64 replies to this topic

[Neveda]

Hm. My issue with the Raven 2X is why would I pick it over a jenner? It has the same number of hardpoints the same max armor values with a smaller max engine size and no jump jets. There is very little a Raven 2X can do that A jenner can't also do better, or at least the same. When judging a 'mech I tend to look at not what it can do in general, but by what it can do uniquely.

There are two things that the raven 2x has that the Jenner K (the closest jenner analoge) does not: It has slightly different hardpoint locations (missile move to a side, and energy hardpoints moved to a torso), and it has more missile tubes.
For the most part, on a light 'mech, I prefer my hardpoints to be in the arms. For lasers at least. I almost never loose my arms, and if I loose a side torso, I'm dead anyway. The arms grant the advantage of extra mobility with just about no penalties for a light 'mech. The important change is the missile hardpoint difference. The raven 2x has far more space for missile launchers and more tubes from which to launch them. Now even still this only changes a few things. For SRMs it allows you to mount an ASRM6, something that none of the Jenners can, and the tubes allow you to use it at full effectiveness. for LRMs it allows you to mount an ALRM10 and above and a standard LRM 15 and above. I... don't like LRMs on a 'mech like that but you could. The main problem is that it does mean you have to fire in increments of six missiles, but that's still better than the Jenners increments of four.

I was honestly hoping that the 2x would have a little more armor than the Jenner, that would be a nice balance, I think. Make it more of the slower tankier light. But... it doesn't. I also don't believe that neither Jenners nor Ravens have received Quirks (please correct me if I am wrong, as I am very much interested in seeing them.) so really, unless I really want a missile system of three crits or more, I'd take the Jenner.

But... if you need the 2x to elite your 3L or 4x (I love me ballistic lights. Say what you will, but they are a lot of fun.) it's good to have a few ideas of what you can do with a variant, even if what it can uniquely do isn't that great.

[Deathlike]

The Raven's torsos are harder to hit than the Jenner... which for Jenners is just a very large CT.

There are reasons why the Jenner-K is better than the Raven-2X in general, but that is more or less related to the fact that the Jenner-K is simply be faster and more mobile (especially with JJs).

The overall differences relative to the hardpoint system and location is a non-issue.. there are more apparent outside issues that makes this straight comparison impossible... but this thread isn't about what mech/variant is better. This is about making the best of a bad situation.

Edited by Deathlike, 29 April 2013 - 04:05 PM.

[Phoenix Gray]

Deathlike, on 27 April 2013 - 04:48 PM, said:

The Jenner-K is the closest equivalent ... and still superior.




A Raven hero is coming... these tweaks are done in conjunction with a hero mech launch... so it's not too far off.

Yes, but it's a Liao hero mech, which means its most effective attack is when the pilot climbs out of his mech, in your bedroom window, and knifes you in your sleep...

[1453 R]

Heh, I've addressed the point already, Neveda. Deathlike answered it as well - this isn't a "here's why you should buy an RVN-2X" guide, it's a "here's what you can do if you have one and can't/won't sell it for some reason."

I know many/most players would prefer to GXP their Ravens to Elite status - 28k GXP doesn't cost too much on a conversion weekend, and there's a number of players who would rather burn a few dollars than put up with the 2X or 4X variants on the road to their 3L's Speed Tweak. For those who, for whatever reason, want or need to grind it out on the 2X itself, here's an idea.

Here's another one - cheaper than the design in my original post or the dual large laser design from Delchev I've been running recently due to no advanced construction materials beyond DHS (a QoL choice I really can't not recommend), but not much more powerful than a stock 2X. Realistically...the 'Mech needs all the help it can get, and since it just cannot go fast, then one may as well err on the side of firepower, ne? If you can't use a Jenner - which is a prerequisite to this little write-up actually being helpful to you - then there's some ideas in this thread that may help.

Edited by 1453 R, 29 April 2013 - 06:53 PM.

[Deathlike]

1453 R, on 29 April 2013 - 06:14 PM, said:

Here's another one - cheaper than the design in my original post or the dual large laser design from Delchev I've been running recently due to no advanced construction materials beyond DHS (a QoL choice I really can't not recommend), but not much more powerful than a stock 2X. Realistically...the 'Mech needs all the help it can get, and since it just cannot go fast, then one may as well err on the side of firepower, ne? If you can't use a Jenner - which is a prerequisite to this little write-up actually being helpful to you - then there's some ideas in this thread that may help.

I forget that the 210XL is the default 3L engine... anyways, used endo and added more HS:
RVN-2X

The extra HS on the left arm could go away, for the purposes of armor if one wished.

[J I N]

Hey Guys,
you got some nice builds in here.
I'm usually playing a 3L mith 2x LL and 2x Streaks, but yesterday i switched to double ER-PPC and its quite some fun.
20 Damage at one Point, yeehaw!
Yesterday i faced a Highlander and a Jager in close combat on this really hot map and disarmed both. ;-D

The 2x should be able to handle the heat of the weapons even better, because of the missing ECM:
RVN-2X - PPC Sniper

Otherwise I'd recommend 2x LL and a SRM6 for high damage up to ~800m.

Haha found this build in the Medium section^^

POOTYTANGASAUR, on 27 April 2013 - 06:23 PM, said:

Raven 2X 3 PPCs - I was hoping to fit 4 but its impossible. This is the least viable and stupidest build i have had yet. But running it makes me lol every time.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...702d356f51234a6

Edited by JIN1987, 30 April 2013 - 02:35 AM.

[Leiska]

JIN1987, on 30 April 2013 - 02:26 AM, said:

Hey Guys,
you got some nice builds in here.
I'm usually playing a 3L mith 2x LL and 2x Streaks, but yesterday i switched to double ER-PPC and its quite some fun.
20 Damage at one Point, yeehaw!

I tried putting 2x ERPPC on my 2X but found to run too hot. A single ERPPC allows me to snipe continuously and a LL gives the added punch at shorter ranges. It's surpisisingly effective but a completely different animal from your typical speedy light (210XL gives a top speed of ~97 kph).

[Deathlike]

JIN1987, on 30 April 2013 - 02:26 AM, said:

Hey Guys,
you got some nice builds in here.
I'm usually playing a 3L mith 2x LL and 2x Streaks, but yesterday i switched to double ER-PPC and its quite some fun.
20 Damage at one Point, yeehaw!
Yesterday i faced a Highlander and a Jager in close combat on this really hot map and disarmed both. ;-D

The 2x should be able to handle the heat of the weapons even better, because of the missing ECM:
RVN-2X - PPC Sniper

Otherwise I'd recommend 2x LL and a SRM6 for high damage up to ~800m.

Haha found this build in the Medium section^^

Improved on your build:
RVN-2X

Used FF because you have the slots, and managed to increase the engine with some minor armor reduction and increase heat efficiency.

Did not touch the other linked config...

The Raven-2X has to have a closer mentality to a Medium Mech than it is a light...

[1453 R]

Quote

The Raven-2X has to have a closer mentality to a Medium Mech than it is a light

Exactly. This is why I've come to the conclusion that the 245XL is not just unnecessary, but an out-and-out mistake on this chassis. 125 with a 245-rated engine and Speed Tweak is still slow - you're being outmatched by un-tweaked Cicadas at that point. Hell, there are Centurions and Trebuchets that can keep up with you at that speed. There's no reason to waste the C-bills or the tonnage on that extra engine cap. Keep it 200 or above to make the heat sink issue suck less, but you need MOARGUNZ and a very well-developed sense of paranoia to make this machine work. Funnily enough, paranoia is a prime piloting requirement for most of the medium class.

[Ramien]

Delchev, on 22 April 2013 - 12:33 PM, said:

For those who have good aim the build below (2xLL + 2xML + SRM4) will work better due to better threat at range. Same alpha, same heat efficiency.
SRM4 is actually superior to SRM6 in most respects. Checkout forums for explanation.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...61d439505049f2d

You are welcome.

This is the build I've been using with my 2x, pretty much down to the armor placement. Biggest concern has been heat management for me, since I always get tempted to lay in with the larges while I wait for the mediums and srm cooldown to finish. I'd upgrade to ERLL for a longer-range punch, but I'm still too trigger-happy.

[Buckminster]

I'm a bit of a speed freak in my Ravens, so I do stick with the 245XL. But I finally found something that isn't just a boat of medium lasers. Two large lasers and a streak - the two LLs provide a lot of punch, and give a lot of range that the MLs didn't have. And the streaks just provide a nice little finishing touch, great against lights and at finding their way to the torso of damaged heavies and assaults.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d6b40c6f822b523

First match in it was fantastic - River City, and we ended up in a shootout across the upper bridge. The two LLs really let me put a lot of damage on mechs that were trying to snipe, and adding in the Streak made it a great finisher if someone decided to try and rush us. 1 kill, 7 assists, 400+ damage - probably the best I've ever done in a 2X.

Edited by Buckminster, 01 May 2013 - 03:58 AM.

[StalaggtIKE]

Nice read. Also some good points. Will you be doing a series?

[ApolloKaras]

StalaggtIKE, on 01 May 2013 - 04:46 AM, said:

Nice read. Also some good points. Will you be doing a series?

I'm with you on that 1453 did a hell of a job.

I didn't mean to come off as "OMG JENNER RULEZ" in my previous post, sorry if it came off that way lol. This was a very good write up about a mech that many have issues with setting up and piloting.

[1453 R]

Heh...a series is unlikely. I had a particular soft spot for the 2X as it was the second 'Mech I ever bought, and furthermore it actually had the sorts of hardpoints a 'Mech of its type needs to repurpose itself. I don't make a habit of buying terrible 'Mechs and trying to fix them, given my limited playtime and thus C-bills in the game. I'd like to do more, but any further BMA posts would be purely theoretical and thus not worth much.

This may change - may - when the Blackjacks hit, as I have a sneaky little itch to try one out and also have a suspicion that the community at large will despise the things given their inevitably low engine cap and low maximum weight. A 45-ton 'Mech limited to 220 or lower engines, if I recall my formula correctly and PGI doesn't change anything, is not going to be a popular choice 'round these parts.

[TVMA Doc]

Buckminster, on 01 May 2013 - 03:57 AM, said:

I'm a bit of a speed freak in my Ravens, so I do stick with the 245XL. But I finally found something that isn't just a boat of medium lasers. Two large lasers and a streak - the two LLs provide a lot of punch, and give a lot of range that the MLs didn't have. And the streaks just provide a nice little finishing touch, great against lights and at finding their way to the torso of damaged heavies and assaults.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...d6b40c6f822b523

First match in it was fantastic - River City, and we ended up in a shootout across the upper bridge. The two LLs really let me put a lot of damage on mechs that were trying to snipe, and adding in the Streak made it a great finisher if someone decided to try and rush us. 1 kill, 7 assists, 400+ damage - probably the best I've ever done in a 2X.

It's funny, but I feel the same way. The 245 engine is a bit of a liability for more open maps and when I run into a Jenner, 3L, etc. I'm in trouble in the 2X. However River City seems perfectly suited to a "sort of fast" Raven.

I just had a match of conquest during with I managed to rack up 500+ points and 3 kills-along with ending up being the only surviving member of my team with 3 heavy and up mechs trying to chase me down at the end. The 124 KPH tweaked speed assured the win, especially with the two ER LLs keeping those long range snipers "honest" (behind cover).

[Buckminster]

TVMA Doc, on 16 May 2013 - 03:08 PM, said:

It's funny, but I feel the same way. The 245 engine is a bit of a liability for more open maps and when I run into a Jenner, 3L, etc. I'm in trouble in the 2X. However River City seems perfectly suited to a "sort of fast" Raven.

I just had a match of conquest during with I managed to rack up 500+ points and 3 kills-along with ending up being the only surviving member of my team with 3 heavy and up mechs trying to chase me down at the end. The 124 KPH tweaked speed assured the win, especially with the two ER LLs keeping those long range snipers "honest" (behind cover).

Yeah, it's a fantastic counter-sniper. Lots of speed to move around, and the twin LLs do enough damage to make people duck back if they get too eager. I've finally found a 2X build that is 'playing' and not 'grinding'.

[1453 R]

A fantastic example of what I was hoping to prod people into with this little piece. The 2X is far from unplayable, it just isn't the same sort of 'Mech as other lights. A bit of creative thinking, some honest acceptance, and you can find roles for it that let you have some honest to Bob fun with it while you're working on efficiencies. Fun is the name of the game - if you're looking for absolute bleeding-edge cutthroat competitiveness, then you're not going to be checking the forums for advice anyways. Or shouldn't be, at any rate.

[Deathlike]

I don't know where to post this, since I could easily create a thread about it...

http://mwomercs.com/...ost__p__2178592

Nothing has changed since that comment.

[1453 R]

We did get machine gun buffs. That could have been what the Garthmonster was referring to. Not that it really helped the poor 4X much...

[Deathlike]

Keep arguing for MG buffs, and maybe someday the 4x won't become a punching bag...

Edited by Deathlike, 23 May 2013 - 10:01 PM.