110 replies to this topic

[Pater Mors]

Loving it. Awesome artwork, can't wait to own one.

[Fate 6]

If we get the Victor Li hero mech, I'm instabuying and then mastering this mech. Give me my 10ML mech PGI plz.

[Capt Sternn]

Only the marauder is listed as unseen, The marauder II is different enough to be considered original artwork, although heavily inspired by the marauder(Obviously). Look on any list of the unseen on any battletech wiki, Marauder II is not on it.

Edited by Capt Sternn, 25 May 2013 - 09:12 AM.

[XX Sulla XX]

Hmm might have to try this one out. As normal they did a great job with the look of it. Any idea when it is coming out?

[Adridos]

Capt Sternn, on 25 May 2013 - 09:11 AM, said:

Only the marauder is listed as unseen, The marauder II is different enough to be considered original artwork, although heavily inspired by the marauder(Obviously). Look on any list of the unseen on any battletech wiki, Marauder II is not on it.

http://www.masteruni...auder-ii-mad-6d
http://www.masteruni...auder-ii-mad-4a
http://www.masteruni...auder-ii-mad-4k
http://www.masteruni...auder-ii-mad-4s

I contribute to BTech wiki myself and just like with every wiki out there, it is great source on info, but using it as a counterpoint to something like this argument, official sources trumph it.

EDIT: Just checked Sarna... Marauder II is on the list of unseens. What wiki were you using as a source for your argument?

Edited by Adridos, 25 May 2013 - 10:04 AM.

[Capt Sternn]

well sir, those are all the iic Artwork.

Edited by Capt Sternn, 25 May 2013 - 11:58 AM.

[Adridos]

Capt Sternn, on 25 May 2013 - 11:56 AM, said:

well sir, those are all the iic Artwork.

Doesn't matter. The artwork wasn't the main point, the fact those said mechs were from Project Phoenix book was supposed to convince you.

[Capt Sternn]

Actually the Artwork is the point. But my main concern right now is I think you might have acute SPACE MADNESS, you need to get checked out right away.

[Sephlock]

So when is this coming out again?

Also, although I feel bad for the poor, poor Awesome, I'm intrigued by the Victor since at least one of the variants should be like the heavy metal (ballistic in one arm, energy in the other).

[Gremlich Johns]

Does not matter what variants are provided, lots of players will buy them even if the game is not at full launch.

[Bishop Steiner]

well, I won't buy them. But I sure the heck will own them!

[Kaylos Thex]

Alistair Winter, on 25 May 2013 - 01:28 AM, said:

Has jump jets.
Is fast.
Looks cool.

Nothing else matters.



So how would you distribute the rest of the mechs?

Well some mechs are easy, while others are more multinational (pre war trades, theft, and border changes). Most of the time in the fictional history and usage of a mech, you can learn about it's nationality.

Lights,

Flea: Marik I believe.
Commando: Steiner, without a doubt.
Spider:Davion by default.
Jenner: Kurita for sure. It, along with the Panther, are their defacto lights.
Raven: Liao. I always found that the highest tech mech being built by the most strapped nation to be an odd turn of events, but it is written that way.

Mediums,

Cicada: Kurita by default. The other mediums fit better elsewhere.
Blackjack: Liao. The BJ-2 will come from the St. Ives Compact, a section of Liao that succeeds. It's also quite popular in Davion space too. The Vindicator would have been their standard if it was in MWO.
Centurion: Most definitely Davion.
Hunchback: Steiner. The Kali Yama factory is in Marik space, but the mech is also built by Coventry, a Steiner company. Given Steiner's obsession with "go big or go home" it fits them well.
Trebuchet: Marik. It's built by Corean, a multinational company that is in both Marik and Steiner space. The main production line of the treb is on Stewart, in Marik space.

Heavies,

Dragon: This is the standard heavy mech of house Kurita.
Catapult: Steiner by default, even though its used by Liao primarily. The K2 is a Kurita based version.
Jagermech: This is one of Davion's favorite Heavy mechs. They have a great love for autocannon armed mechs.
Cataphract: Liao. It's a franken-mech built from parts intended mostly for Marauders. It was something they could make, even it it is something of a kitbash.
Orion: Marik. Another Kali Yama produced mech.

Assaults,

Awesome: Marik. This mech is built by Technicron and Irian, some of the Free Worlds League's major manufacturers.
Victor: The standard assault mech of house Davion.
Stalker: Liao by default: Normally it would be a Marik mech, but the others in this class fit better elsewhere. This mech is also manufactored by Irian Heavy industries in Marik space.
Highlander: Kurita. Comstar gifted a geat many of these Star League era mechs to them in 3039.
Atlas: Steiner. Steiner is synonmous with heavy and assault mechs. It gets neither heavier or assualtier than the Atlas.

So by flag it would be:

Marik:
Flea
Trebuchet
Orion
Awesome

Steiner:
Commando
Hunchback
Catapult
Atlas

Kurita:
Jenner
Cicada
Dragon
Highlander

Davion:
Spider
Centurian
Jagermech
Victor

Liao:
Raven
Blackjack
Cataphract
Stalker


As I said, there are several mechs that are defacto mechs for certain nationalities, alot that are found in multiple armies, and some that had to be shoehorned into some to make room for more appropriate designs.

Edited by Kaylos Thex, 25 May 2013 - 05:21 PM.

[Khanahar]

Kaylos Thex, on 25 May 2013 - 05:11 PM, said:

-snip-

By faction below, with elipses indicating manufacturing, but not primary associated house. Does not account for salvage, SLDF survivors, etc.

STEINER (2/0/1/1)
Atlas
Stalker
Hunchback
Commando

KURITA (1/1/0/2)
....Atlas
Highlander
....Victor
....Catapult
....Jagermech
Dragon
....Hunchback
Jenner
Spider

DAVION (1/1/2/0)
....Atlas
Victor
....Cataphract
Jagermech
Centurion
Blackjack

LIAO (0/2/0/1)
....Victor
Cataphract
Catapult
Raven
....Flea*

MARIK (1/1/2/1)
....Stalker
Awesome
Orion
....Hunchback
Trebuchet
Cicada
....Spider
Flea*

Conclusion:
My list gives 4 major 'mechs per faction, excepting Liao (3) and Marik (5). With an easy and fairly lore-friendly reshuffle of the Flea to Liao (they stole plans and built more of them), we have 4 'mechs per faction. Distribution among weight class is uneven, but gives character to each house's army. Of course, there are problems. The main ones I see are:
1. What about Mercs/FRR? My vote is for a small C-Bill boost generall for Mercs, reflecting the not wanting to be tied down to one way of doing things that defines them. FRR should have an XP boost so the poor buggers can be as ready as possible for the Clans.
2. What about variants that are exceptions? You'd have to have the K2 be Kurita, for example, and the 4X be davion. But if the 3D is Davion too, as it should be, both of the most used MWO CTFs are Davion, not Liao.
3. Why did Mariks/FRR get left out to dry on heroes?


In Direct Response:

I hesitate to say that your idea of 1 per faction quite works. As you can see from my chart, there are basic differences in production philosophy. Steiner makes 'mechs that are generally popular, but make more of them. Kurita likes to take lots of different 'mechs and make K variants of them. I am pretty uncomfortable generally with putting the Spider, Cicada, Catapult, or Stalker in categories “by default.”
Specifics:
Stalker has more Steiner factories than Marik, but is well distributed due to a long history.
Catapult is NOT a Steiner 'mech, and is deeply Liao. Pairing with RVN is, for me, the most iconic Liao image, even if both 'mechs were far from plentiful.
Hunchback has more Steiner factories than Marik or Kurita, but all have some production.

TL;DR
'Mechs associated with various houses should have small (<5%) C-Bill earning bonuses associated with them.
Each house should have 4 'mechs.
Each house can also have specialized variants of other 'mechs.
They should not be rigidly defined by weight class, allowing house character to shine through.

Edited by Khanahar, 26 May 2013 - 12:08 AM.

[Appogee]

What's its tonnage, and how much armour does it have?

The ''announcement'', colourful though it is, doesn't mention this.

[Carrioncrows]

Victor is 80 tons

Has a 320 STD
AC20
2 medium lasers
SRM4

Jumpjets.

[MonkeyCheese]

Sephlock, on 25 May 2013 - 12:45 PM, said:

So when is this coming out again?

Also, although I feel bad for the poor, poor Awesome, I'm intrigued by the Victor since at least one of the variants should be like the heavy metal (ballistic in one arm, energy in the other).

Im gonna take a guess and say It could come out after the orion but before the flea (Flea is taking time with the masc thing). So possibly a july battlemech with the current release schedule.

I also feel bad for the awesome, while yes the victor prob wont boat like the 8 series aws can it does look an awful lot like a aws 9m with jumpjets and a ballistic. If so it could easily become my new fav assault mech over my 9m.

[Augustus Martelus]

Never **** with a commando...because if you do...is big brother will come.

[John MatriX82]

MonkeyCheese, on 26 May 2013 - 02:02 AM, said:

Im gonna take a guess and say It could come out after the orion but before the flea (Flea is taking time with the masc thing). So possibly a july battlemech with the current release schedule.

I also feel bad for the awesome, while yes the victor prob wont boat like the 8 series aws can it does look an awful lot like a aws 9m with jumpjets and a ballistic. If so it could easily become my new fav assault mech over my 9m.

Orion - June
Victor - July
Flea - August

This of course if they won't address the MASC and add the Flea in July shifting the Victor to August. That's why we were all waiting for the 5th assault, because it's hard MASC will be in game so early.

About the Awesomes.. yes, until they won't add some hardpoint restrictions, I'll gladly keep the 9m (I got rid of the 8 series Awesomes) but the Victors are going to overshadow any AWS soon, the design seems even much safer for XL engines. And BIG ones since all the variants have a std 320 as default.

[Tkhaw]

Looking foward to driving one

[Kaylos Thex]

Khanahar, on 25 May 2013 - 11:53 PM, said:

In Direct Response:

I hesitate to say that your idea of 1 per faction quite works. As you can see from my chart, there are basic differences in production philosophy. Steiner makes 'mechs that are generally popular, but make more of them. Kurita likes to take lots of different 'mechs and make K variants of them. I am pretty uncomfortable generally with putting the Spider, Cicada, Catapult, or Stalker in categories “by default.”
Specifics:
Stalker has more Steiner factories than Marik, but is well distributed due to a long history.
Catapult is NOT a Steiner 'mech, and is deeply Liao. Pairing with RVN is, for me, the most iconic Liao image, even if both 'mechs were far from plentiful.
Hunchback has more Steiner factories than Marik or Kurita, but all have some production.

TL;DR
'Mechs associated with various houses should have small (<5%) C-Bill earning bonuses associated with them.
Each house should have 4 'mechs.
Each house can also have specialized variants of other 'mechs.
They should not be rigidly defined by weight class, allowing house character to shine through.

I see the merits of your distribution. It would probably be a more dynamic and interesting breakdown than mine. I agree that the Catapult is a Liao mech, but the back story of the Cataphract makes it an even more Liao mech in my eyes. If limiting myself to class parity of one per side I had to make a decision.

It was the 5 houses, and 5 mechs per class, that made me think that the Victor may have been chosen as a nod to national pedigree. Because design wise, it bears a strong resemblance to the Highlander Heavy Metal and 733C.

The 5/5 thing is a really strong coincidence to me.

Even looking at the background art on this forum I can see a Catapult, Raven, and Cataphract on the left, vs a Centurian(under the grey text area) and Jagermech to the right (among others). It makes me believe that it is a battle between the Liao's and Davion's.

Edited by Kaylos Thex, 26 May 2013 - 08:40 AM.