50 replies to this topic

[qwerty]

John MatriX82, on 28 June 2013 - 05:45 AM, said:

Absolutely not, re-read what I wrote, that's not lag shooting, it's a positional/aiming desynchronization from what you see in your client and that also the Server should see due to HSR.

But since your stance and your aiming position are rolled back to an EARLIER moment than the one you actually saw in your client (this due to ping and to lag), many hits don't get awarded, because the server tracks your shot to an aiming spot and/or to a physical stance that was earlier than that in your client.

i have kept aim on the CT of a Heavy mech and it has missed completely at 150M by your statement i should be hitting.

but getting back to wonkys post

+1 WoNkY SaUsAgE

PGI should pay listen to this man

Edited by qwerty, 28 June 2013 - 06:07 AM.

[John MatriX82]

qwerty, on 28 June 2013 - 06:06 AM, said:

i have kept aim on the CT of a Heavy mech and it has missed completely at 150M by your statement i should be hitting.

but getting back to wonkys post

+1 WoNkY SaUsAgE

PGI should pay listen to this man

Sometimes hits aren't awarded at all. Especially when they land in the land of nothing, which is the area between two different hitboxes (like in the separation line from the CT and the RT or the LT).
In there HSR goes fubar and either:
-paints your crosshair red, but no damage is awarded at all to the target
-doesn't paint your crosshair red, but dmg is awarded for a fraction of it, like you have painted a medium laser to the whole enemy mech.

The above behavior happens in training grounds AND live environment.

You may have experienced this.. or a combination between aiming desynchronization and this. Other times hits are missed completely especially on ballistics and ppcs (which are the same for the game), but like 90% of the times they can fall either in the HSR desync or "the land of nothing" hitboxes I've just described.

Edited by John MatriX82, 28 June 2013 - 06:14 AM.

[King Arthur IV]

i am having the same issue and it is not my cpu or my net. i havent moved, my country hasnt sailed further away. i do not have any of the same problems in other games, only this one.

i understand that programming issues are not a quick fix but i would sure appreciate if pgi acknowledge our concerns and let us know they are looking into it. a simple acknowledgment thread with short updates like "still working on it" would be better then the cold shoulder or telling us it is some other problem on our side.

i assure you 100% i have done nothing different since i started playing this game 5 months ago but in that time the game has been a roller coaster ride on my end. when i started this game 5 months ago i had a ping of 300 and it was unplayable, few months in they did something and i was playing at 250. 230-250 is good and very playable but now its back to 300-350 and not only does everyone rubberband but i am rubberbanding in my own screen. i have changed nothing on my end, i do not stream or do anything else besides use teamspeak and there is ZERO problems in the other online games i play.

Edited by King Arthur IV, 28 June 2013 - 09:22 AM.

[Splitpin]

King Arthur IV, on 28 June 2013 - 08:38 AM, said:

i am having the same issue and it is not my cpu or my net. i havent moved, my country hasnt sailed further away. i do not have any of the same problems in other games, only this one.

i understand that programming issues are not a quick fix but i would sure appreciate if pgi acknowledge our concerns and let us know they are looking into it. a simple acknowledgment thread with short updates like "still working on it" would be better then the cold shoulder or telling us it is some other problem on our side.

i assure you 100% i have done nothing different since i started playing this game 5 months ago but in that time the game has been a roller coaster ride on my end. when i started this game 5 months ago i had a ping of 300 and it was unplayable, few months in they did something and i was playing at 250. 230-250 is good and very playable but now its back to 300-350 and not only does everyone rubberband but i am rubberbanding in my own screen. i have changed nothing on my end, i do not stream or do anything else besides use teamspeak and there is ZERO problems in the other online games i play.

This has been acknowledged here http://mwomercs.com/...longer-working/ by Karl Berg. Unfortunately with every previous patch's feedback being archived with each new patch, resolved or not, worthwhile PGI replies get lost. Could this please be added to known issues.

Edited by Splitpin, 28 June 2013 - 04:00 PM.

[X3N2R10N]

Splitpin, on 28 June 2013 - 03:51 PM, said:

This has been acknowledged here http://mwomercs.com/...longer-working/ by Karl Berg. Unfortunately with every previous patch's feedback being archived with each new patch, resolved or not, worthwhile PGI replies get lost. Could this please be added to known issues.

I believe you are referring to this post :-

by Karl Berg
Posted 14 June 2013 - 03:07 AM

Quote

Hey guys; yes, as you've noticed our issues with packet latency and loss aren't completely sorted, although the graphs indicate we came pretty close. With this very last patch we're now within about 10 to 20% of the total packet rate from about a month ago, except now players won't get disconnected due to low levels of packet loss or large latency variations. We have another fix coming with next patch to try and bring us all the way back in line, which should hopefully also solve the latency problems several users are noticing.

HSR, as it is right now, is extremely sensitive to varying latency, so for those of you experiencing large latency variations due to the increased send rate, this next patch should make things much better. Slightly longer term we are discussion options for removing the need to compute latency for HSR all together.

now where was this post ?
it was here -

• MWO / FORUMS / SUPPORT & FEEDBACK / ARCHIVE / PAST FEEDBACK

this is exactly what i mean when i said this :-

Quote

Now, if there is a problem/error, people ARE going to find out, you as a game developer (PGI) should at the very least have the courtesy to admit to these problems and show/inform us how you are going about containing/solving it by having a working thread which is highly visible so that the majority of users will see it and feel reassured that PGI is working on it.

Instead you deny, ignore or have a no comment attitude ultimately only to give a official vague reply about "how you are looking into it" only when a thread has sufficently grown mostly into a flame war, and us your community have to sift down to the very depths of the forums to find it. It makes me think PGI intentionally want to cover up and hope the issue dies down or fades into memory.

More than half of the flame posts can be eliminated/would not have been posted, if PGI just gets their act together and have working threads with objective goals, timelines and prompt postings on problems/errors. Dont wait until we come and tell you there is a problem and then you pretend there isnt one ... that is absolutely disgusting.

As Splitpin has kindly pointed out above, the question we should be asking is: -

why was that official post left to rot in the archives when it was still relevant and not resolved ?
why is it not in the known issues official thread ?
they promised a fix in the next very patch did it happen ? (see bold text in karl bergs official post) - no it didnt or at least nothing happened for me and a lot of people experiencing the same problem.
did they come back to us - the community after that 1 official post which has now drowned in the sea of past archives ? - no they didnt.

I rest my case

Regards,
WoNkY SaUsAgE

Edited by WoNkY SaUsAgE, 28 June 2013 - 09:22 PM.

[Amsro]

Hit detection is not working as intended. Some matches and moments are fine, then other times its delayed or no firing of weapons upon shooting. Some hits apply damage and some do not, depends on the mood of the weapon.

[Pericles]

I have an average ping of about 50 and I too am having an issue with this terrible hit detection. This isn't just for fast mechs ether. for me it seems like the Enemy mech is almost cored, then the hits stop damaging the mech. All I get is the hit flash and nothing else.

[Pando]

So,

I might sound like a *********....most times....but I HATE hitting battlemechs and not seeing my red reticule or targets paper-doll light up with serious damage.

I'm frequently breaking brand new headsets ($10 logitech ones) when i slam them down on my desk with hulk-strength because I missed someone...because of HSR..

I HATE finishing 1st with only 700 damage having 4 kills because I know well and good it should have been over 1,000 with 6-8 kills.

If people think PPC's are overpowered now. Imagine what they would be like if HSR was functioning at 100%.

[King Arthur IV]

Splitpin, on 28 June 2013 - 03:51 PM, said:

This has been acknowledged here http://mwomercs.com/...longer-working/ by Karl Berg. Unfortunately with every previous patch's feedback being archived with each new patch, resolved or not, worthwhile PGI replies get lost. Could this please be added to known issues.

but where is this post? i have to navigate a maze of a forum to find my answer. why are post like this not addresses in a official link? it is also dated nearly 2 weeks ago. you can spend hours looking through hundreds of post before you come across anything from the devs.

should i be playing or forum roaming? official statements should be made in a easily accessible area for all to ..... easily access. i want to get onto the forums find the answer to my questions and get back to something else. this would also avoid clutter from clone questions.

btw your link does not answer why latency is back up or why rubberbanding is back or they see it as a problem.

Edited by King Arthur IV, 29 June 2013 - 08:58 AM.

[Havok1978]

Steel Will, on 28 June 2013 - 03:44 AM, said:

If it makes any of you feel better you can live in the US with a sub 100ms ping and still have this issue. Sorting this needs to be an immediate priority.

Yup, I live in north central texas, a literal beeline from chicago, and my ping is 69ms but while I see clientside hits, the server side doesnt register them since last patch.

its not always consistant either though I have noticed. but roughly 3/4 of the games I launch into its so bad I cant play.
My hits land clientside but not serverside, even when mechs are standing still, I can conversaly, be killed instantly with no warning at all, so with those things in mind it seems very much to be some type of latency/sync issue.

oh and just to note, some folks think ping = latency... it does not, they are two different things though typically a good ping will mean low latency, thats not always the case.

[Havok1978]

MGA121285, on 28 June 2013 - 05:31 AM, said:

Since closed beta I has no problems with high ping or so on - im playing from Russia btw (and servers are in America as far as i know). My ping never was over 200 (with i-net connection speed up to 30mb/sec) and I never has "i cant hit 'em coz they are too fast" problem - they are lights, so they are fast but no so fast to avoid my fire, even when im using AC. Thats all. You cant hit? Learn to aim. High ping? Fix yours connection. Even with 250 its still well played for me.

its not about "learn to aim" nor is about "fix you connection"
if you paid attention here instead of trolling you would have known we ARE aiming and our connections ARE fine.. you obviously are not a person who is having this problem so go troll elsewhere.

if our connections work fine everywhere but here then there is a reason we are here and posting.. if this game is still in beta, we know that the big tag says so.. what do beta testers do? we report problems.. what are we doing? reporting a problem.. when they implement a patch and something changes that wasnt supposed to, how are they to know unless we say something? grow up dude.

[Havok1978]

Pando, on 29 June 2013 - 01:15 AM, said:

So,

I might sound like a *********....most times....but I HATE hitting battlemechs and not seeing my red reticule or targets paper-doll light up with serious damage.

I'm frequently breaking brand new headsets ($10 logitech ones) when i slam them down on my desk with hulk-strength because I missed someone...because of HSR..

I HATE finishing 1st with only 700 damage having 4 kills because I know well and good it should have been over 1,000 with 6-8 kills.

If people think PPC's are overpowered now. Imagine what they would be like if HSR was functioning at 100%.

I like when your angry, not cuz your cute when your angry, but just cuz I like it when your angry...
but as much as i dislike you and your PPC boating.. I agree with what you are saying...

[DanielZX]

Same problems with hit-detection. For example, yesterday I was playing 5LL stalker 5-M, in one match I have done 600+ dmg ( we won and I survived), and I was suprised when in next match ( we won too, and I survived also) I have done ONLY 89 dmg! How the f... is it possible to do 89 dmg during all match when my alpa is 45? I was shooting at point-blank distance at enemy catapult with no effect at all, and I got overheated 2 or 3 times when I was firing at her from 100 meters distance. My accuracy with LL is 81.79% and average ping is ~250-300. This is just simple example that hit-detection isn't working as it should. Proper working hit-detection is the MOST IMPORTANT thing in ANY player skill-based game. Fix this MOST IMPORTANT part of your game firstly and only then think about implementing faction warfare and other stuff.

[maguu2u]

Yep , game is basically unplayable now . Total waste of time . If PGI want more of my money they had better fix the game first .

PGI reminds me of the airline that flies me to work . They don't tell us our flight is delayed until an hour after boarding was supposed to occur . We know something is wrong but they act everything is fine and we are too stupid to work it out .

All my premium time burning up , what a bloody waste of my money .

[Sarsaparilla Kid]

I am in CA, and like others, my signal routes thru Palo Alto, then Chicago then Toronto, but using pingplotter.com, I'm still detecting as much as 10% packet loss by the time it hits some of the hubs/routers in Toronto right before the PGI server. Before the last patch, I was getting less than 100ms latency and had a rock-solid connection, and now I'm getting constant disconnects whenever I launch a match, usually within the first minute after the drop. PGI confirmed that my packet loss is contributing to my disconnects and suggested I talk to my ISP to re-route the path my signal takes to their server. Is that even possible? Right now, my short-term solution is to use CyberGhost to get a connection routed thru New York, which allows me to play a match without dropping, though sometimes I still get disconnected when I fiddle around too much in the mech lab (perhaps CyberGhost thinks I'm inactive and drops me). However, my latency using CyberGhost is hovering around 300ms, which makes hitting anything more difficult. Here's hoping they drop some servers stateside to cut out the latency and packet loss issues that some of us are still experiencing.

[FREDtheDEAD]

Zin, on 29 June 2013 - 06:47 AM, said:

Same problems with hit-detection. For example, yesterday I was playing 5LL stalker 5-M, in one match I have done 600+ dmg ( we won and I survived), and I was suprised when in next match ( we won too, and I survived also) I have done ONLY 89 dmg! How the f... is it possible to do 89 dmg during all match when my alpa is 45? I was shooting at point-blank distance at enemy catapult with no effect at all, and I got overheated 2 or 3 times when I was firing at her from 100 meters distance. My accuracy with LL is 81.79% and average ping is ~250-300. This is just simple example that hit-detection isn't working as it should. Proper working hit-detection is the MOST IMPORTANT thing in ANY player skill-based game. Fix this MOST IMPORTANT part of your game firstly and only then think about implementing faction warfare and other stuff.

Same here with a 5LL stalker. May try five small lasers to see if they work any better.

[Splitpin]

King Arthur IV, on 29 June 2013 - 05:23 AM, said:

but where is this post? i have to navigate a maze of a forum to find my answer. why are post like this not addresses in a official link? it is also dated nearly 2 weeks ago. you can spend hours looking through hundreds of post before you come across anything from the devs.

should i be playing or forum roaming? official statements should be made in a easily accessible area for all to ..... easily access. i want to get onto the forums find the answer to my questions and get back to something else. this would also avoid clutter from clone questions.

btw your link does not answer why latency is back up or why rubberbanding is back or they see it as a problem.

Sorry Arthur I spose I was a bit brief in that answer, but it was a link to the thread containing 2 posts by Karl on the subject both on Page1 of that thread. The post was before last MWO patch, I was following it because I too share the problems discussed. So ... a fix was supposed to be in the patch of the 18th June, but got left out (deep sigh) it was then hot fixed in a couple of days later, BUT as we all now know it didn't seem to fix anything. Some would claim it's even worse, given the growing number of threads re higher ping, rubber banding and widely fluctuating ping which symptom seems to be coincidental with the worst incidences of hits not registering. To me this is the most frustrating issue in the game at the moment, more so in that it seemed to follow a period where HSR worked beautifully. Since the hotfix I've not seen an official PGI comment on the issue other than Bryan's (?) comment in the most recent NGNG pod cast saying that HSR was now working well !!!! whereas it certainly isn't. I think we all should make a support request for help on the issue so at least numbers of complaints at that level start to mount, it may also then become at least a 'known issue'.

[lshtaria]

Crap hit detection also seems to be map specific too. River City is definitely the worst for me by a long way.

[Lagfest]

Bad connection or not, I have to deal with it for another 6 months.
It will force me to become a better pilot?
No, but I'll have to be better at keeping frustration in check.

Play casually until it gets better.
Or take a break.

[Nonsequitur]

I believe that the problem doesn't really lie within HSR itself but it's ability to compensate for ping jitter. When ping jitter is very high or the variance is beyond the system's tolerance levels, that's when the problem starts.

According to my traces done over the last couple of months, the problem seems to be occurring at the border routers between Global Crossing and Internap. These routers are just 1 hop from the PGI servers. Ping jitter for all of my hops to the servers have a maximum of 20% variance except for the above mentioned border routers. Ping jitter for them jump to more than 200% variance. About a week ago, I contacted both Global Crossing and Internap regarding this problem and although I did not get a response, it would seem they were working on this issue.

Last night, the border routers were giving me 10% packet loss then 30 minutes later, the packet loss disappeared. Now my continuous traces show the ping jitter at about 20% variance. After playing a few hours of MWO, I think the hit detection as well as my ping stability has improved.

This may just be a lull in the traffic, or a temporary fix, or something else entirely so take this with a grain of salt. I urge everyone who can do trace routes to send them in to MWO support since routes can differ wildly depending on your ISP. In the meantime, I will continue to monitor my connection closely.

Cheers!
Nonseq