21 replies to this topic

[Just wanna play]

Okay so im a big fan of regular srms (screw streaks), no i don't boat them ever but i do like putting them on my mechs and im starting to notice a common (and lingering) occurrence before AND after missiles got hsr, i am often hitting a mech with them and no damage gets done what so ever, this has even happened in the training grounds. Has anyone else had this happen to them???? Has happened to me when piloting many mechs, and i have an internet ping rating of 40-50 almost always so im guessing that can't be it unless hsr is actually miscalculating how far back to move the mech, but this has happened on stationery mechs that have overheated and on the centurion in the training grounds so im not so sure whats going on, anyone have any thoughts???

pgi if possible could you please look into this, im not saying you should boost damage or anything, frankly i feel before doing anything to balance srms (except streaks, pretty sure they dont have this problem) you should please look and see if there is a bug with their hit detection because to me something is definitely up

[Cubivorre]

It's their HSR - Which is completely and utterly messed up/broken. Also, SRMs are very weak right now. Same with streaks. So it's not just you. PGI just doesn't have any competent programmers.

EDIT: Save maybe Kyle?..

Edited by Cubivorre, 09 June 2013 - 11:56 AM.

[Just wanna play]

Cubivorre, on 09 June 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

It's their HSR - Which is completely and utterly messed up/broken. Also, SRMs are very weak right now. Same with streaks. So it's not just you. PGI just doesn't have any competent programmers.

i wouldn't really say their weak, i love it when they actually hit, very satisfying, its just that it never seems to be all of them hitting, if any at all

is hsr active in the training grounds???? i don't think iv ever had the problem in training grounds till hsr came in

[Redshift2k5]

HSR is not just about your ping, the target's ping is also important.

If you could capture a video of it and send it to support@mwomercs.com I'm sure they'd appreciate it, but either way you should send a ticket; include your specs, your type and speed of connection, when this is occuring, etc

I've been playing a new build with a pair of SRM6s and they seem fine.

Hit detection for the training grounds is completely different than when playing the game, the training grounds is a "local" version and is not the same server-authoritative architecture we play under during the game itself.

Edited by Redshift2k5, 09 June 2013 - 11:55 AM.

[Cubivorre]

Just wanna play, on 09 June 2013 - 11:50 AM, said:

i wouldn't really say their weak, i love it when they actually hit, very satisfying, its just that it never seems to be all of them hitting, if any at all

is hsr active in the training grounds???? i don't think iv ever had the problem in training grounds till hsr came in

I don't think it is active in TG. I'm fairly certain(and don't quote me on this) that the mechs you shoot at in the TG are client-side and not server-side so you won't have HSR effecting them.

[Just wanna play]

Cubivorre, on 09 June 2013 - 11:54 AM, said:

I don't think it is active in TG. I'm fairly certain(and don't quote me on this) that the mechs you shoot at in the TG are client-side and not server-side so you won't have HSR effecting them.

hmmm so maybe its more to it then just hsr problems......

hehe just quoted you oops!

[DEMAX51]

Cubivorre, on 09 June 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

It's their HSR - Which is completely and utterly messed up/broken. Also, SRMs are very weak right now. Same with streaks. So it's not just you. PGI just doesn't have any competent programmers.

EDIT: Save maybe Kyle?..

If you think Streaks are weak, you obviously haven't played in a light lately. SRMs are still pretty crappy at the moment, but Streaks core 'Mechs like a motherf***er.

[Cubivorre]

DEMAX51, on 10 June 2013 - 07:42 AM, said:

If you think Streaks are weak, you obviously haven't played in a light lately. SRMs are still pretty crappy at the moment, but Streaks core 'Mechs like a motherf***er.

I'm a light pilot extraordinaire, to toot my own horn.

And yes - I still think they are weak. Very weak.

[DEMAX51]

Cubivorre, on 10 June 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

I'm a light pilot extraordinaire, to toot my own horn.

And yes - I still think they are weak. Very weak.

Got any reasoning to back that up? Because in my (very extensive) light pilot experience, they cause massive damage to a 'mech's center torso, while requiring very little skill to use effectively.

Personally, I hate Streaks. When I'm pugging or playing around in a 4-man, I bring my JR7-F probably 90% of the time because it's way more fun and better practice. But I do use Streaks when I have a competitive match - because I think they're a bit OP right now due of their propensity to core lights. They may not be as effective against heavier 'Mechs, but they're devastating against lights.

Edit: If you want to test this out, I'll be happy to go up against you in a 1 v 1. You bring a light sans-Streaks and I'll bring my JR7-D, and we'll see how it plays out

Edited by DEMAX51, 10 June 2013 - 11:22 AM.

[Cubivorre]

DEMAX51, on 10 June 2013 - 11:14 AM, said:

Got any reasoning to back that up? Because in my (very extensive) light pilot experience, they cause massive damage to a 'mech's center torso, while requiring very little skill to use effectively.

Personally, I hate Streaks. When I'm pugging or playing around in a 4-man, I bring my JR7-F probably 90% of the time because it's way more fun and better practice. But I do use Streaks when I have a competitive match - because I think they're a bit OP right now due of their propensity to core lights. They may not be as effective against heavier 'Mechs, but they're devastating against lights.

My reasoning is just the same as your reasoning.

DEMAX51, on 10 June 2013 - 11:14 AM, said:

my (very extensive) light pilot experience

As well as

DEMAX51, on 10 June 2013 - 11:14 AM, said:

my (very extensive)

Experience in all weight classes.

Edited by Cubivorre, 10 June 2013 - 11:35 AM.

[DEMAX51]

Having extensive experience, in Lights specifically or in the game on the whole, isn't reasoning. I'm not trying to start a "******* contest," I'm just asking you explain your position, perhaps with examples from your own experiences.

I have given specific reasons as to why I think Streaks are an (perhaps overly) effective weapon. You have given no examples as to why you believe they are "weak. Very weak." All I'm asking is for you to tell me why you believe that - because who knows? Maybe you've thought of something I haven't and maybe if you're able to adequately explain your thinking you might get me to reevaluate my own.

After all - this is the New Player Help forum, not the gameplay balance forum. I'm not here to argue whether Streaks are OP, but you're telling somebody who's new that Streaks are worthless without giving any indication as to why whereas I pointed out that they can in fact be useful in certain situations.

Edited by DEMAX51, 10 June 2013 - 11:38 AM.

[DEMAX51]

accidental double-post

Edited by DEMAX51, 10 June 2013 - 11:38 AM.

[Koreanese]

Buff srms! So I can have fun again

[Demosthones]

Cubivorre, on 10 June 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

I'm a light pilot extraordinaire, to toot my own horn.

And yes - I still think they are weak. Very weak.

Nah, streaks are fine. There is a difference between weak and that crazy splash damage that would 1 hit a commando back in the day. Are streaks as great as they used to be? Nope. But that is ok with me.

However, I do believe srms need a buff to damage. This would also help with the sniper warrior that has been going on. Best way to kill a sniper is to take him out of his perfered range and make him fight in yours.

[Postumus]

So, after the recent change in flight path that happened to SRMs, they are actually way more consistent than ever. HSR is also a bonus, in most situations it will actually improve hit detection, but it has a couple very specific drawbacks. First is shooting after leaving cover. Say you have your 2x SRM4 Jenner D, or SRM 6 and 2 on a raven, if you make a habit of popping out from behind buildings and blasting people with your SRMs immediately (which you should), you will notice that if you are too quick on the draw, even if you hit you will do no damage. This isn't a malfunction, its just an unintended side effect of HSR. Basically what happened was, it rewound the game state and found you behind cover, unable to actually hit your target. This is ping dependent though. The second annoying thing about HSR is that if either your or your target has highly variable ping, then the HSR hitbox is going to be having a mini-seizure on the server while it tries to figure out where you guys where. This can result in no damage, or partial damage, or odd damage.

[Just wanna play]

Koreanese, on 10 June 2013 - 11:39 AM, said:

Buff srms! So I can have fun again

at first i felty the same way, but no i feel as though (for me at least, iv notiuced some epople say those with low ping have issues with sr) the reason they sem so weak is because you rarely get all of the missiles to hit, imo they shouldnt boost/nerf weapons that dont complelty work yet


and about that short little streaks being weak or not conversation, the only reason you dmax feel is they arent weak is because you use them against lights where the fact that they always hit the ct (this is why they seem op, along with regular srms having iffy hit detection, most of a streaks damage almost always gets put on the ct) out weighs the not so important low damage since your opponents dont have the most armor anyway, the other guy im sure feels that higher accuracy against faster targets isnt that important against someone moving at 60kph but has more then 3 times the armor of the jenners you face

and you shouldn't have to rely on srms just be have fun or be an effective brawler, just saying


well pffft okay so srm 4 weighs the same as a streak or when Artemis equipped....
just curious, i am i the only that sees a problem with streaks being a guaranteed hit while adding 50% to the weight of the original launcher (the srm2) while Artemis adds 100% more weight and another critical and only reduces shot grouping by 33%, of course if all launchers weigh 50% when they are streaks thankfully an artemis equipped srm 6 will be lighter then a streak srm 6, it just seems that the srm 2 is lighter as a streak then when artemis equipped

Edited by Just wanna play, 10 June 2013 - 11:52 AM.

[Just wanna play]

Demosthones, on 10 June 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

Best way to kill a sniper is to take him out of his perfered range and make him fight in yours.

isnt that a change in tactics and not necessarily a boost in weaponry??

so i am the only one who has noticed srm hit detection problems on many different mechs (not just when quickly popping in and out of cover)

[Literally]

JustWannaPlay, Greetings from the Word of Lowtax!  
Since this thread has had exactly zero empirical or constructive input (excepting Postumus), let me help out.  Right now, SRM's seem to be doing very little damage because their splash radius has been dramatically reduced.  If you played before this nerf, you will notice that SRMs don't seem to detonate lights by blowing up and hitting most of their hitboxes at once anymore.  However, direct damage is working fine.  It is very valuable to go and read the last few patch notes (http://mwomercs.com/...61-patch-notes/) whenever you have a question like this - just do a find function for SRM and you should get everything you're looking for. Right now SRMs effectively do much less damage than they originally did, but since artemis keeps the missiles very well clustered, it is possible to kill an enemy mech faster than before if you score the hits in the right place.
As for SRMs not seeming to hit, I very very rarely get this effect anymore.  At the risk of sounding foolish, are you sure that your target didn't make it slightly out of range, where the missiles would detonate after 270m of flight, without doing any damage?  If this isn't the case, I'm not sure what would cause it.
It's worth noting that anyone who has the knee-jerk pejorative response "PGI doesn't have any competent programmers" is the kind of person with low resistance to other types of knee-jerk responses - that is to say, someone whose anecdotal opinion isn't well though-out or researched.  Can you provide a short recording of SRMs hitting a mech in the training grounds but doing no damage?  If this is a reproducable error then I am sure PGI will want to see it!

Edited by Literally, 10 June 2013 - 12:17 PM.

[Postumus]

Artemis is best with the big launchers, always. An SRM2 gets the same ton added as an LRM20. Artemis is still awesome, if you have the weight, but it doesn't necessary make sense for lighter mechs, where streaks are a better proposition.

[Literally]

Postumus,
  I very much agree.  It is without question more efficient to add artemis to a larger launcher than a small one.  Anyone who wants to point this out to the various pubbies using 6xA-LRM5 Catapult-A1 builds has my blessing.  I find that with the new 'flight path' modifications, the SRM4 has a tight enough cluster for me - I only use artemis on SRM-6s anyways.  You make an interesting point about the possibility of HSR killing your missiles from cover.  I think I've been compensating for pre-HSR behavior for so long that I haven't noticed if this is happening.  I'll test it when I'm at home and see what happens.  JustWannaPlay, could that be the error you're seeing?

Edited by Literally, 10 June 2013 - 12:27 PM.