188 replies to this topic

[White Bear 84]

Reading through the review - i just bought my three cataphracts and i would agree on the 3D, this variant is just sweet as. The Ilya is handy too, typical loadout of two gauss and the 4X, well i think you have underatted this one.

I put XL's in ALL my Cataphracts - seems like suicide? Well, firstly the center torso is so big most of the time it gets cored before the torso, secondly this is a mech you want to torso twist to avoid fire and thirdly it is a mech that needs to offer firepower in conjunction with other mechs - of course if you get targetted by 8 mechs your going to die quick!! Dont stick an XL in and you drop down in firepower and effectiveness. This mech is a gorilla, so it needs a punch like a gorilla

These are the standard builds that work for me, the 4X dakka build is very much effective - but can be vunerable to lights. And yes, i am a fan of the guass. Note that each of these mechs have LONG RANGE weapons. If you keep at a decent range, then you wont get squashed so much - especially against twin AC/20 mechs or streakcats.

CTF-IM|Vladimir
CTF-4X|Dakka Dave
CTF-3D|Sergent Killjoy

p.s. I regularly take my 4X out for strolls to core stalkers - 80% of the time its the 4X that is left standing.

Edited by White Bear 84, 17 June 2013 - 04:42 PM.

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

White Bear 84, on 17 June 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

These are the standard builds that work for me, the 4X dakka build is very much effective - but can be vunerable to lights.

also people who can aim

[White Bear 84]

Zharot, on 17 June 2013 - 06:24 PM, said:

also people who can aim

Just like any mech

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

White Bear 84, on 17 June 2013 - 06:47 PM, said:

Just like any mech

Other mechs can torso twist or use cover between shots. Dakka mechs have to stand there, staring at their targets.

Edited by Zharot, 17 June 2013 - 07:13 PM.

[White Bear 84]

Zharot, on 17 June 2013 - 07:12 PM, said:

Other mechs can torso twist or use cover between shots. Dakka mechs have to stand there, staring at their targets.

That is true - one of the biggest drawbacks of the Jagers and Cataphracts (At least the Jager has high mounted dakka). But i have seen good pilots out there who will take shots and twist their torso so their arms take returning fire damage, more so when they are alpha firing their dakka rather than chain fire. That said, i tend to edge toward alpha shots and use the chain fire only when chasing a mech or where my front is not exposed.

[Just wanna play]

White Bear 84, on 17 June 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

Reading through the review - i just bought my three cataphracts and i would agree on the 3D, this variant is just sweet as. The Ilya is handy too, typical loadout of two gauss and the 4X, well i think you have underatted this one.

I put XL's in ALL my Cataphracts - seems like suicide? Well, firstly the center torso is so big most of the time it gets cored before the torso, secondly this is a mech you want to torso twist to avoid fire and thirdly it is a mech that needs to offer firepower in conjunction with other mechs - of course if you get targetted by 8 mechs your going to die quick!! Dont stick an XL in and you drop down in firepower and effectiveness. This mech is a gorilla, so it needs a punch like a gorilla

These are the standard builds that work for me, the 4X dakka build is very much effective - but can be vunerable to lights. And yes, i am a fan of the guass. Note that each of these mechs have LONG RANGE weapons. If you keep at a decent range, then you wont get squashed so much - especially against twin AC/20 mechs or streakcats.

CTF-IM|Vladimir
CTF-4X|Dakka Dave
CTF-3D|Sergent Killjoy

p.s. I regularly take my 4X out for strolls to core stalkers - 80% of the time its the 4X that is left standing.

um just so you know, torso twisting is a good reason NOT to put an xl in a phract, you have an easy shot at the side torso of phracts when they torso twist away and so its bound to take damage while torso twisting, possibly more so then the ct

[Lege]

It comes down to specific load outs that make certain variants better. For me the Stalker-5M is superior to others, because I can fit 5 large lasers and 24 double heat sinks, other variants can only get 23. For me the -5M gets a com star rating. It's easily my best mech, but others don't seem to like it as much. I do mech building a little different than most, I start with maximizing heat sinks then adding weapons.

[Kaio-Kerensky x10]

White Bear 84, on 17 June 2013 - 07:35 PM, said:

That is true - one of the biggest drawbacks of the Jagers and Cataphracts (At least the Jager has high mounted dakka). But i have seen good pilots out there who will take shots and twist their torso so their arms take returning fire damage, more so when they are alpha firing their dakka rather than chain fire. That said, i tend to edge toward alpha shots and use the chain fire only when chasing a mech or where my front is not exposed.

All good pilots do this. Good pilots also use high-alpha weapons so it's actually possible to do with without spraying shots all over the place uselessly.

[Just wanna play]

Lege, on 17 June 2013 - 08:24 PM, said:

It comes down to specific load outs that make certain variants better. For me the Stalker-5M is superior to others, because I can fit 5 large lasers and 24 double heat sinks, other variants can only get 23. For me the -5M gets a com star rating. It's easily my best mech, but others don't seem to like it as much. I do mech building a little different than most, I start with maximizing heat sinks then adding weapons.

true that of course there are still advantages to other, like the 3f, that you are trading for another heat sink

of course it is an srm/narc oriented 3rd missile hard point it has (only 7 tubes), noobs believe it is the best lrm boat because of that but ignore them, lol of course you found another strength of it with out any missiles

[Kyynele]

80Bit, on 06 June 2013 - 10:16 AM, said:

STK-5M
Rating: **
Role: Direct Fire Support, Indirect Fire Support
Top Speed: 65 KPH
Hard Points: 5E 5M

On paper the STK-5M looks clearly superior to the 3H. After all, it has the same weapon hard points as the 3H, plus an addition missile launcher and energy hard point. But that extra missile launcher is a single tube, and the energy hard point is center torso mounted. In exchange for those subpar hard points it turns the 3H’s 20 tube missile launchers into 10 tube. So if you want to run LRMs, the 3H is better. But what about other load outs? Well the 3F/5S have 6 (non-torso) energy hard points and 4 missile hard points. I’ll take a 6th energy weapon over a 1 tube missile launcher any day. The only thing the 5M can do better than other Stalkers is boat SSRM2s, and if that’s what you are planning on doing with your Stalker, good luck.

I didn't read all replies, so maybe this has already been mentioned, however it's obviously not corrected and is plain misinformation as it is. Yes, the 5M has a NARC tube in the LT. But that LT also has 6 SRM tubes, and thus the LT has 7 missile tubes. This means the 5th missile launcher you get in the 5M launches a maximum of 7 missiles in a salvo instead of the 1 you claim, and just shows that you haven't played the 5M, at least with proper missiles. Yes, it will shoot less missiles in a single salvo compared to the 3H, but it can fire more missiles in general than pretty much anything, if you build it to.

I occasionally play a fun, but somewhat impractical brawler 5M with 5x ML 5x ASRM6, 310 STD. The 70 point alpha is near instant, there are no single missiles coming out of a NARC tube one by one.

Edited by Kyynele, 18 June 2013 - 05:21 AM.

[William Mountbank]

Spider (30 ton)

The Spider is a mech that is loved by few, hated by most, and feared by none. One of the main advantages of the Spider is that no one fears it. Even when it's standing right behind you with a PPC and 2 medium lasers aimed at your RCT.

It is a two trick pony with one of those tricks tied behind its back by the current net code. Host State Rewind corrects this.

While you can occasionally find someone raving about an amazing match they had in their PPC SDR-5D, such results are not typical, and many players (including myself) consider the Spider to be the all-around worst mech in the game right now.
Currently in a Spider-5D I am always the last to die, and normally the only survivor in pug matches that go badly. If my team wins without steamrolling so that I have time to deal damage then 700+ damage and 4 or 5 kills is no longer surprising for a PPC-Spider.

SDR-5D

...the 5D is almost a good mech.
I think you mean to say this mech is difficult to pilot effectively, but rewards good pilots like no other.

...many 5D pilots use it to simply distract and annoy the enemy team.
Harass, flank and confuse maybe, but I only see trolls in Stalkers and Atlai. The Spider is the absolute best mech for circling around enemy formations and attacking from the rear (divide and conquer). The Raven lacks JJs or speed when packing PPCs, and like the other lights can't have 151kph, ECM and jump jets with full armour and a ER-PPC, all at the same time.

The other Spider variants might be next to useless, but the 5D is the most consistent and reliable mech I've piloted, even after the constant stream of nerfs to it's functionality. The biggest problem with it is that it's only as good as the pilot.

[80Bit]

Kyynele, on 18 June 2013 - 05:18 AM, said:

I didn't read all replies, so maybe this has already been mentioned, however it's obviously not corrected and is plain misinformation as it is. Yes, the 5M has a NARC tube in the LT. But that LT also has 6 SRM tubes, and thus the LT has 7 missile tubes. This means the 5th missile launcher you get in the 5M launches a maximum of 7 missiles in a salvo instead of the 1 you claim, and just shows that you haven't played the 5M, at least with proper missiles. Yes, it will shoot less missiles in a single salvo compared to the 3H, but it can fire more missiles in general than pretty much anything, if you build it to.

I occasionally play a fun, but somewhat impractical brawler 5M with 5x ML 5x ASRM6, 310 STD. The 70 point alpha is near instant, there are no single missiles coming out of a NARC tube one by one.

Thanks for bringing this to my attention, I will update the information. After testing in my 5M (which I bought the day Stalkers came out) I can confirm that this is one of the cases where tubes are treated as a total and work for multiple launchers at once. So it can fire 2xSRM6s in a single salvo, or two LRM10s in 2 salvos.

I still hold that the extra missile hard point is not as useful as another energy hard point, since Stalkers excel at ranged direct fire rather than brawling. But as others have pointed out, the 5 Large Laser build is pretty dang effective, I will definitely look at the 5M when I update the ratings.

[Hellboy561]

Basically after reading that your opinion is "if it doesn't have ECM throw it to one side"

[mekabuser]

OUTSTANDING OP..
with one exception,
Its a mistake to say the spider is feared by none.. that is false..
I have apporx a 2 to one k/d and my highest w/l with my spider D. all pug. Knowing what i can do in a spider makes me cautious when I see one.
I handle with care every time..

Theres a reason those who love the spider.. LOVE IT>

[80Bit]

Hellboy561, on 18 June 2013 - 07:04 AM, said:

Basically after reading that your opinion is "if it doesn't have ECM throw it to one side"

There are five mechs in the game that have ECM. I gave eight mechs "Comstar" rating. Only two of the five ECM mechs got that Comstar rating. So I really don't understand why you are making this statement.

[627]

kudos to your work, nicely written. When can we expect you review for the quicklegged?

[80Bit]

627, on 20 June 2013 - 02:00 AM, said:

kudos to your work, nicely written. When can we expect you review for the quicklegged?

I am still playing with the Quickdraw, not yet confident I have a sufficient grasp of the mech to review it. My first impressions are that it is better than a Dragon, but still has some major shortcomings. I should be able to add a review in another week or two. I will also be editing the original guide at the time to account for corrections and formatting changes others have suggested.

Edited by 80Bit, 25 June 2013 - 05:41 PM.

[Steven Dixon]

A very nice post. Like other people, I don't 100% agree with everything, but I agree with most things and I have never seen any review that I 100% agree with. Your post was intelligent and hit most of the salient points. I think that this post can be extremely useful to newer players that are just leaving the noob stage. I know that I would have loved this post many months ago.

Thank you for your contribution to the community.

[mack sabbath]

Steven Dixon, on 25 June 2013 - 10:34 PM, said:

A very nice post. Like other people, I don't 100% agree with everything, but I agree with most things and I have never seen any review that I 100% agree with. Your post was intelligent and hit most of the salient points. I think that this post can be extremely useful to newer players that are just leaving the noob stage. I know that I would have loved this post many months ago.

Thank you for your contribution to the community.

Well said.

[Rohjaz]

Extreme amount of effort put in OP's post. Great job.

Nothing to add.

Looking forward to your opinions on the newer mechs as they launch (Quickdraw? )