24 replies to this topic

[Tor Gungnir]

I just got a buddy to start playing. He wants to play the Catapult, but he is not interested in missiles. The K-2 model looks the odd one with it's Ballistic/Energy hardpoints. How does it fare? Is it a good choice, or should he look for some other Heavy Mech?

[Ewigan]

Catapults are a bit squishy, because of it's easy to hit Center Torso (it's HUGE!) and is the easiest to headshot mech out there.

That said Catapults can do nearly ANYTHING that this game has to offer. they are called the "omnimechs" of the inner sphere in this game...

The K2... well you can do tons of build with it. Dual Gauss, Dual AC20, PPCs, etc...

I run mine with 4 Large Lasers and an XL300.
I like to melt faces with it

[Tor Gungnir]

Even easier than Hunchbacks?

[Ewigan]

actually i do not remember ever being headshooted in a hunchback....

but yeah, the cockpit (head) of the catapult is just a big box in the middle of his center torso.
lemme find the thread for ya

there you go: http://mwomercs.com/...x-localisation/

Edited by Ewigan, 01 July 2013 - 04:46 AM.

[Goldhawk]

I would almost say that the K2 variant is one of the most used variants in the MWO community. It can mount PPCs, heavy ballistics, PPCs and ballistics, big lasers and it has a tight firing profile that if you aim well, can focus your wrath on one particular section of the enemy and blast it off.

The bad news: Months ago they revamped the hit boxes on the Catapult and now sometimes when you aim for the CT, you core the cockpit. Just be careful where you poke your head out.

[Modo44]

Tor Gungnir, on 01 July 2013 - 04:44 AM, said:

Even easier than Hunchbacks?

No, but more powerful. They can do dual PPC, dual AC (up to 20), dual Gauss, quadruple energy weapons -- sometimes at the same time -- with good heat and protection. There are like 10 very extremely good K2 builds, with more silly OK ones. The other Cats do other stuff, though, so to master one, you'll be running 3 very different mechs.

Edited by Modo44, 01 July 2013 - 04:55 AM.

[Tor Gungnir]

If this video is indeed correct (and I feel that it is when playing) the Hunchie cockpit area is HUUUUUGE.



EDIT: Hunchie at the 9 minute mark of the video.

Edited by Tor Gungnir, 01 July 2013 - 04:56 AM.

[Ewigan]

I found you the link man, just look at it.
Hunchie cockpit may be big, but the Cat is worse

http://mwomercs.com/...x-localisation/

[scJazz]

The Catapult K2 is a nice mech with the large CT and Head hitboxes as mentioned. If your friend isn't interested in Missiles then the Catapult line is not for him. He is better off in a Jagermech. They can be configured much like the K2. The advantage for your friend comes from the fact that only 1 of the Jagers is a "Missile" boat. Whereas only 1 of the Catapults is not. He will find getting Elite in Jagers much simpler because of this fact.

[Tor Gungnir]

All in all, 'tis good to be in an Atlas.

I got 99 problems but cockpit shots aint one!

How is the Stalker in comparison to the K2? Looks like the same Mech...sorta, only heavier.

[I C Wiener]

Tor Gungnir, on 01 July 2013 - 04:22 AM, said:

I just got a buddy to start playing. He wants to play the Catapult, but he is not interested in missiles.

The K2 is a very good chassis for beginners though you stated your friend's not too interested in missiles. I see a problem here: The other variants of the Catapult are highly missile dependent so he might have a problem when trying to max them not using any missiles at all. You can run some more energy focussed builds with them but I doubt that they will be that usefull compared to other chassis like the Jaegermech for example which has the same tonnage but relies much more on ballistic weapons rather than missiles.

Edit: If he in fact wants to use the K2 despite of the issue posted above I'd suggest the build I am running currently with the K2: I use dual AC/10 and 4 medium lasers, double heat sinks, endo steel and a 280 XL engine, armor is maxed except legs. I would'nt suggest the 4 large laser build because it is something that can more effectivly be done with other chassis imo (the Atlas RS for example).

Another thing to keep in mind is that ballistic weapons are, in my opinion the toughest weapons to master in this game, they are in no way worse compared to the other weapon types, just a bit more difficult to use properly.

Tor Gungnir, on 01 July 2013 - 05:04 AM, said:

How is the Stalker in comparison to the K2? Looks like the same Mech...sorta, only heavier.

One of the big advantages of the Catapult compared to every other mech of this size is the fact that it has very small hitboxes for the left and right torso while still being pretty fast giving it the ability to use an xl engine without being too vulnerable. The Stalker however is bigger and therefore slower. Not many Stalker pilots use an XL for that reason. It's still a very powerfull mech especially with PPC's at the moment though that is a play style not everyone enjoys i'd say.

Edited by I C Wiener, 01 July 2013 - 06:11 AM.

[Tor Gungnir]

Knowing my friend, he will probably enjoy PPCs... the ******.

I'm a Shotgun person, he is a Sniper person.

The original odd couple.

[Arctu]

Having played both a lot I'd recommend the Stalker. Its easier to play, less frustrating and you should get higher scores. A Catapult dies extremely easy.

One thing that might speak against the Stalker as a first mech is that, in my opinion, new players should not start in an assault mech. When you don't know the maps and the game mechanics its better to have a faster mech so you can catch up with the team from time to time and don't "waste" 85 tons of weight for your team. Perhaps your friend should chose the Jagermech. They are very good mechs and there's a reason you see at least 4 of them in every game at the moment ...

[Edustaja]

You can comfortably do either 4 ppc or 2 erppc + gauss. Slightly different heat and range profiles, but both work out well.

[Tor Gungnir]

If I were to recommend him the Stalker, which chassi/variant should I pick?

[Dalziel Hasek Davion]

Tor Gungnir, on 01 July 2013 - 04:22 AM, said:

I just got a buddy to start playing. He wants to play the Catapult, but he is not interested in missiles.

The Catapults (A1, C1, C4) are predominantly missile 'Mechs. Seeing as you need to level three variants to get the most out of the skill tree, then I'm finding it hard to reconcile his desire to pilot a Catapult with his lack of love for missile (all missiles or just LRMs?)

The K2 is a very capable 'Mech and, as noted by others, there are some strong builds for it. It is the only 'Mech that, by design really satisfies your friends criteria (Catapult, Heavy 'Mech, no missiles). If your friend is willing to negotiate on the chassis, then the Cataphract, Jagermech are both excellent heavy Ballistic/Energy platforms.

The Stalker is a fine assault chassis - but only has energy or missile slots - no ballistic variants at all (unless you count the Misery hero 'Mech which has a single ballistic slot). You can play all-energy builds with the STK and many do. I like 4xLL, but I understand that many "hot jockeys" favour the nxPPC builds. The Stalker is a slower, less agile, more potent chassis with similar builds to Catapults. I started with the 3F variant, which has the greatest torso twist. The 3H is a missile variant, the 4N has not much to recommend it - fewer hard points than the 3F and lower twist range, the 5M has an interesting energy hardpoint in the CT and so can zombie somewhat - the 5S has dual AMS. I would start with the 3F.

Edited by Dalziel Hasek Davion, 01 July 2013 - 06:39 AM.

[Benyamin]

I run my K2 with this setup:

4 ERPPC
XL280 Engine
Endo Steel
Total of 17 Dual Heat Sinks
400 Armor (if I remember correctly, I'm not logged in right now)

The thing was originally intended as a joke, but it actually has proven to be a beast time and time again on the battlefield. Heat is your biggest issue with this setup, but with a little practice, you can be a valuable asset to your team.

The other downside is that in order to master this mech, he's going to have to play with two of the other variants, all three of which are missile based. The C1 isn't too bad, as it has 4 energy slots, so you can still add 2 ppcs for sniping, but the C4 and the A1 are more or less missile boats.

[Edustaja]

For more traditional sniper cloak and dagger gameplay I'd recommend the spider or the cicada with ERPPC's. Stalker or highlander are more like face the enemy and hump the hill. Lighter mechs are more fire and scoot types. K2, Cataphract 3D, hunchback 4P, and Trebuches are something in between those extremes.

Edited by Edustaja, 01 July 2013 - 06:49 AM.

[Yelland]

Tor Gungnir, on 01 July 2013 - 05:04 AM, said:

All in all, 'tis good to be in an Atlas.

I got 99 problems but cockpit shots aint one!

How is the Stalker in comparison to the K2? Looks like the same Mech...sorta, only heavier.

Unless you are an Inner Sphere space hamster! "Go the eyes boo, the eyes!"

I think a K2 is a great starter Mech, very accessible. It was the first one I purchased from my 25 match starter funds. However, as others pointed out, if they are not interested in missiles and want to "elite" a set, Hunch or Phract may be better. In point I only have the K2 since I am terrible with LRMs.

I haven't been cockpit sploded in a K2 that many times to think of it as a greater threat than any other death blow. Cockpit shots are going to happen - so are ammo explosions, XL Torso damage, AC/40s to the heart, hot LRM showers, and any number of other things.

Stalker is going to trade mobility for more bang and armor.

Only the Hero Misery has a ballistic so you are mostly playing with energy or missile. I like to run Stalker with 2 LL, 2 ERPPC and 2 SSRM. Good punch, heat, armor and Light threat management. Can get in trouble if I get caught at close quarters with someone circling me. Unless I get to a wall/bldg or walk them into teammates.

[Arctu]

Tor Gungnir, on 01 July 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

If I were to recommend him the Stalker, which chassi/variant should I pick?

The Stalker 3F has the biggest torso twist range (think its 85° instead of 60°) which gives you an advantage in brawling and defending vs lights/mediums. The 3H has the biggest missile tubes, so use this one for LRMs. The 5S has two anti missile systems which is a great benefit for sniping as well. The 4N is just plain bad and the 5M is probably the cheapest Stalker since it already has double heatsinks equipped and it has a nice center torso laser to keep you going when both side torsos are gone..