incentive to play anything other
than the FOTM builds or the high DPS builds.

Didn't answer my question. I know why people aren't being team players, but how does one shift the meta to make it better?

Scouting was always a bit of a "what the hell?" sort of thing in my mind really. Once you found the enemy team, scouts are no longer needed, and none of the maps actually need dedicated scouts. Maps like Frozen City and Caustic are simply too small to need them, while Alpine and the desert map have fairly long sight lines that negate the need for it. A large urban map would be better suited for the role, since all the cover would make it easy to loose track of the enemy, but until we get one, scouting isn't going to be too important. The other problem of course is how to reward it. The "spotted" bonus is a nice touch, but there really isn't a way to reward a scout for doing his job.

Giving caps in both Assault and Conquest larger rewards for the capper would be a nice start to making lights more valuable. Just flank around the firing line and take the base, but it's a slippery slope on finding just the right amount of reward with out making it better then getting into a fight in the first place. Generating points for capturing bases in Conquest would make the capping more attractive, and adding a constant tick to your score for every base you helped cap (linking score to payouts) would be a good thing IMO. Less focus on combat and more on objectives, which will benefit the lighter, faster mechs.

Edited by Ranek Blackstone, 19 April 2013 - 02:46 PM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

They need to limit customization. That is the end all be all answer.

Yes there will still best better variants and you will still see more of certain weapons. But in the end the gap between the worst trial mech and the best customized mech won't be as pronounced as it is now.

[Tezcatli]

Back in the "good ole days". It felt like there was no point in having any extended range weapons. Since most encounters occurred at under 600m. But now everyone is going a little crazy with the PPC thing.

Balance isn't when one weapon is dominating the battlefield. But at the same time it doesn't mean it should be nerfed into the ground. To me they should increase it's heat back to what it was.

The PPC was always portrayed as a deadly weapon in the novels. But not one they would just stack. ;o

[James The Fox Dixon]

Back in the "good ole days" repair and rearm costs, for missile dependent builds, were the worst of your problems, unless you were a founder or bought an xp/money making mech. I don't miss the repair and rearm costs in the slightest.

Edited by James The Fox Dixon, 19 April 2013 - 04:51 PM.

[KingDerp]

Voridan Atreides, on 19 April 2013 - 11:02 AM, said:

I think the Golden Age will come when CW rolls around.

And then you woke up, realizing it is Nov. 2013 and CW is still not online
and the HUD bugs are still present...