83 replies to this topic

[ShadowbaneX]

First, yeah, 7 tons is usually sufficient for two ultras*. I've only run out once or twice and that's when I was being inefficient with ammo.

Second, XLs don't work very well in a Victor. I played 29 matches in mine and died 22 times. Twice I died from losing my CT, once from losing a leg and having my ammo go up, the other 18 times was from losing a side torso with an XL engine. Stick to standard, even if it means slowing down.

[Kevin Harxen]

I've tested a new build out and this one has great success so far.

HMI - ESM 5 v7

ShadowbaneX, on 20 July 2013 - 07:09 PM, said:

First, yeah, 7 tons is usually sufficient for two ultras*. I've only run out once or twice and that's when I was being inefficient with ammo.

Second, XLs don't work very well in a Victor. I played 29 matches in mine and died 22 times. Twice I died from losing my CT, once from losing a leg and having my ammo go up, the other 18 times was from losing a side torso with an XL engine. Stick to standard, even if it means slowing down.

I think of assaults as damage soakers. So using an entire side torso to eat shots is very useful and worth losing to save the CT.

Edited by Kevin Harxen, 20 July 2013 - 11:32 PM.

[Hebdomas]

ShadowbaneX, on 20 July 2013 - 07:09 PM, said:

Second, XLs don't work very well in a Victor. I played 29 matches in mine and died 22 times. Twice I died from losing my CT, once from losing a leg and having my ammo go up, the other 18 times was from losing a side torso with an XL engine. Stick to standard, even if it means slowing down.

38 matches and 29 deaths. I don't remember the exact number, but it seems like I always die from losing my CT. Side torso deaths are probably three to five. Maybe it's an Elo bracket thing, people in your bracket like to blow off side torsos and everyone in mine goes for the CT.

[AllOuttaBubbleGum]

ShadowbaneX, on 20 July 2013 - 07:09 PM, said:

First, yeah, 7 tons is usually sufficient for two ultras*. I've only run out once or twice and that's when I was being inefficient with ammo.

Second, XLs don't work very well in a Victor. I played 29 matches in mine and died 22 times. Twice I died from losing my CT, once from losing a leg and having my ammo go up, the other 18 times was from losing a side torso with an XL engine. Stick to standard, even if it means slowing down.

Most of my deaths have been ct...an occasional side torso here and there. And in most cases my CT was about to go anyway. after playing 66 matches i would not shelve the XL.

[Sh4dow78]

If u are not using XL on Victor there is really no reason to take it into battle anyway bcoz with standard engine ur speed is close to Highlander/Atlas and they are more durable than Victor. As u know speed is life in this game so use that XL and take ADVANTAGE of this fast and agile assault class mech with JJ or just play atlas/highlander

[Skydrive]

Scarface1978, on 22 July 2013 - 11:54 AM, said:

If u are not using XL on Victor there is really no reason to take it into battle anyway bcoz with standard engine ur speed is close to Highlander/Atlas and they are more durable than Victor. As u know speed is life in this game so use that XL and take ADVANTAGE of this fast and agile assault class mech with JJ or just play atlas/highlander

I thought that the whole speed is life in this game thing played more into the lights, and any of the mediums that run about as fast as a light.... Bit hard to make an entire volley of LRM's miss your Dragon Slayer when moving at 89.1. Anyways, I agree that it should be faster then a Highlander, but just... saying speed is life when refering to an Assault mech that doesn't even come close to 150 just sounds like the guy who was left behind to be killed by the wild animal so the faster guys would live.

[Master Q]

Honestly, here's what I've found to work with so far:

Dragon Slayer - Gauss/PPC in one part, dual ERPPC in the other. Yes, cheesy. Annoying as a sniper. Have to be careful about short range on the one PPC but it keeps heat slightly down.

9B - 3x Machine Gun, 2x ERPPC, 2x SRM4

9S - AC20, 3x SRM6, 2x MLAS

Honestly I think the biggest issue for the Victors is that their loadouts are so similar. 90% of the "workable builds" really don't care how many hardpoints you have in each section, they can be loaded equally onto at least 2 of the 4 chassis verbatim and with only one weapon different to the others.

[Selfish]

Skydrive, on 23 July 2013 - 10:12 AM, said:

I thought that the whole speed is life in this game thing played more into the lights, and any of the mediums that run about as fast as a light.... Bit hard to make an entire volley of LRM's miss your Dragon Slayer when moving at 89.1. Anyways, I agree that it should be faster then a Highlander, but just... saying speed is life when refering to an Assault mech that doesn't even come close to 150 just sounds like the guy who was left behind to be killed by the wild animal so the faster guys would live.

It's a combination of the speed and the upgraded stats you get with an engine increase that allow for more survivability no matter the mechs involved. A STD 350 Atlas is far more survivable than a STD 300 simply because it can twist/turn faster. If you're having LRM troubles on the VTR you can pull some into your arms and legs. Hit the JJs a bit before impact and lift your arms up/across your chest while turning slightly away.

[mack sabbath]

Please give me a version of my current mech (gauss won't register hits) withOUT a gauss rifle that won't suck or melt.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...67c29e845f97c12


Much Obliged,

Primate


This comes to mind.

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...f4c551742d8bee4

Edited by Die Primate Die, 23 July 2013 - 01:42 PM.

[TexAce]

anyone tried this one yet? VTR-9B

I like constant fire and hate PPCs so I might try this out as soon as I got some money left.

[Eisenhorne]

TexAss, on 23 July 2013 - 02:20 PM, said:

anyone tried this one yet? VTR-9B

I like constant fire and hate PPCs so I might try this out as soon as I got some money left.

I'd swap the AC/2's for an AC/20, and upgrade the rest of the weapon systems with the extra weight.

VTR-9B

I know you like constant fire, but that is not what the victor is good at. I've found the victor is best at sitting on top of hills or behind cover, waiting for the enemy to string out and leave a target or two vulnerable in the back, or to jump in behind a battle once your brawlers engage. In either of these cases, you want to front-load your damage as much as humanly possible, so you can unleash a barrage and retreat back up over a hill away from pursuers before they can properly respond to you.

[Itsalrightwithme]

Eisenhorne, on 24 July 2013 - 05:21 AM, said:

I'd swap the AC/2's for an AC/20, and upgrade the rest of the weapon systems with the extra weight.

VTR-9B

I know you like constant fire, but that is not what the victor is good at. I've found the victor is best at sitting on top of hills or behind cover, waiting for the enemy to string out and leave a target or two vulnerable in the back, or to jump in behind a battle once your brawlers engage. In either of these cases, you want to front-load your damage as much as humanly possible, so you can unleash a barrage and retreat back up over a hill away from pursuers before they can properly respond to you.

In defense of the 3xAC2 build:

The 3xAC2 has great DPS And HPS. If they leave you a ten-second window, you can deal ridiculous damage. The DPS of a single AC2 is 4, the DPS of a single AC20 is 5. So 3xAC2 gives DPS of 12. The obvious downside is that first they aren't pinpoint (although if you group fire them, you deliver 6 damage at the same location per shot), and second you need a 4-10 second window during which you can't turn away from your target. So the best is to team up with another mech that is built as a frontline brawler. Of course, an Atlas or Stalker will be ideal, but even a Cent or Hunch is a great partner. When an enemy turns its attention elsewhere for 4 seconds, you give 'em the 3xAC2 slap around the face. Even a high-alpha sniper build will take a large amount of AC2 damage in the time it takes them to turn and aim at you (unless they are aimbotting; taking less than 0.5 seconds to aim is beyond human).

The key is also to not be too greedy about kills. You are a DPS machine, so you have to be willing to let your kill run away heavily damaged but not dead, esp when you run an XL engine to get maneuverability.

Do not face up against a dedicated brawler head-on, you'll die. Also do not face up against a fresh high-alpha mech, you'll die quick. But combine a 3xAC2 Victor with a good brawler mech or even sniper -- and as I said, it doesn't have to be a stompy assault mech -- you have a great composition.

[TexAce]

Eisenhorne, on 24 July 2013 - 05:21 AM, said:

I'd swap the AC/2's for an AC/20, and upgrade the rest of the weapon systems with the extra weight.

VTR-9B

I know you like constant fire, but that is not what the victor is good at. I've found the victor is best at sitting on top of hills or behind cover, waiting for the enemy to string out and leave a target or two vulnerable in the back, or to jump in behind a battle once your brawlers engage. In either of these cases, you want to front-load your damage as much as humanly possible, so you can unleash a barrage and retreat back up over a hill away from pursuers before they can properly respond to you.

Have to disagree.
Your proposal is a typical victor build but I like to test more, since I already have a 9K with a gauss and a 9S with 2xUAC5s which rock the whack out of everyone (so much to the victor not being good at constant fire). And since the double ultras work so good I want to try the triple AC2s. But thanks anyway.

Itsalrightwithme, on 24 July 2013 - 07:48 AM, said:

In defense of the 3xAC2 build:

The 3xAC2 has great DPS And HPS. If they leave you a ten-second window, you can deal ridiculous damage. The DPS of a single AC2 is 4, the DPS of a single AC20 is 5. So 3xAC2 gives DPS of 12. The obvious downside is that first they aren't pinpoint (although if you group fire them, you deliver 6 damage at the same location per shot), and second you need a 4-10 second window during which you can't turn away from your target. So the best is to team up with another mech that is built as a frontline brawler. Of course, an Atlas or Stalker will be ideal, but even a Cent or Hunch is a great partner. When an enemy turns its attention elsewhere for 4 seconds, you give 'em the 3xAC2 slap around the face. Even a high-alpha sniper build will take a large amount of AC2 damage in the time it takes them to turn and aim at you (unless they are aimbotting; taking less than 0.5 seconds to aim is beyond human).

The key is also to not be too greedy about kills. You are a DPS machine, so you have to be willing to let your kill run away heavily damaged but not dead, esp when you run an XL engine to get maneuverability.

Do not face up against a dedicated brawler head-on, you'll die. Also do not face up against a fresh high-alpha mech, you'll die quick. But combine a 3xAC2 Victor with a good brawler mech or even sniper -- and as I said, it doesn't have to be a stompy assault mech -- you have a great composition.

This is exactly what I do with my 2xUAC5 build I have (Victor 9S) so the triple AC2s definately have my attention and I will try them tomorrow night latest.

[Devil Fox]

Itsalrightwithme, on 24 July 2013 - 07:48 AM, said:

(unless they are aimbotting; taking less than 0.5 seconds to aim is beyond human).

Actually those that can do so are reflex shooters, they already know your general location but can quickly adapt (provided the machine moves as fast) to cover you in their crosshairs. I should know, landed me 2 assault mech headshots in my Poptart Victor and got 2 kills on fast mechs running towards cover slightly behind it already, snapshots had to be done to finish the fight.

Still I think triple AC2 builds are inferior in many games, particularly higher elo match-ups because of exposure time vs dmg.

[Skydrive]

Apostal, on 25 July 2013 - 04:34 AM, said:

Actually those that can do so are reflex shooters, they already know your general location but can quickly adapt (provided the machine moves as fast) to cover you in their crosshairs. I should know, landed me 2 assault mech headshots in my Poptart Victor and got 2 kills on fast mechs running towards cover slightly behind it already, snapshots had to be done to finish the fight.

Still I think triple AC2 builds are inferior in many games, particularly higher elo match-ups because of exposure time vs dmg.

You know, you can have alot of fun being very exposed in Alpine while armed with AC2's. A couple times while in my Jager S I would climb up to this one spot on the high spawn point side, and from there was able to fire at the enemy mechs approaching my teammates, and in another game was able to spot the enemy team going between the mountains for our base. While firing at them with my AC2's, a few of the enemy mechs would hit me with their Gauss Rifles and ER PPCs, but do no damage. Believe it still said I was at 100%, which made me laugh. This also had the added benefit of slowing some of them down while they tried to snipe me, allowing my team more time to relocate from the tower hill in order to defend our base.

Edited by Skydrive, 25 July 2013 - 08:09 AM.

[Hebdomas]

I tried a double UAC5 build and while I liked the increased range it felt like I had to fire constantly and expose myself. Also ran into an issue with having to aim differently for the different weapons. I'm fairly certain double UAC5 are viable they just aren't for me. (I will say that UAC5s look freaking awesome on the Victor, a three barrel Gatling(?) gun.)

So I went back to my attempt at using a LPL and tried to incorporate what I had learned so far from playing a Victor. I wanted more range and more speed than what the Victor came with. I will warn that this build is strange and not for everyone, but it works for me.

VTR-9B

It's only slightly faster than a standard Victor, but you don't seem to get much of an increase in speed when going up engine size. I haven't unlocked speed tweak yet, I imagine that will make a noticeable difference.

I downgraded from an AC20 (which is probably heresy somewhere) to an AC10 which gives more range, more ammo per ton, and has a lower cooldown by 1.5 seconds. I don't feel like I'm losing that much.

Added two machine guns. I had never used machine guns before and was surprised at how fast they can rip through internals. There seems to be a bug with the in game mech lab in regards to calculating firepower with machine guns, I have almost 60 firepower according to in game, but 41.8 according to Smurfy.

Large Pulse Laser, I like to think of this as a surprise. It hits hard and most people aren't expecting to see a LPL. You could use a PPC, but the purpose of this was to try out a LPL. It's backed up by a medium laser.

AMS, as an assault (even more as a close range assault) I feel that you're a prime target for LRMs. So AMS is there just to reduce that damage.

SRM4s as I like their spread/cluster more than SRM6s and don't seem to need Artemis as much as SRM6s do.

[ShadowbaneX]

Ok, so on a whim I picked up a 9S and kept with a more traditional loadout, ie AC/20. As opposed to the uAC/5 version I was talking about earlier where you constantly have to face your opponent and sustain fire, and subsequently get your STs blown out, I found I did much better with this load out. I still find I die to STs blown out to often, but it's better than with the uACs.

[Madwill]

The Victor has changed how i play. And, with that change has come something i haven't done with any other mech: a positive win/loss and kill/death ratio. For some reason the victor has made me a better player.

[Madwill]

Hebdomas, on 25 July 2013 - 09:21 AM, said:

I tried a double UAC5 build and while I liked the increased range it felt like I had to fire constantly and expose myself. Also ran into an issue with having to aim differently for the different weapons. I'm fairly certain double UAC5 are viable they just aren't for me. (I will say that UAC5s look freaking awesome on the Victor, a three barrel Gatling(?) gun.)

So I went back to my attempt at using a LPL and tried to incorporate what I had learned so far from playing a Victor. I wanted more range and more speed than what the Victor came with. I will warn that this build is strange and not for everyone, but it works for me.

VTR-9B

It's only slightly faster than a standard Victor, but you don't seem to get much of an increase in speed when going up engine size. I haven't unlocked speed tweak yet, I imagine that will make a noticeable difference.

I downgraded from an AC20 (which is probably heresy somewhere) to an AC10 which gives more range, more ammo per ton, and has a lower cooldown by 1.5 seconds. I don't feel like I'm losing that much.

Added two machine guns. I had never used machine guns before and was surprised at how fast they can rip through internals. There seems to be a bug with the in game mech lab in regards to calculating firepower with machine guns, I have almost 60 firepower according to in game, but 41.8 according to Smurfy.

Large Pulse Laser, I like to think of this as a surprise. It hits hard and most people aren't expecting to see a LPL. You could use a PPC, but the purpose of this was to try out a LPL. It's backed up by a medium laser.

AMS, as an assault (even more as a close range assault) I feel that you're a prime target for LRMs. So AMS is there just to reduce that damage.

SRM4s as I like their spread/cluster more than SRM6s and don't seem to need Artemis as much as SRM6s do.

to me, LL's compliment the AC 10 better and allow you to stay and range longer before you close in.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...3ae9d206d1ba926

[Benjamin Davion]

Itsalrightwithme, on 24 July 2013 - 07:48 AM, said:

In defense of the 3xAC2 build:

The 3xAC2 has great DPS And HPS. If they leave you a ten-second window, you can deal ridiculous damage. The DPS of a single AC2 is 4, the DPS of a single AC20 is 5. So 3xAC2 gives DPS of 12. The obvious downside is that first they aren't pinpoint (although if you group fire them, you deliver 6 damage at the same location per shot), and second you need a 4-10 second window during which you can't turn away from your target. So the best is to team up with another mech that is built as a frontline brawler. Of course, an Atlas or Stalker will be ideal, but even a Cent or Hunch is a great partner. When an enemy turns its attention elsewhere for 4 seconds, you give 'em the 3xAC2 slap around the face. Even a high-alpha sniper build will take a large amount of AC2 damage in the time it takes them to turn and aim at you (unless they are aimbotting; taking less than 0.5 seconds to aim is beyond human).

The key is also to not be too greedy about kills. You are a DPS machine, so you have to be willing to let your kill run away heavily damaged but not dead, esp when you run an XL engine to get maneuverability.

Do not face up against a dedicated brawler head-on, you'll die. Also do not face up against a fresh high-alpha mech, you'll die quick. But combine a 3xAC2 Victor with a good brawler mech or even sniper -- and as I said, it doesn't have to be a stompy assault mech -- you have a great composition.

I was very excited about the 3AC2 build. Put it together. Took it into a three four-man drops. Each time, I survived, but did far less damage than I would do even in a light scout mech. The problem is that the Victor is so much more vulnerable than most assaults. It's hard to sit and hold fire on someone, which is what is required to accomplish anything with 3AC2s, without being located and pounded into scrap.

I have since swapped to 2MGs, 2PPCs, 2LRM5s, and am loving the results. Also tried SRM6s, but the LRM allows me more room for DHS because the build was HOT. Right now I have it at 1.68 heat dissipation. My very last match, I used my Victor as a bottle-stopper and plugged myself into one of the lower canyons on Canyon Network, parked under the bridge for missile cover. I had a Cataphract for backup. Over the next three or four minutes, the Phract went down, but trading fire around the corner, I dueled an Atlas, an Awesome, a Phract, and a Jag. A couple of friendly mechs bounced in and out occassionally, but I was essentially on my own once the Phract went down. I killed the Atlas, cored and one-armed the Jag, mauled the Phract, and, with the help of some long-range LRM support, cored the Awesome, before finally going down. Meanwhile, my team was chasing their four light mechs all over creation. I ended that match (the first with the finally completed build) with 1 kill, 6 assists, 431 damage.