291 replies to this topic

[Disapirro]

3rdworld, on 11 June 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

Really a choice of:

A. They are all garbage save cool shot.
B. They are all worth using.

This

[LilPieces]

Just add a decoy module that you can fire 3 or 4 times a match that launch 6 decoys in a random pattern around your mech that show up on radar, seismic, and can be targeted and killed. The decoys would move in a random direction and speed. This makes it useful to counter seismic and also useful in other conditions.

[Disapirro]

Volthorne, on 11 June 2013 - 10:29 AM, said:

If one module is too strong then would it not be easier to nerf the one than buff everything else? Logic please.

Sure you can nerf one down to mediocrity like the others, or you can add a bunch of cool powerful toys to play with that make the game more dynamic and that dilute the one OP item. I like variety and choices. Give me more like this so that I have a tough decision about what to take, not because they all are bad, but because they are all good in different ways.

[Volthorne]

Disapirro, on 11 June 2013 - 12:00 PM, said:

Sure you can nerf one down to mediocrity like the others, or you can add a bunch of cool powerful toys to play with that make the game more dynamic and that dilute the one OP item. I like variety and choices. Give me more like this so that I have a tough decision about what to take, not because they all are bad, but because they are all good in different ways.

But if they're all REALLY GOOD then anyone who DOESN'T have one is at a huge disadvantage (IE: me. I play just enough to be a good player but I can't put in near enough hours to grind up GXP and Cbills to afford modules at any reasonable pace).

I like choices too. What I don't like is being penalized for not being able to play.

Edited by Volthorne, 11 June 2013 - 12:27 PM.

[Disapirro]

Volthorne, on 11 June 2013 - 12:26 PM, said:

But if they're all REALLY GOOD then anyone who DOESN'T have one is at a huge disadvantage (IE: me. I play just enough to be a good player but I can't put in near enough hours to grind up GXP and Cbills to afford modules at any reasonable pace).

I like choices too. What I don't like is being penalized for not being able to play.

Then you sir would be a prime example of the type of person that can pay for convenience, not pay to win mind you. You can pay to convert mech experience into GXP. I have done it to avoid playing the lesser two spider variants, and to buy this particular module. It really is not that expensive and worth it if you dont want to or cant afford investing crazy amounts of time. I do it, and you should consider it.

[Volthorne]

Disapirro, on 11 June 2013 - 03:24 PM, said:

Then you sir would be a prime example of the type of person that can pay for convenience, not pay to win mind you. You can pay to convert mech experience into GXP. I have done it to avoid playing the lesser two spider variants, and to buy this particular module. It really is not that expensive and worth it if you dont want to or cant afford investing crazy amounts of time. I do it, and you should consider it.

That's all well and good until I realize I'm earning MXP at a very low rate due to my inability to play for long (oh look, that issue again), and no amount of money can turn nothing into something. Unless you're a wizard.

[PanzerMagier]

Appogee, on 07 June 2013 - 12:55 AM, said:

I just installed my first Seismic Sensor Module.

It's ridiculously OP. I can now see when enemies are around corners, behind cover, behind me... anywhere. It's effectively a sanctioned wallhack, and it provides a ridiculously large advantage to those who have it vs those who don't.

Balancing Seismic Sensor would be relatively easy... Seismic Sensor should be disabled while you are moving.

This not only makes logical sense (come one, how could a sensor detect enemies behind a hill hundreds of metres away, over your own 40 to 100 ton footsteps?) but it would also keep the module useful at times without being OP.

Implementing this balancing solution would require just one additional line of code...
IF Speed >0.1 THEN [bypass Seismic Sensor module readout].

I added a poll in case you'd like to show your support or opposition to this idea, or offer a different idea.

Canonically... Seismic sensor comes from several geological [underground] sites that feed information to the pilot in a mech.
It would help if you would read up before you whine about such things, OP. (The sensor is not in the mech itself. So the whole logic theory falls flat there, sorry to say.) Canonically, it's supposed to track moving mechs across the entire map ,but that would actually be hilariously overpowered.

Secondly, I'm a veteran pilot, my battlefield awareness is quite sharp. Seismic allowed me to perhaps pay 30% less attention and still achieve the same amount of awareness. Less effort for me. Yey, less effort for newbies to be as good as I am. not so Yey.

Good sneaky pilots are still able to occasionally catch me off guard.
Seismic is powerful, but players with poor situational awareness will still suck even if they nerf it. These days I'm enjoying the challenge, using the knowledge of finding the ones who have seismic and then setting up an ambush. Some are so silly to believe that I vanished when I stopped moving. then they walk past me and I still core their backs.

Edited by PanzerMagier, 11 June 2013 - 07:21 PM.

[Disapirro]

Volthorne, on 11 June 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

That's all well and good until I realize I'm earning MXP at a very low rate due to my inability to play for long (oh look, that issue again), and no amount of money can turn nothing into something. Unless you're a wizard.

Well I am sorry you are not able to play enough to earn any experience to convert, but maybe this game is not for you. WoW was not for me, as I did not like the grind and I stopped playing. Not wrong, just wrong for me.

[Volthorne]

Disapirro, on 11 June 2013 - 07:44 PM, said:

Well I am sorry you are not able to play enough to earn any experience to convert, but maybe this game is not for you. WoW was not for me, as I did not like the grind and I stopped playing. Not wrong, just wrong for me.

It's not that I don't want to play, or that it's not for me, my university workload is just too severe atm.

Edited by Volthorne, 11 June 2013 - 09:27 PM.

[Solis Obscuri]

PanzerMagier, on 11 June 2013 - 07:14 PM, said:

Canonically... Seismic sensor comes from several geological [underground] sites that feed information to the pilot in a mech.
It would help if you would read up before you whine about such things, OP. (The sensor is not in the mech itself. So the whole logic theory falls flat there, sorry to say.) Canonically, it's supposed to track moving mechs across the entire map ,but that would actually be hilariously overpowered.

Nope, 'mechs have their own seismic sensors. Their range is 180m.

TacOps p. 221, Double-Blind Rules

Edited by Solis Obscuri, 12 June 2013 - 10:10 PM.

[MustrumRidcully]

FupDup, on 11 June 2013 - 10:36 AM, said:

I only have a few modules (including Adv. Seismic), but Adv. Target Decay and Adv. Sensor Range are both pretty useful. They might not be I-win buttons, but they help enough to notice the impact.


Let's not get into the logic of "it's useful so we should keep it" because then I can just deploy my hyperbole of the "Aimbot Module." It would be extremely useful, would it not? Does that mean we should add it?

I tend to think that Seismic is a bit too good, but the other modules are a bit too lame.

[One Medic Army]

MustrumRidcully, on 12 June 2013 - 11:01 PM, said:

I tend to think that Seismic is a bit too good, but the other modules are a bit too lame.

Pretty much summs up my thoughts.
Some, like faster lock-ons, increased range, lock decay, 360degree lock, cap accel, they're not bad, but they're very specific, and not much use to a lot of brawl, scout, or sniper builds.

The artillery/airstrike consumables are just pathetic. The UAV is pretty good, but it provides no direct rewards for the user to offset the cost.

Seismic, in comparison is good for everyone on every build, and it's not just good it's downright amazing.

[627]

How about making seismic an "active" module?

Lets say, press x and you have 10 secs of seismic sensor and after that, you have a cooldown for a minute or so. This would keep it useful but you need to trigger it - which means you need to keep an eye on the 'field if there could be someone incoming.

Edited by 627, 12 June 2013 - 11:15 PM.

[Monkeystador]

Appogee, on 07 June 2013 - 12:55 AM, said:

I just installed my first Seismic Sensor Module.

It's ridiculously OP. I can now see when enemies are around corners, behind cover, behind me... anywhere. It's effectively a sanctioned wallhack, and it provides a ridiculously large advantage to those who have it vs those who don't.

Balancing Seismic Sensor would be relatively easy... Seismic Sensor should be disabled while you are moving.

This not only makes logical sense (come one, how could a sensor detect enemies behind a hill hundreds of metres away, over your own 40 to 100 ton footsteps?) but it would also keep the module useful at times without being OP.

Implementing this balancing solution would require just one additional line of code...
IF Speed >0.1 THEN [bypass Seismic Sensor module readout].

I added a poll in case you'd like to show your support or opposition to this idea, or offer a different idea.

Its one of the best solutions for the first step. Only make it work when the mech stands still. Second steps would be make range dependent on the weight of the target.

PanzerMagier, on 11 June 2013 - 07:14 PM, said:

Canonically... Seismic sensor comes from several geological [underground] sites that feed information to the pilot in a mech.
It would help if you would read up before you whine about such things, OP. (The sensor is not in the mech itself. So the whole logic theory falls flat there, sorry to say.) Canonically, it's supposed to track moving mechs across the entire map ,but that would actually be hilariously overpowered.

Secondly, I'm a veteran pilot, my battlefield awareness is quite sharp. Seismic allowed me to perhaps pay 30% less attention and still achieve the same amount of awareness. Less effort for me. Yey, less effort for newbies to be as good as I am. not so Yey.

Good sneaky pilots are still able to occasionally catch me off guard.
Seismic is powerful, but players with poor situational awareness will still suck even if they nerf it. These days I'm enjoying the challenge, using the knowledge of finding the ones who have seismic and then setting up an ambush. Some are so silly to believe that I vanished when I stopped moving. then they walk past me and I still core their backs.

Canon back and forth, the sensor could well be installed in the mech. And if you want to make it fixed sensors on the map, turn it into a consumable you can drop on the ground.
Its all better than just have this thing show you all that information. IT takes away the fun of sneaking in urban combat.

Edited by Monkeystador, 12 June 2013 - 11:49 PM.

[Unbound Inferno]

I ran with the 200m Seismic and it wasn't that bad. A bit small, but not horrible. 400m - now that I have it - is hell OP and then some.

200m 1st then maybe only 300m second would do fine.

I've got other ideas on time-delay, partial or size-determined distance - but just 300m on the second would be fine. Not too far, and not too close - but worth the expansion still.

[Cervantes88]

Seismic is fine, it removes some tactics, and adds some other tactics. The problem is that you have to spend a bazillion xp and cbills to get it, everyone should benefit from seismic as a basic feature, or it should be removed at all. It's like playing without a working radar, or a reticle.

But here is the whole free to play thing put in question. Trial mechs are underpowered now with all the upgrades, i have over 2000 games played, and I still drop with/against trial mechs. What can I say to those people, they start the game and get roflstomped. Hopefully PGI gave them the Cbill boost so that they can quickly get their first mech, but with the whole :"you gotta play a lot to grind useful stuff" system, unbalanced stuff like seismic is bound to happen.

Cap assist is also pretty broken when you think of it, it often makes the difference between lose and win by itself. So is target decay for LRM boats. Or Coolant for high heat alpha builds. Seismic stands out more because it affects everyone, but yeah, it's a free-to-play game, so you have to grind to get the stuff that will help you win.

It's no fun, and would be better if you just had to buy the game 50 bucks and get the whole content unlocked for your customization choices. But as the game is far from finished yet, this would only be possible in a year or two... so be content with what you have, and get that seismic sensor so you can be on-par with everyone else. Ever tried playing without DHS since they were added ? Same deal.

[Glythe]

Seismic is fine because everyone can use it (unlike the previous ECM problem where only specific mechs had it).

Using other modules does put you at a slight disadvantage to someone who has seismic... but you can use the coolant BS or the airstrikes. Seems legit to me.

[The Original Prankster]

My suggestion is to tie the detection range to the mechs weight: Assaults would be detected far away, and light mechs only when they're very close to you. This would atleast solve the current problem of heavy mechs facing down an approaching Spider who's trying to do little hit'n'run attacks behind enemy lines, which is currently cutting down their usefulness way too much and stopping them from doing what they're supposed to. With the current seismic settings flanking is almost impossible, and this is one of the problems that is really threatening believability of the "Thinking man's FPS". If I exaggurate a bit, there's not that much thinking to do when you can always tell where your enemies are and PPC alphas rule the battlefield...

[Lord of All]

Glythe, on 13 June 2013 - 05:46 AM, said:

Seismic is fine because everyone can use it (unlike the previous ECM problem where only specific mechs had it).

Using other modules does put you at a slight disadvantage to someone who has seismic... but you can use the coolant BS or the airstrikes. Seems legit to me.

Not quite, everyone doesn't have 22k GXP for their wall hack.

Only real tweak thats absolutely needed is for it to not work while the mech it's on is moving, that is just stupid.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Volthorne, on 11 June 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

That's all well and good until I realize I'm earning MXP at a very low rate due to my inability to play for long (oh look, that issue again), and no amount of money can turn nothing into something. Unless you're a wizard.

Premium account = 50% bonus to XP
Hero mech = 30% bouns to XP