271 replies to this topic

[Ransack]

Vassago Rain, on 17 May 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

We're not going back to this, ever. They've already said it's not coming back, for any reason.

good.

[Koniving]

Snuglninja, on 15 May 2013 - 05:38 PM, said:

Sorry but its true. The closest thing pgi has ever had to balance and would stop a lot of this ppc assault fest. Doesn't have to be exactly what it was before and maybe only used for players in cw/merc units but what we got now is a **** poor console game with no sim feel or consequences for cheese builds or smart play.

I do too. Repair, I confess was exploitable. But reload made sense especially if reload wasn't free. Low-heat and missile heavy rigs suffered reload costs. High heat rigs suffered in battle due to heat issues. Their ideas for fixing boating with exponential heat would only make them suffer more. In the end I think that's fair. I actually didn't mind ammo costs. Then again I had an LRM commando that cost 30,000 cbills to fix and rearm, but made me an average of 3,000,000 cbills per game.

[Le Goat]

Hotthedd, on 17 May 2013 - 10:06 AM, said:

Great you made your choice, now pay for it. It would be fun for me to drive a Ferrari, and if I CHOSE to do that, I would have to also pay for the insurance and maintenance that that choice entails.

that works great in the game called real life.
doesn't work so well in a fantasy game.

listen, r&r is not going to work in this game until they have another way to make money besides blowing mechs up.
someone allways has to lose in a battle, and if you punish those losers, they will leave.


edit: what about that? only winners pay R&R ? i'm down with that.

Edited by Le Goat, 17 May 2013 - 10:20 AM.

[Hotthedd]

Le Goat, on 17 May 2013 - 10:16 AM, said:

that works great in the game called real life.
doesn't work so well in a fantasy game.

listen, r&r is not going to work in this game until they have another way to make money besides blowing mechs up.
someone allways has to lose in a battle, and if you punish those losers, they will leave.

It works great in fantasy games. Reward without risk is hollow. Everybody loses sometimes. Those who lose more often should live within their means (piloting mediums, for example) until their skills improve. In the battletech universe, only the nobility started out in Assault mechs.

[Ransack]

Hotthedd, on 17 May 2013 - 09:26 AM, said:

In the battletech universe, lights and mediums are the largest segment of mechs on the field BECAUSE units could not afford to field all Heavies and Assaults.

In the BT universe, Most mech are stock too. This is not that. Or do you propose to give up your customization ability to conform to the BT universe?

[Ransack]

Hotthedd, on 17 May 2013 - 09:50 AM, said:

Is it me, or are the same people who are against R&R the same ones who are for respawns and 3rd person view?

With me, wrong on both accounts. No respawns, no third view, fix my dam missiles, make community warfare more than a color changing picture, add some real goals to the game, get rid of damage being the key factor in determining your XP and cash earned, pu defenses on bases. Those are what I would like. Screw R&R in any form.

[Joseph Mallan]

Ransack, on 17 May 2013 - 10:22 AM, said:

In the BT universe, Most mech are stock too. This is not that. Or do you propose to give up your customization ability to conform to the BT universe?

If I cannot afford upkeep for the Mods I made... yes I will.

[Hotthedd]

Ransack, on 17 May 2013 - 10:22 AM, said:

In the BT universe, Most mech are stock too. This is not that. Or do you propose to give up your customization ability to conform to the BT universe?

If I cannot afford it, yes..........Joseph Mallan beat me to it.

Edited by Hotthedd, 17 May 2013 - 10:33 AM.

[Keifomofutu]

Hotthedd, on 17 May 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

It works great in fantasy games. Reward without risk is hollow. Everybody loses sometimes. Those who lose more often should live within their means (piloting mediums, for example) until their skills improve. In the battletech universe, only the nobility started out in Assault mechs.

Wow really? We have a deathmatch styled game mode and map design that crams people together and they fight it out. There is no risk reward. 80% of the time the team that loses is completely obliterated. The team that wins can lose almost as many mechs as the losing team. There is no "risk" you will die and you will die often. Hence it's not risk reward anymore it's "tax for hitting battle".

[Hotthedd]

Keifomofutu, on 17 May 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

Wow really? We have a deathmatch styled game mode and map design that crams people together and they fight it out. There is no risk reward. 80% of the time the team that loses is completely obliterated. The team that wins can lose almost as many mechs as the losing team. There is no "risk" you will die and you will die often. Hence it's not risk reward anymore it's "tax for hitting battle".

If you have not noticed, there is a C-bill REWARD for hitting battle as well.

[Joseph Mallan]

Keifomofutu, on 17 May 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

Wow really? We have a deathmatch styled game mode and map design that crams people together and they fight it out. There is no risk reward. 80% of the time the team that loses is completely obliterated. The team that wins can lose almost as many mechs as the losing team. There is no "risk" you will die and you will die often. Hence it's not risk reward anymore it's "tax for hitting battle".

Making war ain't cheap.

[Keifomofutu]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 May 2013 - 10:37 AM, said:

Making war ain't cheap.

Good thing you're actually in a chair at a keyboard then.

Keep the immersion shlock to CW where it belongs. Or do we need to drive even more people from the game?

To the other guy:How else would you tax someone if you don't pay him first? Seriously.

Edited by Keifomofutu, 17 May 2013 - 10:46 AM.

[Ransack]

Hotthedd, on 17 May 2013 - 10:14 AM, said:

I already said that heat scale penalties should be the drawback that PPC snipers get.

So the person that manages their heat well or uses coolant flush gets a pass. Still wont work. Giving energy users weapon cartridges with a number of shots per ton equivalent to their ballistic counterparts might work. But I don't see that happening either.

[Joseph Mallan]

Keifomofutu, on 17 May 2013 - 10:45 AM, said:

Good thing you're actually in a chair at a keyboard then.

Keep the immersion shlock to CW where it belongs. Or do we need to drive even more people from the game?

I have done both... the game is much much cheaper.

You are playing a war game, you should feel the pinch.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 17 May 2013 - 10:47 AM.

[Ransack]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 May 2013 - 10:31 AM, said:

If I cannot afford upkeep for the Mods I made... yes I will.

No, no mods ever. Every mech would be stock. If that's your cup of tea the, there are trial mechs for you.

[Joseph Mallan]

Ransack, on 17 May 2013 - 10:47 AM, said:

No, no mods ever. Every mech would be stock. If that's your cup of tea the, there are trial mechs for you.

I can play em. if everyone was in one, I would have no problem playing it that way. You act as if I have never played unmoified Mechs in 30 years...

[merz]

Keifomofutu, on 17 May 2013 - 10:33 AM, said:

Wow really? We have a deathmatch styled game mode and map design that crams people together and they fight it out. There is no risk reward. 80% of the time the team that loses is completely obliterated. The team that wins can lose almost as many mechs as the losing team. There is no "risk" you will die and you will die often.

congratulations, you've just pointed out the problem.

The solution isn't a tax on hitting the 'launch' button - its the creation of an actual economy, battle value system, community warfare and territorial conquest with meaning, and, as a part of that, yes, LOGISTICS of keeping your mechs repaired and stocked up on ammunition, spare parts, etc.

That, as i see it, is really the only viable future that sets MWO apart from a gaggle of other f2p titles and takes the full advantage of its detailed setting, etc.. vassago here may declare that all of that is for neckbeards with spreadsheets, but it seems a whole lot more interesting a way of cornering a particular market than diluting the depth or continuing things the way they are now, a kind of groundhog day where, more often than not, a match can go one of 3-4 ways depending on which map you've dropped on. Anyhow..

[Ransack]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 May 2013 - 10:48 AM, said:

I can play em. if everyone was in one, I would have no problem playing it that way. You act as if I have never played unmoified Mechs in 30 years...

Not at all. . Saying "If I can't afford the mods" means that you could mod it. In the IS, you could not. The mech came as it was.

Now, if you want to run around and die in trials, more power to you, I prefer my omnimechs, so lets leave the references to the BT universe out of this.

They are not the same

[Joseph Mallan]

Ransack, on 17 May 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

Not at all. . Saying "If I can't afford the mods" means that you could mod it. In the IS, you could not. The mech came as it was.

Now, if you want to run around and die in trials, more power to you, I prefer my omnimechs, so lets leave the references to the BT universe out of this.

They are not the same

Tell that to Kia, GeoAvante(and his angels (60% upgrades... with Clan Tech), and Oh... Shorty Snead of the Irregulars! Now He had one heck of a Mod!Just of the top my head.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 17 May 2013 - 11:06 AM.

[karoushi]

merz, on 17 May 2013 - 10:52 AM, said:

congratulations, you've just pointed out the problem.

The solution isn't a tax on hitting the 'launch' button - its the creation of an actual economy, battle value system, community warfare and territorial conquest with meaning, and, as a part of that, yes, LOGISTICS of keeping your mechs repaired and stocked up on ammunition, spare parts, etc.

That, as i see it, is really the only viable future that sets MWO apart from a gaggle of other f2p titles and takes the full advantage of its detailed setting, etc.. vassago here may declare that all of that is for neckbeards with spreadsheets, but it seems a whole lot more interesting a way of cornering a particular market than diluting the depth or continuing things the way they are now, a kind of groundhog day where, more often than not, a match can go one of 3-4 ways depending on which map you've dropped on. Anyhow..

That is the optimal future for MWO.

Yes it is gritty, yes it is rough and no you are not guarantee'd to make it but that is the style of this genre and this series.

If it was such an atmosphere and I could feel like an actual mechwarrior fighting for something you BET I'd be dumping large amounts of cash into this production.

Right now, as others have stated and I will restate: it seems like the IP is just being used to make money, at least as of right now.

If you read the books or ever own any of the cards, they gave a lot of depth behind these ideas and these concepts: mechs falling on crumbling unstable cliffs, long toms, base defense, "intimidating paint job", sabotage, and of course logistics/support and the whole realm! The gritty-ness is what Made it.
It wasn't just bashing a bunch of metal and lasers together and hoping you come out at the end, it all had purpose and meaning when you think of a legendary pilot you don't just think of some guy you think of a Named Person with a Backstory and events that occur that make you remember them; Not: "Next battle more c-bills!!!1!1"

Edited by karoushi, 17 May 2013 - 11:13 AM.