359 replies to this topic

[FREDtheDEAD]

It would help if the concept were simulating physics instead of throwing around a few simple rules. Nowhere is momentum taken into consideration. It just feels wrong. Good idea but work on the math.

[Sestos]

Its a good idea on paper but needs a re-work before its put out live. Right now I feel like I am moving backwards and forwards, side to side to try to climb over a rock... the game took a step back to something I played in the 90's but with better graphics.

Edited by Sestos, 11 July 2013 - 02:47 AM.

[Mokou]

Mech need "stairs" system, and big mech with big legs will not stop on the little cobble. He just step over them.

PS: DEV's, will u add water/deepsnow etc "Movement Archetypes"?

[Alwrathandabout42ninjas]

Need to work on this system alot. Constantly getting stuck mid combat and as a close range brawler it is infuriating. I have lost many combats to this new mechanic and I am getting stuck on little areas of the terrain I should not get stuck on. This is not acceptable and has proven to be detrimental to players enjoyment of the game. You really need to hotfix this out of the game as soon as you can and fix it.

[Enileph]

The archetypes are a great idea, and I actually LOVE IT.

HOWEVER, current maps need to be fixed to make them inline with the changes.
Small rocks and bumps are a major problem. A tine rock not even noticable in your mach can stop it dead in the middle of the road, even if you are in a giant atlas!
The big hillside paths should be more noticable. Maybe a more obvious skin around the area? I know, we eventually would get used to the paths, but this would be hel for non-regulars, and new players. The snow paths aren't as obviously accessable as one might think, and I am saying this while running around in a cicada and a commando. Sometimes I cannot go up some of the snow paths in alpine, not even by wiggling.

It would be nice to delete the small rocks, crater edges, small rackage, tiny walls and things from the bump map. Small rocksand things look good and I love them, but don't make them affact the game. I mean, unless you have serious walking problems you would be able to walk over a paper cup without and speed loss, right? Right now you would get STOPPED DEAD IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD by a paper cup.

Please don't make MWO a driving test where we spend more time avoiding bumps on the road than smashing our enemies!

[Riddler9884]

I agree, I like the direction the game took with this new feature but...

I noticed a few things like above user stated some of the decorations are becoming obstacles restricting movement.
I figure either another pass on the maps taking into account the new movement changes or the actual movement rules should be tweaked.

Do they take into consideration momentum of the Mech?
(I really couldn't tell) If it does maybe you can make the loss of speed a little more gradual for Mechs going at full speed?

Does going downhill increase your speed at the same rate it decreases it going uphill?

Edited by Riddler9884, 12 July 2013 - 07:03 AM.

[GoPostal]

OMG! sloping system? first u guys make LRM's way more powerfull, faster, and more precise...Then u take away from almost every mech the mobility to move, go up simple hills and even walk threw rocks. This is a simple LRM paradise where u sit on your *** and make the others do the job for u. This is getting so old and so annoying, I really hope u guys see the amount of unsubscribes this new **** patch did. This will make this game that isn't even out a total flop. Idk what people were whining about, with my assault mech I was never able to go up the same hill as the other lights or medium. But now, even in medium mech I get stuck trying to go up hill and my only way out of this bug is to reverse the way I came in or I get shot to death by LRM (again) because thats all there is left for assault mechs. And haters, u can reply too, I feed on your replies and it makes me laugh because the amount of fu#$ I give is lower then your IQ.

[Dawnstealer]

Now that I've adjusted, sloped movement is great. I'd like a little more consideration for momentum, and it would be nice if ankle-height rocks and fences could be ignored, but all in all: good patch.

[reign]

Here is a wrinkle, How about if the mech has hand actuator it can "climb" up steeper sloaps (just some TT) I know it makes the whole thing more complicated, sorry about that.

[Helsbane]

I tossed together a little thread concerning battlemech mobility as a humanoid frame as opposed to a brick on tracks.

http://mwomercs.com/...emech-mobility/

It basically highlights the point of battlemechs replacing conventional vehicles because of their improved battlefield performance / agility / range of motion.

[Big Bad Werewolf]

Late to the party on this one but i have to agree with most people last time I played was early beta before my computer exploded and the hill climbing was totally silly walking up almost vertical slopes now I slam into the slightest incline and my entire mech halts. Especially problematic on bumpy hills where I am walking just fine then snag some tiny angle and get completely stuck and need to flail around wildly until I get unstuck enough to walk down the hill to start again. The small objects like statues, short concrete walls and vehicles really need to be destructible if it's going to stay like this since I find myself having to walk around what is probably a six foot high wall all the time because I can't go over it with my hundred foot long legs.

[Xenok]

Having dealt with this much more I have this thought. The concept is good, the implementation sucks right now.

Suggest the following.

1. Have pilot skills that can be developed to greatly improve the ability to climb. Chassis specific would be cool.
2. Actuators in the legs actually makes a significant difference in the ability to climb.
3. Account for momentum, perhaps simply with a delay on the effects of slope on speed which adjusts by tenths of seconds by a combination of tonnage and speed. The delayed effect should only kick in if the mech is still climbing, once the delay time has passed. It does not seem to take momentum/inertia into account today if it does it needs to be altered.
4. Make every chassis have a climbing stat for its maximum degree it can climb. Chassis specific, even variant specific would be a cool way to do this.
5. If going up makes you slow, going down should make you fast, but it should also have the chance to cause some damage should you go to fast downward. I do not think it works to have the upward movement speed penalty without a downward movement speed bonus.
6. The max degree of a climbable surface should be more like 60 degrees not 45 degrees. Mechs have legs not wheels, please do not treat them like they have wheels; increase the maximum degree of climb significantly.
7. There needs to be something that prevents every little ridge from stopping your movement. Its far to sensitive now. The delayed effect would likely do this, but if it does not another option would have to be used.

As the system is right now, you would be better to hot fix it out. Its not creating a great player experience. I do not know a person who likes the implementation, but I also know very few who do not like the idea behind it. Its a good concept, just needs to be redesigned.

[Nryrony]

There seems to be a "bug" when trying to climb a too high wall. If you try to run up you can get "stuck", meaning you can't move forward _and_ you can't turn. If you slow down you can turn again.

This is deadly, especialy for a light, because your basicly stuck for at least 5 seconds.

[Col Jaime Wolf]

i like the idea of this mechanic in theory. the implementation does need some tweaking.

1. chicken walker mechs should be treated differently than man-walkers, and double hinge mechs like the cicada should be in a league of their own as well. example the cicada should not be hindered hardly at all by steep terrain, its legs were built to climb. chicken walkers should be less effective then something like the cicada but more effective than man-walkers.

2. man-walkers should maintain better weapons stability/convergence when walking and falling, this is inherent to their design. chicken walker legs should take less damage from falling.

3. chicken walkers and double hinge mechs should top out a little faster on flat terrain over man-walkers, but also they are much more supseptable to knee shots (for knockdown), while a man-walkers knees are heavily armored.


just my thoughts, hope it helps PGI

[Col Jaime Wolf]

Xenok, on 13 July 2013 - 04:54 AM, said:

Having dealt with this much more I have this thought. The concept is good, the implementation sucks right now.

Suggest the following.

1. Have pilot skills that can be developed to greatly improve the ability to climb. Chassis specific would be cool. <- idk i don't think its actually a good idea, the nubs would be at a loss to whole teams of mechs that can cross mountains they cannot.

2. Actuators in the legs actually makes a significant difference in the ability to climb. <- leg and ankle/foot design is more important and should be considered, perhaps the cicada and chicken walkers should be better climber mechs?

3. Account for momentum, perhaps simply with a delay on the effects of slope on speed which adjusts by tenths of seconds by a combination of tonnage and speed. The delayed effect should only kick in if the mech is still climbing, once the delay time has passed. It does not seem to take momentum/inertia into account today if it does it needs to be altered. <- yes yes yes and yes i hate the slope climbing logic because it doesn't consider that im flying iinto a slope at 150kph. small mechs should still fly up hills, larger mechs shouldn't just stop but slow to a crawl.

4. Make every chassis have a climbing stat for its maximum degree it can climb. Chassis specific, even variant specific would be a cool way to do this. <- yes this is a very good idea, i think leg design and size/engine should have a large impact on climbing performance as well.

5. If going up makes you slow, going down should make you fast, but it should also have the chance to cause some damage should you go to fast downward. I do not think it works to have the upward movement speed penalty without a downward movement speed bonus. <- i just wish i didn't slip on all those icy ledges so easily to my doom, mechs are built with some level of built in safeguards.

6. The max degree of a climbable surface should be more like 60 degrees not 45 degrees. Mechs have legs not wheels, please do not treat them like they have wheels; increase the maximum degree of climb significantly. <- yes 45 degrees is simply far to little, personally i think even more then 60 would be fine for smaller mechs. i have owned rusted out trucks that could off-road better then any of the mechs in this game.

7. There needs to be something that prevents every little ridge from stopping your movement. Its far to sensitive now. The delayed effect would likely do this, but if it does not another option would have to be used. <- yes yes yes, and yes. this is the single most annoying thing in this game, mechs should just kick that #%$%# out of the way, gouge the side of that silly cliff. especially the atlas and other large slow mechs that get caught on everything. really atlas's should not be forced into walking straight through the middle of any pass/ravine just because its the only path that wont get them clipped on a ridge or that silly steel pebble. big mechs are already targets the size of barn doors, and they are slow, no amount of armor and firepower can help that situation. to force them into predictable paths is bad. well good for me and some others cuz im looking for those huge targets.

As the system is right now, you would be better to hot fix it out. Its not creating a great player experience. I do not know a person who likes the implementation, but I also know very few who do not like the idea behind it. Its a good concept, just needs to be redesigned. <- agreed

Edited by Mellifluer, 14 July 2013 - 07:50 AM.

[Col Jaime Wolf]

Burpitup, on 08 July 2013 - 03:32 PM, said:

I don't have a problem with slowing down some mechs up hills. Slowing down that is. Coming to a full stop is way to much of a nerf. I have found my heavy mechs can't climb at all anymore. Feels like they can' t make battle robots correctly in the future. I have driven my Jeep up hills steeper than my mech can climb. Sounds like this future sucks.

"driven my Jeep up hills steeper than my mech can climb" exactly how i feel.

[Helsbane]

PGI needs to sit down and watch a few videos of an Abrams tank undergoing mobility trials, then realize that 'mechs replaced tanks because they had better mobility.

[Thermidor]

Helsbane, on 14 July 2013 - 08:48 AM, said:

PGI needs to sit down and watch a few videos of an Abrams tank undergoing mobility trials, then realize that 'mechs replaced tanks because they had better mobility.

That would imply devs giving a flying fk about the quality of their work and not lining their pockets with money

[GenericPilotName]

This is the first thing I've made a comment on in the forums, but it's a big enough deal I can't ignore it. First few matches I liked the concept and didn't mind the execution. Why not slow down when going up a hill...makes sense physically. And I get putting a restriction on how steep one can climb too. However now, having played many more games, I can say this is one of the more infuriating updates. I can't count the number of times I've backed up into a building or obstacle only to find that I could not turn and had to first reverse direction and move back where I'd come from before being able to "disengage" from whatever I'd made contact with. Or other times I've peeked from behind an obstacle to fire a few shots to find I could not reverse back over the small rock I'd previously traversed to clear cover, and wham...sitting duck. Kinda ruins it for me. Plus, you definitely limit the areas that can be traversed without jumpjets, and while that is again realistic, I think the 45 degree limit is too restricting, or that certain maps with many canyons or giant mountain slopes could use a slight tweaking to not severely limit the avenues of approach. Like many I'm a fan of the ideas, but I'm seriously wondering if you should revert and sit this one out until you put a little more thought into it; the execution needs a lot of work.

[TekGnosis]

I'm going to assume that all the weirdness with meshes triggering this will eventually be sorted. I'll take my ignominious deaths to those bugs in stride.

The one structure that is VERY broken however relates to jumpjets. I've died countless times now because of landing on a 46o+ slope and being reduced to 0 speed with no way to gain momentum for a jump away. So i'll be moving 90kph, touch the ground on a slope (usually 90% the way up the hill), and lose all momentum only to jump straight vertical as my enemies 'lol' and core away.

Please, we need some small percent of forward momentum while mashing WWWWWW and J at the same time.... Kinda a good clue the user wants to Jump Forward. Just maybe?