359 replies to this topic

[Stile3081]

Makes it somewhat hard when you can't even climb a 45 degree pebble 2 foot high, stops an atlas

[FREDtheDEAD]

Perhaps tiny rocks should trip up a 100 ton mech rather than stop it dead. Much more physically realistic. Yeah, that would make the game a whole lot better! Funnier to watch, anyway.

Edited by Xajorkith, 07 July 2013 - 07:57 PM.

[Vincent Quatermain]

Exactly what problem was this exercise in pain intended to fix?

Was it the sniper meta?

If so, congratulations, you've now made it WORSE.

The counter to snipers was to rush in and force a close range brawl. To do so requires maneuverability.

Guess what this movement change does? IT KILLS MANEUVERABILITY.

Now those sniper teams can guess the one (maybe two) directions that you will come from and set up a firing line. Brawling is nerfed, so it's all sniper, all the time.

THIS IS WHY YOU NEED A PUBLIC TEST SERVER.

Some of your screwball ideas might actually be good for the game. Some of them are just bad. Put these ideas on a test server so we can weed out the bad ideas and keep the good ones.

P.S. The slope system is one of your bad ideas. Hotfix it out of the game IMMEDIATELY.

[Sir Wulfrick]

I'll echo many others and say that the concept is an excellent idea, however the current parameters are wildly wrong as they are now. Some notes on the current implementation:

Good points:

Mech movement slowing on vertical inclines gives the mechs a more apparently realistic feel which I think is great. I also like the fact that we no longer have mechs scaling 85 degree inclines with impunity. This has added greatly to the level of tactical thought that's necessary while playing. All good.


Bad points:

• I'd suggest that the movement impedance should start to effect movement speed at perhaps 30 or even 35 degrees vertical incline. The maximum climbable incline should be somewhere between 55 and 65 degrees.

• I'd say that the side slope traversing parameters are probably more or less OK – though mechs are designed to have greater mobility than traditional tracked vehicles they do have a much higher centre of gravity.

• Momentum reduction needs to be smoothed out when encountering inclines. The current ∆ V is far too high.

• Rather a lot of smoothing needs to be done on the terrain meshes. Not being able to surmount small fences in my 100 tonne AS7-DF is somewhat unbelievable.

Chassis specifics:

I can't comment on other chassis as I never pilot them, but for the Atlas the current parameters are a disaster. Being unable to climb even moderate inclines coupled with the low-slung arm weapons mounts and slow comparative speed means significantly more time exposed to enemy fire. This combined with the center-torso-is-a-missile-magnet effect and the current emphasis on high-alpha builds makes fighting the AS7 with the current movement parameters a frequently painful and often short experience.

The model and concept are very good, but the current numbers are rather unforgiving.

[trebormills]

Great Idea- bad current system

Jump Jets are really useful now- good
Slow mechs are slow- good
different mechs have different nerf- good
all mechs are nerfed- bad
random full stops- bad
glitchy snagging- bad
hard to see what is 45 degree or not- bad
pebbles with super glue on them- bad

I recommend doing a map pass to remove snagging, I also recommend changing the angle to something much higher and based on the size of the obstacle- ie a pebble is no concern but a cliff face is

Finally doing slow down by class with a maximum nerf to speed as a percentage
Lights- 30%
Mediums- 20%
Heavy- 15%
Fast Assualt- ie Awesome 10%
Assualt- 5%
legged ??

ie at xx degrees a light cannot go faster than 30% of its top speed, if legged maybe by class of 40kph- ie a light will go 30% of 40kph

Anyway some ideas

Edited by trebormills, 08 July 2013 - 04:02 AM.

[JugglerMWO]

For me movement physics are a must have feature, so i think this is going in the right direction. But at the current state it feels, like the speed decrease comes into effect much too late. I think it should start at maybe 5°. Alternatively if you stick with 20° (right now it doesnt even feel as if decrease starts at 20°, more like 30°) the engine heat output should rise in an amount that does affect gameplay. The 45° max limit could be raised a bit and abrupt stops shouldnt happen or else topple the mech. Walking down a hill should give an increase in acceleration.

Water physics are a must have too and should be implemented at high priority !!

I paused playing the Game mostly because lack of movement physics.

[Oznog]

The new movement rules BREAK Jump Jets, and the only fix is gonna be directional JJ.

See the problem is, I may jet 90% up a slope and run out of jet. Fine, JJ isn't infinite flight. But if I can't walk up it, I can't JET up it, and that's just a silly restriction. I mean the top may start to level off in 10 ft. I can jet 50ft straight up and come straight back down, but you can NEVER progress up the slope if you can't walk up it. Which is kinda contrary to what JJ are meant to do.

That doesn't even make sense... I can JJ way over the top of the hill, but I can't go UP the hill because it's steep? Just LEAN FORWARD here!! Anything.... the top is right there!!

You also have a strange effect where your ability to jet is radically different if you started BEFORE the slope, so you've still got full speed. If you're already started ON a slope, the jet only continues your initial climbing speed.

While I'm at it, directional JJ will fix another broken thing. See if I jet, then hit a short building and slide up the building, once I'm past the edge of the building I suddenly get all my forward momentum back- from *where??* I can see that was necessary because otherwise it would be exceptionally difficult to mount objects, any contact would fix you on a useless pure-vertical trajectory that would never get you onto the roof.

With directional JJ, that glitch would no longer be necessary. You wouldn't have to store the velocity upon contact with objects and inexplicably restore it later.

Edited by Oznog, 08 July 2013 - 02:11 PM.

[Dreager96]

game sucks now, please fix this!

[MADTIGERSr]

Yes it needs to be put back the way it was and then try maybe 1-10 % of the change.

[Burpitup]

I don't have a problem with slowing down some mechs up hills. Slowing down that is. Coming to a full stop is way to much of a nerf. I have found my heavy mechs can't climb at all anymore. Feels like they can' t make battle robots correctly in the future. I have driven my Jeep up hills steeper than my mech can climb. Sounds like this future sucks.

[Star Lancer]

Well.. that's it for me until this bullfuckinshit is fixed. I can no longer compensate for the everloving ******** dribble that the devs keep trying to pass on to us. Until the speed effect is fixed or removed, you've lost yet another player. Good job.

[Mousake]

This is awfull.. I have same feedback then others. Stalker or Atlas cannot be used anymore. They can't climb anything so playing experience is hugely diminished. I don't mind them beeing slow.. not at all. I do mind that I can't play.

[Major]

Personally I think it's pretty great, but needs polish.

The good:

• Greater emphasis on level layout required, creates things like traps and killzones.
  
• Slow mechs have to be more deliberate now.
  
• With good map design will lead to interesting tactical decisions and minimise the "Everyone head to center map and blast the enemy lines" thing.
  
• Will require more co-ordination on part of lances in order to be effective.
  
• All of the above will combine to make scouting more beneficial to the team and make LRMs more valuable (both weren't used as much as I think they should have been earlier)

The bad:

• Levels need a once over to make movement smoother and the areas a mech can and cannot move more apparent
  
• Momentum needs to be taken into account more to prevent the "whiplash" feeling you get when you suddenly stop moving
  
• Jump Jets needs work under this new system. A way of getting forward momentum while trying to go up and forward is necessary. Also disabling this system while jump jets are on might be a good idea as I have occasionally lost forward momentum when my feet touched the "ground" as I was JJ-ing, causing me to have to land and retry my ascent.

My ideas/thoughts/humble suggestions/ramblings:

• Perhaps make the cut out angle higher than 45 degrees but redesign the maps so that some of what is currently 45 degrees is steeper.
  
• Actually redesign the maps anyway to take into account these new movement rules in a way that maximises their potential to be interesting.
  
• Listen to the people complaining. As much as I disagree with them that this system should be ripped out they are right that it currently is less intuitive than it should be, doesn't play nice on all the maps, and needs polish so that it feels right, and that currently getting stopped by a small rock that exists only for aesthetics is terrible.

Now this is in place really place an emphasis on information warfare and scout/command mechs. This is one of the most effective ways to make he movement system more than a mild deterrent to the "Sniper Culture". Consider doing the following:

• Release a "Command" chasis or two that don't need to buy air strikes/artillery barrages/what have you before every damn match they want to use them; having to do so is why I have still NEVER seen any of them used in a match - they just aren't worth the trouble.
  
• Put in a pre-game lobby so people can make balanced teams in regards to mech configuration.
  
• Consider locking down certain modules to certain mech types. Or making them cheaper for certain mech types.
  
• Change the way spotting bonuses work so that it is both worth more and so that scouts don't get their credit stolen by brawlers who happen to be closer.
  
• Perhaps create a module, piece of equipment, or just make it standard that would allow players to know if someone else is targeting their target so that a scout/spotter can be more effective.

[Znail]

The main problem is that the game doesn't have a real physics engine for movement, so you stop right away when you get to a 45 degree incline, even if it's ancle high for the mech and it should logically be able to just take one more step and keep going. If you kept momomentum instead, like true physics, then you would just slow down some when there is a very small 45 degree slope and keep going. This should be doable with some programming, even without making a true physics engine for the movement. This current version of slope handling is not working anyway, that is for sure.

[Corvus Antaka]

I still love the mechanic. everyday it's more fun. It only gives assaults and some hvys troubles, esp slow mechs suffer, and it is a brilliant way to encourage more team mobility. Assault teams can get trapped on conquest simply with bad maneuvering. pebbles is a problem, hopefully adjusted soon. overall the more i play the more i like it.

[Oy of MidWorld]

Now you actually have to pilot. No wonder some folks are pissed about it. It's way better than before. Needs a little tweaking with small rocks. Otherwise perfect. The effect could be even more noticeable in small to medium mechs.

[Sweet Baby Pirate]

It feels pretty good in the game, but I'm not sure about the five size groups which all 'mechs have been shoehorned into. It would be better if the slowdown angle for a given build is calculated based on the mass, engine power, and type of legs (man / chicken).

[Clit Beastwood]

I don't know about you all, but I've found my spider is getting stuck *everywhere* - as in, stuck on rocks that dont even come up to my shin. I've attached a video demonstration - while running across our base and jump jetting, one of my spider friends got stuck on, apparently, nothing. This is happening everywhere, and as a result, one evening of play has almost turned me totally off of this game. I get stuck even while running across mostly open terrain.

Edited by Fierostetz, 10 July 2013 - 07:57 AM.

[Meridian]

Stile3081, on 07 July 2013 - 07:48 PM, said:

Makes it somewhat hard when you can't even climb a 45 degree pebble 2 foot high, stops an atlas

Even less fun if you're going down a steep slope and catch something. Now you're stuck between it and the slope. You can't get over the obstacle and you can't go up the slope even a tiny bit to get around the obstacle.

Congratulations, you're now a turret.

[JigglyMoobs]

I have to agree that this new terrain feature is not fun. It's unintuitive.

Also, what's the point of having two big vulnerable legs if you can't climb rocks and terrain? A m1 tank in the US army is capable of climbing a 60 degree gradient. There's got to be a reason for having legs, other than looking cool.

http://www.military-...m1a2_abrams.htm