585 replies to this topic

[Pater Mors]

King Arthur IV, on 06 June 2013 - 05:35 PM, said:

then go donate without needing something in return. you havent heard a word i said......

I do donate, both time and money, without getting anything in return and I'll buy this too even if it turns out to just be a cockpit item (won't be getting 'anything' that way either).

I have heard what you said, I just disagree with it. If some idiots want to make fun of PGI or Sarah's memory that's their problem. Why should we dictate things towards the lowest common denominator? People probably make fun of other charities and memorials too but we don't scrap those because some people have no respect.

[zraven7]

King Arthur IV, on 06 June 2013 - 05:35 PM, said:

then go donate without needing something in return. you havent heard a word i said......

I get your fears, and they do make sense. However, for the vast majority of this thread, people have been civil and respectful to one another. I have to believe they will continue to be concerning this.

Also, everyone agrees that the permission of the parents is needed. We're assuming that PGI has handled that, if for no other reason than I'm relatively certain they'd prefer not to get sued.

Thank you for being concerned for them and for Sarah's memory, however. Your thoughts and words are coming from the right place. And thank you for being civil. It speaks highly of you. :-)

[King Arthur IV]

Pater Mors, on 06 June 2013 - 05:44 PM, said:

Why should we dictate things towards the lowest common denominator?

this is basically how bigotry, racism, sexism start. this isnt the real issue im bringing up anyway.

zraven7, on 06 June 2013 - 05:44 PM, said:

I get your fears, and they do make sense. However, for the vast majority of this thread, people have been civil and respectful to one another. I have to believe they will continue to be concerning this.

Also, everyone agrees that the permission of the parents is needed. We're assuming that PGI has handled that, if for no other reason than I'm relatively certain they'd prefer not to get sued.

Thank you for being concerned for them and for Sarah's memory, however. Your thoughts and words are coming from the right place. And thank you for being civil. It speaks highly of you. :-)

these votes are within this thread only. only the people who cared to click on this subject or read the first few lines of related subjects care and know. this mech you propose will be in every game and client and therefor be exposed to many other people. i do not think it is a necessary risk to name the mech after her. anything else is basically risk free from insult or bad humor.

[Pater Mors]

King Arthur IV, on 06 June 2013 - 06:15 PM, said:

this is basically how bigotry, racism, sexism start. this isnt the real issue im bringing up anyway.

No it's not. It's got zero to do with any of those. It's actually rather offensive that you would accuse me of any of the above in context of my previous post.

What I was saying is that no one incorporates what lowlifes might think into their design process for any project and neither should they, especially not for something as caring as this. Why would you give someone who obviously has no respect for other people the satisfaction of bending your decisions around their bad behaviour?

I am not saying this Mech needs to be called 'Sarah's Mech' or any variation thereof but even if it was, it doesn't give anyone an excuse to make fun and if they do choose to do that then I would hope that they'd be treated with the appropriate amount of derision that they deserve for making fun of a little girl.

[zraven7]

King Arthur IV, on 06 June 2013 - 06:15 PM, said:

this is basically how bigotry, racism, sexism start. this isnt the real issue im bringing up anyway.


these votes are within this thread only. only the people who cared to click on this subject or read the first few lines of related subjects care and know. this mech you propose will be in every game and client and therefor be exposed to many other people. i do not think it is a necessary risk to name the mech after her. anything else is basically risk free from insult or bad humor.

They still haven't announced the details of the mech yet. The name might be something associated with Sarah, like the "Get 'em Good". We don't know yet.

Also, I agree that we can't make something immediately fearful of what callous people will say. If someone is heartless enough to make fun of this topic, they already are. They don't need to mech to do that.

I have to have faith that people will show this respect.

[Huge]

Something else that concerns me and should concern all of you as well as PGI is how this can profit them indirectly. Leading to possibility of the Sarah Mech being seen as a grab deal for PGI. Using a dead girl as means of generating revenue. Which is bad business for everyone involved.

Say 100% of the proceeds goes to a charity. Even say that the overhead costs and out of hand variables are eaten up by PGI. Such as royalties for the Cry engine. Which are contractually obligated to get a cut of any micro transaction from any game using their software.

What about the cost of the mech itself?

All Hero mechs have a set price of 75MC per ton. So we already can roughly figure that the Sarah mech would run actually 2,625MC. If they use the same standard. This amount means having to buy the most basic MC bundle three times (1250x2=2,500MC. Must grab deal again) or going up to the next level instead of donating a specific amount. Which brings up the next point.

What about the cost of the MC being used to purchase the mech?

If you've done the math. You will notice that the price of MC is not static, but becomes cheaper as you purchase larger amounts. The lowest investment is 1250MC for $6.95. Or roughly 1.80MC per cent. The other end of the spectrum is the 25,000MC for $99.95 which will net you 2.5MC per cent.

So which standard will PGI use? Will they donate the lowest MC per dollar or the highest? If they do not set it at the highest value they would be making up the difference in their own pocket. This then brings up the issue of them once again assuming the cost themselves or just passing it over and hoping no one notices?

Not to mention the mech bay it will have to reside in. Will that be given out for free or will that be another angle of profit that will funnel additional funds into PGI all for the sake of a cancer victim?

So many damn variables that do not work well with their current transaction system when dealing with a charity case like this. I truly hope they scrap the entire idea and give us a simple, free, easily created, and tasteful cockpit item. Something we can adorn to honor Sarah in a respectful way and then have an external link to give directly to a Sarah fund or cancer foundation of the Family's choosing. The player's hearts may be in the right place. PGI's as well but these is just so much potential for this to be a morally corrupt and PR shitstorm situation. They'll have to bend quite a few rules and make some unprecedented changes as well as absorbing additional costs. Whole thing is a bit too complicated for my liking.

Edited by Huge, 06 June 2013 - 10:29 PM.

[zraven7]

Huge, on 06 June 2013 - 10:25 PM, said:

Something else that concerns me and should concern all of you as well as PGI is how this can profit them indirectly. Leading to possibility of the Sarah Mech being seen as a grab deal for PGI. Using a dead girl as means of generating revenue. Which is bad business for everyone involved.

Say 100% of the proceeds goes to a charity. Even say that the overhead costs and out of hand variables are eaten up by PGI. Such as royalties for the Cry engine. Which are contractually obligated to get a cut of any micro transaction from any game using their software.

What about the cost of the mech itself?

All Hero mechs have a set price of 75MC per ton. So we already can roughly figure that the Sarah mech would run actually 2,625MC. If they use the same standard. This amount means having to buy the most basic MC bundle three times (1250x2=2,500MC. Must grab deal again) or going up to the next level instead of donating a specific amount. Which brings up the next point.

What about the cost of the MC being used to purchase the mech?

If you've done the math. You will notice that the price of MC is not static, but becomes cheaper as you purchase larger amounts. The lowest investment is 1250MC for $6.95. Or roughly 1.80MC per cent. The other end of the spectrum is the 25,000MC for $99.95 which will net you 2.5MC per cent.

So which standard will PGI use? Will they donate the lowest MC per dollar or the highest? If they do not set it at the highest value they would be making up the difference in their own pocket. This then brings up the issue of them once again assuming the cost themselves or just passing it over and hoping no one notices?

Not to mention the mech bay it will have to reside in. Will that be given out for free or will that be another angle of profit that will funnel additional funds into PGI all for the sake of a cancer victim?

So many damn variables that do not work well with their current transaction system when dealing with a charity case like this. I truly hope they scrap the entire idea and give us a simple, free, easily created, and tasteful cockpit item. Something we can adorn to honor Sarah in a respectful way and then have an external link to give directly to a Sarah fund or cancer foundation of the Family's choosing. The player's hearts may be in the right place. PGI's as well but these is just so much potential for this to be a morally corrupt and PR shitstorm situation. They'll have to bend quite a few rules and make some unprecedented changes as well as absorbing additional costs. Whole thing is a bit too complicated for my liking.

Again, I have to have faith that they will do the right thing here. I have to give them the benefit of the doubt.

[Huge]

zraven7, on 06 June 2013 - 10:58 PM, said:

Again, I have to have faith that they will do the right thing here. I have to give them the benefit of the doubt.

Yeah because that has worked out so decisively so far. There are just too many holes in their transaction system and the nature of a free2playbutpay2fun title. It was not designed for taking in duty free, tax free, set price, non-conflicting, contract dodging content charity mechs.

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

Huge, on 06 June 2013 - 10:25 PM, said:

Something else that concerns me and should concern all of you as well as PGI is how this can profit them indirectly. Leading to possibility of the Sarah Mech being seen as a grab deal for PGI. Using a dead girl as means of generating revenue. Which is bad business for everyone involved.

Say 100% of the proceeds goes to a charity. Even say that the overhead costs and out of hand variables are eaten up by PGI. Such as royalties for the Cry engine. Which are contractually obligated to get a cut of any micro transaction from any game using their software.

PROTIP: Anyone who says "grab deal" is a troll from 4chan and can be safely ignored.

[Huge]

Zharot, on 06 June 2013 - 11:40 PM, said:

PROTIP: Anyone who says "grab deal" is a troll from 4chan and can be safely ignored.

Neat ad hominem.

PROTIP: Anyone who buys 'MC' is a gold from official forums and can be safely ignored.

These are kind of fun actually! Let's see how many more we can think of.

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

Huge, on 07 June 2013 - 12:30 AM, said:

PROTIP: Anyone who buys 'MC' is a gold from official forums and can be safely ignored.

And he's clearly not trolling this thread.

[Huge]

Zharot, on 07 June 2013 - 12:49 AM, said:

And he's clearly not trolling this thread.

Yeah I think we're done here.

GG, clothes valid debate.

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

Huge, on 07 June 2013 - 12:56 AM, said:

GG, clothes valid debate.

Quote

#rekt #debate club #yoro

Huge

Member

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Sent Today, 01:01 AM

Checkmate atheist.

God: 1
Goon: 0

But seriously, if I wanted to troll the Sarah thread. I would troll the Sarah thread. These are real problems that revolve around mc4cancermech transactions in the name of a dead little girl.

This isn't an opportunity for him to harass people for actually supporting this game. No, these are real issues.

Edited by Zharot, 07 June 2013 - 01:08 AM.

[Huge]

So your ingenious plan was to show a PM of me reaffirming that I am trying to get these issues discussed in some attempt in invalid my attempt to get these issues discussed?

Quote

This isn't an opportunity for him to harass people for actually supporting this game.

That is kind of the problem you incredible tophat. This whole Sarah Mech is GOING to support PGI financially. They are going to use (best intentions in mind, I think) a DEAD CHILD CANCER VICTIM in a way that will earn them PROFIT.

Do you honestly not see a problem with this? Or is getting another mech and pushing more of your money down PGI's throat more important?

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

Huge, on 07 June 2013 - 01:19 AM, said:

So your ingenious plan was to show a PM of me reaffirming that I am trying to get these issues discussed in some attempt in invalid my attempt to get these issues discussed?

Yes. You're trolling this thread to complain about the fact that PGI asks for money at all, for a mech where they've said they aren't keeping any of the money. Good job.

[1453 R]

Alright, alright. Calm down now, folks.

I think we're getting a little ridiculous here. Come on - nasty arguments like this and screenshots of in-game mudslinging is in just as poor taste as anything PGI could do. As is in-game mudslinging that goes undocumented - really Zharot, I don't think Sarah would appreciate the language you're using on her behalf.

Here's the thing. I'm going to assume that Piranha talked to Sarah's parents about Sarah's Jenner, mostly because it would be absolutely mindbogglingly stupid for them not to. I'm not as conversant with all the details surrounding the whole Sarah's 'Mech thing as I might be, because I've been of the general opinion that this was a pretty cut-and-dry sort of thing. Which, realistically, it is.

If Sarah's parents are all right with Piranha setting this up, then that is their decision. If they don't have a problem with Piranha making a bit of indirect profit from their girl's plight - while also, mind, raising cancer awareness and putting together an effective cancer research fundraiser - then it's not our position to say anything. Remember, fundraisers where people buy stuff are always more effective than fundraisers in which people are expected to hand over money for nothing. It's an ugly truth, but it's a truth nonetheless. Given how popular the Jenner chassis is, even without Sarah's story attached to it, I would not be surprised if this turned out a pretty fair penny for cancer research. I'm also pretty sure that the cancer researchers are overjoyed to get whatever money they do get and don't really care if they got every last red cent they might theoretically have managed. They got more than they started with, and that means more research can be done to cure cancer.

I'm certain that Piranha's heart is in the right place in their work on Sarah's Jenner, because despite what this forum believes, Piranha is made up of human beings who happen to have families and children of their own. Arguing and slinging mud over the details like this is beneath our dignity and is a poor remembrance for a little girl who died before her time. Instead, let us be grateful that Piranha's doing what they can, and do what we can to make their effort the sort of success that will inspire people for years to come, hmm?

Isn't that what this was all about in the first place?

[Jock Blaine]

I have a fairly simple solution for this whole money business. They work together with #cancer society. They have a big mwo-donation button. You donate more than x dollars, you get a promo-code which gets you, well whatever the Sarah mech will be. I would be perfectly happy with a Jenner named Sarah.
PGI recuperates some of its costs because many people will need to buy a mechbay for it.

[Huge]

Zharot, on 07 June 2013 - 01:24 AM, said:

Yes. You're trolling this thread to complain about the fact that PGI asks for money at all, for a mech where they've said they aren't keeping any of the money. Good job.

Did you even read my post or is it open season on anyone who shows the slightest reservation about the Sarah mech?

I brought that point up. Then followed it by all the other ways that PGI could make money off this charity case. With indirect ways that they know exist.

Royalties and overhead contractual percentages they must give out for every dollar that goes into MW
Will these be exempt? Can they even be exempt? How do you cordon off MC bought for camo and MC bought for Sarah?

Sarah Mech pricing - Will it follow the current trend and cost an odd number of MC so you must grab deal multiple times or buy more then the cost of the Mech alone
This is a tactic used by many companies who sell virtual currency to buy in game items. They tier the purchase amounts so even if the item you want only costs 100 flippityloods. You must buy them in increments of 150 flippityloods. Normally annoying but in this case. 100% absolutely immoral and sickening. It would mean you donating to the memory of Sarah would be netting PGI significant additional funds which would NOT be donated.

MC conversion rates - MC is cheaper the more you buy. So even if 100% of all MC goes to charity, how much is that? The highest or lowest value per MC
Say we spend the 2,625MC and every cent goes to a good cause. All overhead is absorbed or waived by PGI and we have no other variables of cash being siphoned off. How much is it worth? If you buy MC in bulk you'll be donating with MC that is of lower value then someone who buys the bare minimum. So what PGI 'donate' on our behalf? Will they keep the conversion high or low? Because the difference either goes into or comes out of their pockets.

Mech Bay to house the Sarah Mech
Another indirect but essential grab deal you must buy in order to house this charitable donation. Will they give us a free bay with the Mech? Or will they just get a tidy profit off each Sarah's sold knowing most will also Christmas Tree in a bay purchase?



These are ALL valid problems that must be answered because if even one is not. PGI will literally be using the death of a cancer victim to pad their pockets. Directly or roundabout. It is wrong. So why don't you try actually holding a conversation with me instead of causing the very "trolling/flame posting" you are claiming to be trying to put down.

Edited by Huge, 07 June 2013 - 01:47 AM.

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

Huge, on 07 June 2013 - 01:43 AM, said:

I brought that point up. Then followed it by all the other ways that PGI could make money off this charity case. With indirect ways that they know exist.

All of the ways that PGI "could" be skimming off the top that exist only in your fevered imagination because you don't have any of the details yet because they haven't even been worked out. That's the problem. You're waving your arms and spouting Kong catchphrases while saying, "Guys, guys, what if this is actually a plan to commit felony fraud? Hey, why are you angry at me? I'm just asking questions!"

[1453 R]

Huge. Zharot. Enough. This is not what this thread is for. You're both being disgraceful. Huge, please wait until Piranha actually does something heinous before accusing them of perpetrating heinousness, if you would? Zharot...calm down. Please. I'm asking you.

It's a passionate issue for both of you, I can see that, and I can understand why. But come on. This doesn't help Sarah, nor does it help her family, nor does it reflect well on any of us.