63 replies to this topic

[Roland]

OP is an example of folks complaining about non-existent problems, because they don't actually understand how the game works.

At some point, he heard about "macros" and then got under the mistaken impression that somehow it's making the AC2's kill him faster.

[ReissTC]

Ah, macro'd AC/2s. They sound awesome, and it can be a little unnerving to see something firing so fast at you. Shame it's useless since it spreads damage all over a mech (just twist a bit, as if you were going up against lasers).

4 AC/2s being fired all at once is more threatening. 8 damage, pinpoint alpha every half a second.

[Sephlock]

ColonelMetus, on 18 June 2013 - 11:08 PM, said:

jager mech using mouse macro spam to fire AC 2 faster then they are ment to fire is OP, it can kill an atlas fromm full hp before the atlas can even turn its torso, how is that fun or even fair?

This isn't an LRM exaggeration post, but I think it deserves honorable mention, at least.

[MrTarget]

Kyynele, on 18 June 2013 - 11:30 PM, said:

Oh yes. Stock Atlai have 94 armor in the CT, and 62 internal IIRC, and thus will take 156 damage to core. 4 AC/2s do a maximum of 8 damage per every half second if you alpha or macro spam as fast as possible. With that it'd take 10 seconds and over a ton of AC/2 ammo to kill an Atlas assuming no overheating.

You might want to adjust your mouse sensitivity if it takes you more than 10 seconds to turn the torso of your Atlas.

If he is turning round then why would he be shooting at his CT? Personally I would shoot at the soft squishy Atlas back armour, which in a AC2 macro Jager/Phract you would remove in seconds.

[OneEyed Jack]

Did you know that a Jenner with 4xAC2s, macroed, and true double heat sinks could core an Atlas in 3 seconds?

KrazedOmega, on 19 June 2013 - 02:38 AM, said:

Damage from AC/2 macros isn't the problem it's the constant screen shake and smoke making aiming almost impossible that is the issue. It's worst than the SSRM chain fire.

Yeah.... no. There's a little smoke, but screen shake is almost non-existent from AC2. Now, there was a time this was correct. For a very brief span, CTF-4X with 4xAC2 was possibly the most dangerous mech in the game, between high DPS and screen shake so bad you were pretty much helpless. That time is not now.

[Felbombling]

Hate to burst the bubble, but there is indeed a difference between rocking with a macro and not. It is fairly plain to see in that video on page 1. Back in the days of incredible cockpit shake, I'd put the quad AC/2s on my Cataphract into two weapon groups, both on chain fire. One group had the left arm weapons and the other the right arm weapons. I would just stagger the moment I pressed the appropriate mouse button to get a continuous stream of shells. At one point I had them all on the same group set to regular fire but soon realized it was a wasted button.

Edited by StaggerCheck, 19 June 2013 - 05:53 AM.

[Ph30nix]

posts like this just prove my theory that this game is almost perfect the real problem is the players.

[Ngamok]

FunkyFritter, on 18 June 2013 - 11:11 PM, said:

Using a macro doesn't actually make them fire any faster, it just staggers them to make it sound cool. Alpha striking your ac2s will output the same damage, more if there's any hiccup at all in the macro timing.

If you use a macro to start and stop your firing it makes it so you can aim better since your index finger isn't pressing a button. Trust me, if I had a macro and bound it to my space bar or another easy to reach button to start and stop my macro, I would be even more accurate.

[burns]

StaggerCheck, on 19 June 2013 - 05:51 AM, said:

Hate to burst the bubble, but there is indeed a difference between rocking with a macro and not. It is fairly plain to see in that video on page 1. Back in the days of incredible cockpit shake, I'd put the quad AC/2s on my Cataphract into two weapon groups, both on chain fire. One group had the left arm weapons and the other the right arm weapons. I would just stagger the moment I pressed the appropriate mouse button to get a continuous stream of shells. At one point I had them all on the same group set to regular fire but soon realized it was a wasted button.

It´s not wasted at all, as it´s able to fill some gaps inbetween 2x2 individually fired AC/2´s.

Left arm 2 AC/2 (LMB), right arm 2 AC/2 (RMB), both on chain fire.
3´rd firing group with all 4 AC/2´s, without chainfire!


Now upon contact you´d start firing with either arm, making sure you hit, then starting to fire the other arm aswell. If you hit the sweet spot you´ll notice (it´s very audible), and once you did that, you start firing the 3´rd group aswell - bam - macro fire, without rolling fingers or using macros!

Edited by burns, 19 June 2013 - 06:03 AM.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

All the rapid-fire AC2 macro builds do is scare people. They're worse than simple group fire when it comes to damage output (because group fire concentrates damage far better).

[Felbombling]

@ burns

I can use a two button mouse to get the same effect, almost, of using a macro. You are indeed correct, though. Adding the third button for all the cannons does create a macro in essence... I just never bothered for two reasons. One, the screen shake back then was already effective enough, and two for heat issues. I've done that three button setup with Ultra AC/5s to great effect. So what if they jam... at some point they will send out four shells within a second of each other, anyway, so stay on target.

[FupDup]

I just wish that chain-fire didn't have that stupid 0.5 second delay. Without it, macros wouldn't be as "necessary" (if you want to call it that but it's a huge stretch) in the first place.

[Kaspirikay]

It would be better to alpha strike with the AC2s, anyway. But I agree that the game needs to have inbuilt macros, or outlaw them altogether.

[Howdy Doody]

FupDup, on 19 June 2013 - 07:02 AM, said:

I just wish that chain-fire didn't have that stupid 0.5 second delay. Without it, macros wouldn't be as "necessary" (if you want to call it that but it's a huge stretch) in the first place.

Yep. If chainfire worked for AC/2s like it does for lasers this isn't an issue. On my hunchie with 9 med lasers in chainfire it will fire each laser with each button click. Not the same on the AC/2s for some reason.

[TOGSolid]

Oh boy it's another one of these threads!

1.) Macro users aren't doing anything someone without a macro can't do. By grouping my AC/2s correctly I can create the exact same rapid fire effect with minimal effort.

2.) This does not increase the DPS of the AC/2. They're doing the exact same DPS as if you just group fired them or if you just bound one to its own group and held the buttons down together.

3.) This causes the damage to get spread out unless the target is standing stock still in which case the target is an ***** (or disconnected/afk) and deserves to die.

4.) The only reason people do this is because it's cool as **** to do. Seriously, that's it. You're sacrificing accuracy just to look awesome, sound awesome, and scare the **** out of people. You're getting no gameplay advantage out of it, you're much better off group firing all your ACs so that they hit the same spot more reliably.

5.) If you are complaining about this macro then you clearly have no idea how this game works and really do need to learn to play.

[Ngamok]

TOGSolid, on 19 June 2013 - 11:43 AM, said:

Oh boy it's another one of these threads!

1.) Macro users aren't doing anything someone without a macro can't do. By grouping my AC/2s correctly I can create the exact same rapid fire effect with minimal effort.

2.) This does not increase the DPS of the AC/2. They're doing the exact same DPS as if you just group fired them or if you just bound one to its own group and held the buttons down together.

3.) This causes the damage to get spread out unless the target is standing stock still in which case the target is an ***** (or disconnected/afk) and deserves to die.

4.) The only reason people do this is because it's cool as **** to do. Seriously, that's it. You're sacrificing accuracy just to look awesome, sound awesome, and scare the **** out of people. You're getting no gameplay advantage out of it, you're much better off group firing all your ACs so that they hit the same spot more reliably.

I hope you realize this really is an advantage. Some people are skilled by pressing the mouse buttons and targeting accurately. But if you had to do one less function with your right hand and only worry about the reticle and not moving your fingers or depressing a key(s) to fire and your left hand pressed a button to start / stop a macro, it's a benefit.

5.) If you are complaining about this macro then you clearly have no idea how this game works and really do need to learn to play.

There is a hidden advantage, only having to worry about my right hand. If I had a macro that would start / stop with space bar thumb press of my left hand, all I'd have to worry about on my right hand is moving my mouse and not pressing the RMB / LMB. Yes, I use a Keyboard + Mouse, not a Nostromo (which is easy to macro with) or Joystick.

Edited by Ngamok, 19 June 2013 - 01:09 PM.

[TOGSolid]

Ngamok, on 19 June 2013 - 01:04 PM, said:

There is a hidden advantage, only having to worry about my right hand. If I had a macro that would start / stop with space bar thumb press of my left hand, all I'd have to worry about on my right hand is moving my mouse and not pressing the RMB / LMB. Yes, I use a Keyboard + Mouse, not a Nostromo (which is easy to macro with) or Joystick.

Just exactly how much thought do you have to put into clicking your mouse? Jeez.

If you do it manually enough then you commit the action to muscle memory and it takes as little effort as remembering to hit the fire button for any other weapon.

[Ngamok]

TOGSolid, on 19 June 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

Just exactly how much thought do you have to put into clicking your mouse? Jeez.

If you do it manually enough then you commit the action to muscle memory and it takes as little effort as remembering to hit the fire button for any other weapon.

It's not the thought but an ease of use thing. Say I had a program (there are many out there) that pretty much pressed 1 2 3 4 with a 0.5s delay that I could start and stop with 1 button press. If I set it up to do that and not actually have to press my mouse keys that correspond to weapon groups 1 - 4 to fire 4 AC/2s or fire them in groups of two every 0.5s or 3 if you have 6 AC/2s, don't you think that would be easy than having to press mouse buttons? That's why people macro, to simplify something.

Edit: Give you an example. In RIFT we wrote macros for skills with cool downs so that way we can fire them when their cool down was up. If the ability was on cool down, it would cast the next ability in the list till that first ability came off it's cool down. So you have an ability that has a 30s cool down and one that has a 15s and one that has a 10s and one that is instant, you write the macro to cast the longest one first, then the second longest, and so on. Then, you eliminate the need to have 4 abilities on 4 keys. instead they are all bound to one.

Double Edit: Shatter combos of Frost mages in WoW, same thing.

Edited by Ngamok, 19 June 2013 - 01:37 PM.

[MasterErrant]

FunkyFritter, on 18 June 2013 - 11:11 PM, said:

Using a macro doesn't actually make them fire any faster, it just staggers them to make it sound cool. Alpha striking your ac2s will output the same damage, more if there's any hiccup at all in the macro timing.

um sory but you are wrong. record one of the fast firers and count. ive seen several with a total ROF of 14 tghat's a dps of 28 of seven per gun. about 25% of the players useing this build seem to be useing some sort of rof buff. a simple macro givesa rof of 8 it should sound just a little slower than an mg
I've reported it and been told to keep doing so by "Comgaurd" which tells me thatg it is a problem.

[Kyynele]

MasterErrant, on 19 June 2013 - 02:00 PM, said:

um sory but you are wrong. record one of the fast firers and count. ive seen several with a total ROF of 14 tghat's a dps of 28 of seven per gun. about 25% of the players useing this build seem to be useing some sort of rof buff. a simple macro givesa rof of 8 it should sound just a little slower than an mg
I've reported it and been told to keep doing so by "Comgaurd" which tells me thatg it is a problem.

Wat.

What a macro is and what a macro does is that it cycles through the weapon groups with better precision than a human manually could. That is it. AC/2 cooldown is 0.5s no matter how much you macro or don't macro. One AC/2 does 4 DPS no matter how you fire it.

If my math is right, with 6 AC/2 on a Jager-DD you can set a macro to fire each of them with 0.0833s intervals. That is a ROF of 12 per second, and that is how it should work. The DPS and heat generation is exactly the same as it would be firing those 6 AC/2 simultaneously.