73 replies to this topic

[Xeno Phalcon]

Flamers can't be adjusted to the levels of previous MW games, the ability to boat and NUKE people was pretty over the top. (Imagine a Quickdraw giggling around the battlefield with six flamers and all the double heatsinks he could find space for, then give him the ability to perpetually shut enemy mechs down even if they are very cool runners and eventually cause them to suicide.)

Personally I would rather they set people on fire for a short duration (Say, like applying NARC, but with fire) that would reduce their ability to dissipate heat until flames went out (not remove, but reduce their total) this would make boating them pretty pointless but make having one on hand much more attractive to lights/infighters.

Of course this completely negates the point of the BJ-1X stock but.....really who runs that thing stock?

[IceSerpent]

Sephlock, on 13 June 2013 - 04:36 PM, said:

You mean the most fun .

For me it's about as much fun as shooting mechs in the practice grounds, but whatever gets you through the night...

[Shumabot]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 June 2013 - 03:09 AM, said:

As they had done for over 25 years on TT.

And mechanics like that are why TT's been dead for 10 of them!

[Hotthedd]

Just a thought, but if the heat cap for all mechs was lowered, and the heat dissipation increased (as has been suggested numerous times), wouldn't that in itself make flamers more useful? (I am assuming that flamers affect dissipation as well as raising heat).

Keeping an enemy mech at 90% heat would be incredibly effective without being a stun lock.

[MasterErrant]

Gorgarath, on 13 June 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

no your wrong this has been tested in many other posts and by me personaly flamers will overheat you faster than the enemy so your FALSE!!!

Gorgarath, on 13 June 2013 - 12:52 PM, said:

no your wrong this has been tested in many other posts and by me personaly flamers will overheat you faster than the enemy so your FALSE!!!

flamers are a tool, not a weapon. they were used to kill infantry and destroy material. the heat thing was a secondary quirk.

[Frisk]

Steel your Life, on 13 June 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Seriously Flamers are so badly designed so completely useless and this is still going on after they have been given developer attention multiple times?

I feel that the flamers are just an ingame symbol to show just how incompetent your design team is capable of being.

what am i talking about?

Flamers overheat the person using them faster then they overheat the guy your using them on.
That fact aside even if you have 3 or 4 of them they dont overheat an enemy mech to the 90% cap quickly, moderately or even slowly they dont do anything at all worth having them equipped.

the reason for this post belive it or not is not to just ridicule the design team but to try and find out what possible reason there could be for failing so horribly on flamers.

Do you game test changes before you put them in updates?

Do you have trouble with basic calculations of heat per second when programming the changes into your functions?

Was it your intention to make the only weapon in the game able to overheat another mech completely useless because you dont like that game mechanic but wanted to follow tabletop?

Someone is butt-hurt.

Flamers also are good to block a pilots vision...

Edited by Frisk, 14 June 2013 - 01:53 PM.

[Karazyr]

oh here we go again, why do i come to this section of the forum again? oh yeah to troll and abuse dumb people


but really flamers are not that bad right now, least they work...kinda and they cant be boated! huzzah!.... yeah....

[General Taskeen]

MasterErrant, on 14 June 2013 - 01:49 PM, said:

flamers are a tool, not a weapon. they were used to kill infantry and destroy material. the heat thing was a secondary quirk.

Right, BUT like the Machine Gun... BOTH actually do small damage to Battle Mechs and this is a game where infantry does not exist.

Basically they should have concentrated on making the Flamer do work as one weapon (1 ton, same as medium laser) and balance it from there.

Xeno Phalcon, on 14 June 2013 - 03:18 AM, said:

Flamers can't be adjusted to the levels of previous MW games, the ability to boat and NUKE people was pretty over the top.

If you can't think outside the box, then of course not. The devs have instituted an anti-stun 'cap' to the amount of heat the flamer raises a Mech too. Past Mech games didn't have the concept of anti-stun 'cap' to heat for Flamers.

If they MARRY the concept of this weapon from past games and the current, then we get a useful Flamer.

Edited by General Taskeen, 14 June 2013 - 08:41 PM.

[CTsai]

While I do agree with the fact that flamer is pretty useless no matter how you cut it, the OP has been acting like a 10 year old who does nothing but cry about something being under powered if its not a +10 gold plated 1337 haxor 360 no scope one shot ko mech(Come on, he complained about atlas being underpowered for F***'s sake). Therefore I must say, go back and play your COD kid(sorry for all the COD players out there).

[Sephlock]

CTsai, on 15 June 2013 - 02:08 AM, said:

While I do agree with the fact that flamer is pretty useless no matter how you cut it, the OP has been acting like a 10 year old who does nothing but cry about something being under powered if its not a +10 gold plated 1337 haxor 360 no scope one shot ko mech(Come on, he complained about atlas being underpowered for F***'s sake). Therefore I must say, go back and play your COD kid(sorry for all the COD players out there).

That's exactly what he is.

[Wakdjunkaga]

There is one way to get flamers to be a must have weapon.
Damage is based on your heat level~
And, firing them reduces heat which is used as a resource.
But wak, that is op, or very op...
First lets look at damage
At 0-24% heat your flamers do .3 dps
At 25-49% heat your flamers do .6 dps
At 50-74% heat your flamers do .9 dps
At 75-99% heat your flamers do 1.2 dps

Flamers would also apply stacks of a heatsink debuff that temporarily shuts down hs cooling ability
1-10 stacks that sluff off after 1 second per stack
That means the most you can do is negate 10 heatsinks worth of cooling so if you were under fire by a flamerboat, you could flame back, or really slow your firing to keep from overheating

Now heat application would be lowered to 80% cap, and heat per firing would change slightly.
At 0-24% heat, you spend 1 heat to apply .5 heat.
At 25-49% heat you spend 1 heat to apply 1 heat.
At 50-74% heat you spend 1 heat to apply 2 heat.
At 75-99% heat you spend 1 heat to apply 4 heat.

Nobody is getting stunlocked, everyone will have some flamers.

[Bishop Steiner]

OP USES YET ANOTHER POST TO +1 THEIR INCOMPETENCE LVL

[Sephlock]

Bishop Steiner, on 15 June 2013 - 07:06 AM, said:

OP USES YET ANOTHER POST TO +1 THEIR INCOMPETENCE LVL

[MaddMaxx]

Unbound Inferno, on 13 June 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

The only real complaint I have on MWO Flamers vs BT is that its damage is too high and its range is too short. Its intended to overheat the target not really cause damage.

In BT the Flamer matches the range of the Small Laser, but its damage is less

Flamer
3 Heat
2 Damage
1-3 Range
1 Ton IS
0.5 Ton Clan

Small Laser
1 Heat
3 Damage
1-3 Range
0.5 Ton

The current damage spread of it is fine, but the value of it needs to be less and the range ought to be up from 64m. I would say a max range of 120m on the Flamer, with 0.2 damage - the self heat needs to be reduced to 0.3 with the target receiving a total 0.5 heat. That is calculated on a relative reduction similar to original MG damage.

A good item to add right here.

Quote

"
Description

Introduced in 2025, the standard Flamer taps into a BattleMech's reactor to produce heat in the form of a plasma release.
An extremely short-ranged weapon, the Flamer is devastating against infantry, however damage done against other 'Mechs and vehicles is negligible, though it can raise the enemy unit's heat levels.
The Flamer is also often used to set ambient objects such as trees aflame, making it useful for burning forests or cities in order to slow the enemy down or cover friendly movements."