238 replies to this topic

[Chavette]

RNG coming to a neighborhood near you! Couple this with the current ballistic hit detection...

26:00
http://nogutsnogalaxy.net/ngng-72/

The bigger the mech, the more the shake. The longer the range, the more disruptive the same amount of shake.

The point of the heavy metal is the 5JJs. It doesn't have the hardpoint arsenal to make it an effective brawler, can't fit an AC20. It is a born sniper mech.

The purposed change is a two stab combo against the same chassis.

How I feel:

1, Its been said by top PGI brass that they wouldn't like to add any random factors to keep it a skill game. Different day, different bait-switch?
2, If for this reason my $38 investment gets blown to uselessness, I'll be pissed, and I mean really pissed.
In other words: Change itself isn't a bad thing but the biggest loser of this is the hero mech many payed for, in good faith of PGI not adding JJ shake to a JJ oriented mech.
3, Nerfing JJ makes little sense, its the pinpoint/alpha plague you are looking for.
For reference, two-thirds of the player base wasn't complaining in the jumping phract era.

Even if you break the promise, and start adding RNG to compensate for fixable bad design choices, the shake amount should be flat.
Why?

The same amount of shake will not distrupt your 200m laser game, while the same amount of shake at 1000m erppc range will mess it up pretty badly. Light mechs could happily operate with a flat shake rate.

To write something useful too: A good start would be only shake while going up(pressing the button).
Variant based quirks for designated sniper mechs with armaments seems logical too.

Yes, I know the feature isn't yet in, yes I don't know what it will be like exactly. The reason for the thread is the same reason PGI are demoing the new UI. Easier to get it right the first time with helpful input than doing something and changing it around(or possibly never changing it, or changing it after half a year or revolts, MG style), and that's what I wish to provide here.


TLDR; First 5 lines.

The topic of discussion is the Heavy Metal hero mech, not poppers, or JJers in general! There is a reason why its not in "gameplay balance" section.

Edited by Chavette, 20 May 2013 - 05:16 PM.

[Butane9000]

[Corvus Antaka]

QQ

If you want to go play wack-a-mole, I suggest you go to Chuck-e-Cheese.

If you seriously bought the Heavy Metal just to stand behind stuff, pop up and snipe and pop-back down and are so enraged that your $38 investment is down the toilet, I think you have bigger problems than the coming Jumpjet Adjustments.

It'll still be great for Death From Above. And that is what matters

Edited by Colonel Pada Vinson, 19 May 2013 - 10:14 AM.

[Jabilo]

They agreed with the host that pop tarting is essentially not a valid tactic.

I think it is a valid tactic that needs balancing but not removing.

Would be a shame if they go too far and nerf JJ's out of the game.

Personally I only take jets on my spiders so I have no vested interest.

After the JJ comments they go on to flamers SRMs and SSRMs so worth a listen.

Edited by Jabilo, 19 May 2013 - 10:21 AM.

[Chavette]

Butane9000, on 19 May 2013 - 10:11 AM, said:

You miss the point, the stalkers are still gonna pop from the hill and pound you. Then you will be crying about that.

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 19 May 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

If you seriously bought the Heavy Metal just to stand behind stuff...

I take it you don't know the difference between a support and a brawler mech... zulu company must be one top notch unit, lol.

Edited by Chavette, 19 May 2013 - 10:23 AM.

[DegeneratePervert]

Heavy metal will still be superb. I've got mine loaded with 3x Large Lasers, a Gauss, and two streaks (looking forward to the BAP buff), and it works best sticking behind an Atlas, jumping up above his head, shooting whatever he's shooting at, and diving back down. If you were using the Heavy Metal to poptart snipe, you were doing it wrong anyway.

[Butane9000]

Chavette, on 19 May 2013 - 10:21 AM, said:

You miss the point, the stalkers are still gonna pop from the hill and pound you. Then you will be crying about that.

Nah, because they are addressing that with the changes to heat with boating.

[Chavette]

Butane9000, on 19 May 2013 - 10:27 AM, said:

Nah, because they are addressing that with the changes to heat with boating.

I know, but shouldn't they wait to see how the coming alpha heat tweaks change the jumping game? Not alot of Laser jumpers out there, they get indirectly nerfed by the alpha nerf.

[Viralstrayne]

Chavette, on 19 May 2013 - 10:21 AM, said:

I take it you don't know the difference between a support and a brawler mech... zulu company must be one top notch unit, lol.

Thems fightin words :-P

A lot of people hate Poptarts in game but we have learned to deal with them on each map now. The game will evolve and we must adapt with it. This isn't the games final form after all :-D

Change is good folks!

[Chavette]

I hope so. TBH I don't really give a damn if poptarting goes away.

my problem is that the heavy metal has a very specific role currently and these changes could leave it useless.

[Butane9000]

Chavette, on 19 May 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

I know, but shouldn't they wait to see how the coming alpha heat tweaks change the jumping game? Not alot of Laser jumpers out there, they get indirectly nerfed by the alpha nerf.

Nah, because these are two different issues. Even it you took away the PPCs people would still pop tart with their Gauss. Fixing JJs to make them shake will prevent people from pop tarting unless they truly have skill. The heat changes will prevent excessive boating of weapons.

So to simplify for you:

JJ fix = nerf poptarts such as the Highalnders, Cataphract 3D etc.

Heat fix = Nerf energy boats and Stalker PPC boating.

Edited by Butane9000, 19 May 2013 - 10:53 AM.

[Fr4ctal]

Aww, I really don't mind poptarts. They are such easy targets for my 4/6 PPCs. Its great watching them explode during flight!

Edited by Fr4ctal, 19 May 2013 - 10:54 AM.

[MechFrog1]

OP: Sorry but your preferred gameplay style is killing MWO. Do you want to adapt or do you want to run out of opponents? There are uses for the Highlander besides poptarting. Perhaps you should look into them instead of getting tears all over our forums.

You had your fun, you got to be king of the hill for a month. Now adapt.

[Kaylos Thex]

I have a Heavy Metal as well.

Any mech that can sling a gauss round, a PPC bolt, two lasers, and a dozen SRM missiles all at the same time is unlikely to become useless.

When you jump up the glacier in frozen city, believe me, the jump jetting assault will still have a niche.

[Ryebear]

A 90 tonne mech is still a 90 tonne mech, anyone who thinks a Highlander who can't Poptart is fundamentally broken is staring at it from a very narrow viewpoint.

As a heavy user of jump jets (specifically 'laser jump jetters') I still think this is a great idea. Assuming the implementation isn't too over the top it really shouldn't be as chicken-little-bad as you are foreseeing.

[Butane9000]

mint frog, on 19 May 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

OP: Sorry but your preferred gameplay style is killing MWO. Do you want to adapt or do you want to run out of opponents? There are uses for the Highlander besides poptarting. Perhaps you should look into them instead of getting tears all over our forums.

You had your fun, you got to be king of the hill for a month. Now adapt.

All my Highlanders are mixed ranged brawlers.

HGN-732
Large Pulse Laser x2
AC10
SRM6 + Artemis x2
XL325
DHS
Endo
2/3 JJ

HGN-733
Gauss
ER Large Laser x2
SRM6
Standard 300
DHS
Endo
2/3 JJ

HGN-733C
AC20
Large Laser x2
Streak SRM2 x3
BAP
DHS
Endo
Standard 275
3/4JJ
CASE x2

You should try some of those builds. They are quite fun.

[NRP]

The Heavy Metal is not the best Highlander poptart. The 732 is.

[Chavette]

I changed the summary up a bit as many are taking it as a defensive speech against Poptarts in general, thats not my intent.

The discussion is specific to the heavy metal, there is a reason why its not in "gameplay balance" section.

[Roland]

Can you say when in the podcast it actually says something about this?

Because I can't bother sitting through that stuff just to hear one piece of useful info.

[Dude42]

Nerf poptarts into the ground, and then, nerf them some more. I'd personally be happy if weapons were simply unable to fire while the jumpjets were going. I don't believe there's anything worse than looking out at a ridge and seeing 4-8 mechs bouncing up and down like children on a trampoline. It just totally breaks the immersion. I'm not playing mechwarrior, I'm playing JumpCoD. Jumpjets are supposed to be for mobility, hopping up on buildings, over rocks, up ledges, things like that... not to turn the game into glorified Whack-A-Mole. The Heavy Metal should be more mobile than the other Highlanders due to its jump jets. That's its advantage, not poptarding better. Well, in theory.