30 replies to this topic

[hammerreborn]

Discuss.

So we have two of the deadliest mechs in the game with optimum DPS loadouts.

So pros and cons:

Jager:
-Ammo limited, but with available tonnage not really
-Ammo explosion danger
+Heat efficient
+Long Range
+Dakka
-weighs less

Stalker:
-Heat inefficient
-Less Critical Damage when Crits
+Not reliant on ammo
+Can blind opponent with FIRE
+WHOOOSHHHH
+Weighs more

[TruePoindexter]

Clearly the Stalker - because fire > dakka

[Loler skates]

Stalker wins,

More armour and it ammo explodes the jagger.

[hammerreborn]

You know, I kinda want to set up this match now.

[Loler skates]

hammerreborn, on 23 April 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

You know, I kinda want to set up this match now.

i don't, either way it ends up it would be like watching a 2 minute slow *** slap fight with the Stalker intermittently shutting down due to heat.

[Hell Mel]

Sadly the stalker. Flamer's and MGs do the same amount of damage over time, and the stalker has more armor. The negligable heat produced by flamers is totally dwarfed by the number of heat sinks you can cram in an otherwise totally empty mech (6 Flamers produce 3 Heat per second, you can fit enough DHS in to dissipate 4+), so neither have to worry about heat or ammo, and the damage is the same. Stalker wins due to better armor.

[hammerreborn]

Hell Mel, on 23 April 2013 - 01:27 PM, said:

Sadly the stalker. Flamer's and MGs do the same amount of damage over time, and the stalker has more armor. The negligable heat produced by flamers is totally dwarfed by the number of heat sinks you can cram in an otherwise totally empty mech (6 Flamers produce 3 Heat per second, you can fit enough DHS in to dissipate 4+), so neither have to worry about heat or ammo, and the damage is the same. Stalker wins due to better armor.

Actually this is not the case. No matter how many heat sinks you have you will raise your heat threshold over time. I'm nearly 100% the stalker would overheat if held continuously.

[Keifomofutu]

Nobody wins and time runs out.

[Jeager51]

Hmm whoever exposes the other guys internals first, since "the Improved Critical hit" Abilities of both weapons are such a massive factor in game. The first mech to loose a section of armor will instantly be totaly destroyed by the super crits MG's and Flamers cause. So smart money on the Stalker, way more armor.

[hammerreborn]

Jeager51, on 23 April 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

Hmm whoever exposes the other guys internals first, since "the Improved Critical hit" Abilities of both weapons are such a massive factor in game. The first mech to loose a section of armor will instantly be totaly destroyed by the super crits MG's and Flamers cause. So smart money on the Stalker, way more armor.

Flamers do not crit in any significant fashion.

[Hell Mel]

hammerreborn, on 23 April 2013 - 01:54 PM, said:

Actually this is not the case. No matter how many heat sinks you have you will raise your heat threshold over time. I'm nearly 100% the stalker would overheat if held continuously.

"Heat Neutral" is a phrase that gets thrown around more than it probably should, but it refers to a mech that can fire continuously without overheating, this is generally impossible, because it requires you to dedicate far more tonnage to heat sinks than weaponry, which is always impractical. In this case with a net 3 tons of weaponry on board and need for ammo, you run into a situation in which you dissipate heat more rapidly than your weapons can accrue it. Heat bleeds out constantly as long as it is generated, so in circumstances in which you lose more than you gain, it never has a chance to accrue at all (beyond a trifling minimum percentage).

If it worked such that you didn't lose heat while generating it, you would be correct. But it doesn't work this way, which is good, if only because movement generates heat.

[hammerreborn]

Hell Mel, on 23 April 2013 - 03:01 PM, said:

"Heat Neutral" is a phrase that gets thrown around more than it probably should, but it refers to a mech that can fire continuously without overheating, this is generally impossible, because it requires you to dedicate far more tonnage to heat sinks than weaponry, which is always impractical. In this case with a net 3 tons of weaponry on board and need for ammo, you run into a situation in which you dissipate heat more rapidly than your weapons can accrue it. Heat bleeds out constantly as long as it is generated, so in circumstances in which you lose more than you gain, it never has a chance to accrue at all (beyond a trifling minimum percentage).

If it worked such that you didn't lose heat while generating it, you would be correct. But it doesn't work this way, which is good, if only because movement generates heat.

No...like you can never make flamers heat neutral, they will always start generating constant heat after 5-10 seconds.

[Hell Mel]

hammerreborn, on 23 April 2013 - 03:14 PM, said:

No...like you can never make flamers heat neutral, they will always start generating constant heat after 5-10 seconds.

Checking a different source, it looks like the numbers I had for heat generation were WAY off. You're correct, it'd overheat in no time at all.

This gives enough of an edge to the Jager that it might just win out.

[skullman86]

Jager has better speed and can ambush...the Stalker will take two salvos in the back before it can even retaliate.

[DemonRaziel]

skullman86, on 23 April 2013 - 03:55 PM, said:

Jager has better speed and can ambush...the Stalker will take two salvos in the back before it can even retaliate.

Hmm... I thought the devastating effect™ from 6 MGs only applied to Atlas' rear armor, not Stalker's as well...

[Keifomofutu]

skullman86, on 23 April 2013 - 03:55 PM, said:

Jager has better speed and can ambush...the Stalker will take two salvos in the back before it can even retaliate.

Can you really call useless plunking a "salvo".

Edited by Keifomofutu, 23 April 2013 - 05:01 PM.

[MAXrobo]

You can always chain fire the flamers in groups of 2. this will make almost no heat build up and will make you "heat neutral". however this would also reduce you to basically having 3 flamers instead of 6, giving the Jager an advantage.

[Wintersdark]

Jeager51, on 23 April 2013 - 02:44 PM, said:

Hmm whoever exposes the other guys internals first, since "the Improved Critical hit" Abilities of both weapons are such a massive factor in game. The first mech to loose a section of armor will instantly be totaly destroyed by the super crits MG's and Flamers cause. So smart money on the Stalker, way more armor.

...I think my sarcasm detector is broken. I choose to believe this is a hilarious sarcastic post regardless.

[FrostCollar]

You're all ignoring the real issue, and that's who's more tired when they start playing. Once one of the pilots falls asleep the other has a fair chance of killing them within the time limit.

[TOGSolid]

I am incredibly disappointed that this thread did not come with a video of these antics.