268 replies to this topic

[Brandon Howell]

El Bandito, on 06 July 2013 - 10:42 AM, said:

250 damage is chump change BTW. If I dealt that amount of damage in a match, I would not be satisfied.
In fact, I will laugh at PPC boats dealing mere 250 damage per match.

Yeah it was quite literally chump change to deal that lil amount of damage by those guys. Normally they would be in the 400s but it was conquest so ill leave it to that.

Lastly this game isn't the Olympics by a long shot (maybe 'special' Olympics within my team ;p ) however good teams aren't going to downgrade their mechs simply cause that is what someone else says is 'real' and 'truthful to the lore'. We play to win cause when Community warfare comes out we want to be the team at the tippy top of the food chain dominating it.

[SleepTrgt]

MustrumRidcully, on 06 July 2013 - 10:40 AM, said:

Olympic swimmers don't wear boxer shorts during competitions "to have a challenge". They trust they'll be challenged enough by all the other well trained swimmers they are competing and don'T need to handicap themselves.

Good players adapt to the meta. And in M:WO's case, that often means adopting the meta.
Good players smell meta changes coming and are the first to figure out the new broken builds.

You know how you recognize good players in any game - they stay on the top, no matter what the FOTM or the current meta is. Sometimes that means they'll use the FOTM, sometimes it means they invented it. sometimes they might decide to avoid the FOTM and the current meta and try something else. Usually when they are bored because the game is so imbalanced that there are too few viable and competitive builds.

And no, I am not one of those good players. Just good enough to realize my many shortcomings.

So lets stop using every weapon but PPC + Gauss
To me its simple if you go with for example group of 4 ppl only ppc boating, suddenly the game feels super easy
Sure its not only PPC also might be convergence and such, but every weapon has pinpoint convergence and PPC stands out in any way.

For example more Heat could be enough.

[Aaron45]

SleepTrgt, on 06 July 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

So lets stop using every weapon but PPC + Gauss
To me its simple if you go with for example group of 4 ppl only ppc boating, suddenly the game feels super easy
Sure its not only PPC also might be convergence and such, but every weapon has pinpoint convergence and PPC stands out in any way.

For example more Heat could be enough.

Exactly- the game feel easy then like super arcade mode

[Odins Fist]

Nobody, and I mean absolutely nobody can blame a player base for using the tools that are given to them by the people producing the enviroment those tools will be used in, and the tools themselves.

And then it appears the very people that produce those tools are complaining about said tools..??

That can't be, can it..??

[P e n u m b r a]

Who cares if they did bad, who says all of the devs have to be good at the game? some of them are artists or not directly involved in the balance at all. What I don't understand is this imaginary world where mixed builds are the best and most "fun" that is an opinion boats are true to battletech lore for example....

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Hellstar
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Supernova
http://www.sarna.net...va_(Black_Hawk)
http://www.sarna.net...at_(BattleMech)
http://www.sarna.net...i/Hunchback_IIC
http://www.sarna.net...hawk_(Masakari)

also the most effective mechs on the TT are boats... so what are you talking about? the rest of the weapons are being tweaked at the moment (srm) and certain weapons that would make brawlers alot stronger are just not out yet (ssrm 4/6, lbx20, ultra ac10 and 20, Heavy lasers, snub nose ppc). You all know fine well its beta release date has been stated.

there is major problems with data being presented and reported with no way to setup and play a team drop, for pug matches, choosing ppcs (along with the current weak state of close range weapons) is the safest option to take on all maps for a solo que, before the HSR when SRMS were crazy good. brawling requires a entire horde movement of a team to do well, this does not happen in a solo que. Before the srm nerf you could compete in solo play with srm but in team games they were overpowered.

Edited by Le0yo, 06 July 2013 - 11:14 AM.

[SilentWolff]

Legolaas, on 06 July 2013 - 07:15 AM, said:

They even didnt get one kill out of 10-15 matches. Reason?

Pgi guys were saying over voice comm this funny stuff:


"PPcs are disgusting"

"Paul your game is inbalanced and broken"



Lets see how they ll nerf the ppc´s

now they probabyly saw how incredible effective or Op ppc´s are and these so called elite Players only use that broken Op weapon.

Pgi dudes used balanced loudouts like all fair and real good players use but the ennemy team was using cheezy Loudouts like hell. Cheers to the so called "elite players" or competitive Loudouts".LULZ

Well you can thank us for those quotes from PGI. We played them 3 games last night and won each 8-0. While I'm encouraged to see them playing their own game, I'm also concerned at their complete lack of understanding about what works and doesnt in their current meta.

I have been playing this game since closed beta and the one thing that is consistent, is change. Good players will always adapt to these changes and take whatever loadout happens to be the most effective at the time. Theres nothing "cheese" about that, its just the facts of good players adapting to the game changes.

About the only thing that will never change in this game is bad players crying about getting pwned by whatever weapon happens to be the flavor of the month at the time.

Darwin put it best, adapt, migrate, or DIE.

[Aaron45]

SilentWolff, on 06 July 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

Well you can thank us for those quotes from PGI. We played them 3 games last night and won each 8-0. While I'm encouraged to see them playing their own game, I'm also concerned at their complete lack of understanding about what works and doesnt in their current meta.

I have been playing this game since closed beta and the one thing that is consistent, is change. Good players will always adapt to these changes and take whatever loadout happens to be the most effective at the time. Theres nothing "cheese" about that, its just the facts of good players adapting to the game changes.

About the only thing that will never change in this game is bad players crying about getting pwned by whatever weapon happens to be the flavor of the month at the time.

Darwin put it best, adapt, migrate, or DIE.

As an answer:

SleepTrgt, on 06 July 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

So lets stop using every weapon but PPC + Gauss
To me its simple if you go with for example group of 4 ppl only ppc boating, suddenly the game feels super easy
Sure its not only PPC also might be convergence and such, but every weapon has pinpoint convergence and PPC stands out in any way.

For example more Heat could be enough.

Legolaas, on 06 July 2013 - 10:54 AM, said:

Exactly- the game feel easy then like super arcade mode

Edited by Legolaas, 06 July 2013 - 11:10 AM.

[GODzillaGSPB]

Zoghak, on 06 July 2013 - 08:56 AM, said:

http://www.twitch.tv...mes/b/426363372
http://www.twitch.tv...mes/b/426369933
http://www.twitch.tv...mes/b/426379176

The videos stutter like hell when the actually drop and start to play. Is it just me? Unwatchable.

[Jman5]

Le0yo, on 06 July 2013 - 10:57 AM, said:

Who cares if they did bad, who says all of the devs have to be good at the game? some of them are artists or not directly involved in the balance at all.

Just to be clear, I completely understand and do not expect employees at PGI to be elite mechwarriors. It's normal that the player base is leaps and bounds better than the guys working on the game.

That said, I think it is absolutely constructive to bring the biggest problem builds to their 8 mans and throw it in their face. Sometimes you have to spell it out like this to make your point. A good balance will take into account people trying their best to break it.

[Alieff Thon]

PPC's are not overpowered but your skill in using what's availible is the key. Be a good pilot use whats availible and load accordingly. you nerf PPC's the next weapons will be the same a good pilot is a good pilot practice get together in teams on comm's and work together if not you will keep complaining about everthing you get beat by

[CancR]

PGI always sucks, which is why they gave us mechassault instead of mechwarrior. Testing internally+bad=mechassault.

[SilentWolff]

For the record, every MW game has had pinpoint accuracy. This is nothing new. PPC's aren't operating any differently from past MW games.
The problem is, in past MW games you had lasers to combat PPC's. Lasers were a huge counterweight to PPC's, because they were insta fire damage as well. Now, PGI has made them damage over time and I think this is a big reason why PPC's seem to some people, to be OP. You no longer have that counterbalance and it exasperates the problem.

[Kattspya]

Holy hell... I just watched the videos and if collision is anything to go by PPC's are going to be nerfed into the ground.

I didn't see anyone involved with game balance in the roster though so you can't really hold them personally responsible. Nor can you really require them to know what is best to use. They should eat their own dogfood but ELO makes sure that even if they do they are not likely to be exposed to the "real game" unless they are dedicated and skillfull.

[P e n u m b r a]

the other weapons are getting reworked? couple of balance changes that i feel would work.

allow the smaller calliber lasers (medium, small) to deliver their damage instantly instead of channeled with the incoming boating change stacking many lasers heat will be through the roof on some lighter builds (they are unable to put much other weapons on their mech the boat change will hurt the lighter mechs alot) if you want to take alot of these. however dealing it instantly will allow you to use torso twisting to avoid damage to a greater effect while brawling.

increase srm to 1.7 damage

increase velocity of lbx pellets to land almost instantly within their optimal range

increase internal armour make crit seeking weapons worth it

increase ammo per ton with double armor in place this makes sense and allows a brawler not have to carry a bomb truck into battle.

make overheating slow mech speed.

150% heat can destroy sinks

increase handling turning. acceleration/deceleration on light and mediums reduce size on mediums slightly.

Edited by Le0yo, 06 July 2013 - 11:41 AM.

[keith]

SilentWolff, on 06 July 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

For the record, every MW game has had pinpoint accuracy. This is nothing new. PPC's aren't operating any differently from past MW games.
The problem is, in past MW games you had lasers to combat PPC's. Lasers were a huge counterweight to PPC's, because they were insta fire damage as well. Now, PGI has made them damage over time and I think this is a big reason why PPC's seem to some people, to be OP. You no longer have that counterbalance and it exasperates the problem.

someone knows what they are talking about:P give this person a cookie. i hope to god PGI does not force us to go balance builds. forcing ppl to use certain play styles is horrible. if someone wishes to min max that is there choice, if someone wishes to go a balance build that is their choice. both should be just as effective.

[SleepTrgt]

Alieff Thon, on 06 July 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

PPC's are not overpowered but your skill in using what's availible is the key. Be a good pilot use whats availible and load accordingly. you nerf PPC's the next weapons will be the same a good pilot is a good pilot practice get together in teams on comm's and work together if not you will keep complaining about everthing you get beat by

I'm just tired of those ppl who think they are so PRO with ppcs and still require skill.
I do okay with most my builds, whatever i pick even dual LB10x Firebrand worked fine for me, sometimes i make stupid mistakes like running into too many mechs etc.
But using 3 ppc + Guass it just gets too easy to get over 700 DMG, you can say whatever you want, but using ppc is alot easier then most other weapons... IsTHAT balance?

[jeffsw6]

Le0yo, on 06 July 2013 - 10:57 AM, said:

Who cares if they did bad, who says all of the devs have to be good at the game?

Not a single poster has said they should be good at the game.

They, or at minimum, guys like Paul and Garth, should understand the meta-game. That is their job.

[Aaron45]

SleepTrgt, on 06 July 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

I'm just tired of those ppl who think they are so PRO with ppcs and still require skill.
I do okay with most my builds, whatever i pick even dual LB10x Firebrand worked fine for me, sometimes i make stupid mistakes like running into too many mechs etc.
But using 3 ppc + Guass it just gets too easy to get over 700 DMG, you can say whatever you want, but using ppc is alot easier then most other weapons... IsTHAT balance?

i totally agree.

The sad thing is that the so called "Elite" players or what ever wanna tell us they are sooo good with their ppc /gauss build cuz they are soooo PRO. And we are just too silly to figure out that using ppc gives you a large benefit over your ennemies.

I dont wanna blame them for using the most effective build(s)- the thing is that those player tend to think at the end of the match that they are much better than ppl with balanced builds.

Edited by Legolaas, 06 July 2013 - 11:54 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Bagheera, on 06 July 2013 - 08:10 AM, said:

Pretty much this. I was hopeful that the movement changes would give mediums a boost, but really only gives JJ users a boost in all weight classes.

My TBT-5J MPL boat loves the new movement code, but everything without JJs is nonplussed.

The idea is sound, but it needs tuning and by itself isn't going to do anything about PeePeeCee superiority.

even JJS are marginally better at best. Don't get a running start, your JJs are taking you....

Straight Up.

So half the time instead of clearing terrain you are merely getting stuck halfway up. YAY! fo JJs!

[Aaron45]

keith, on 06 July 2013 - 11:38 AM, said:

someone knows what they are talking about:P give this person a cookie. i hope to god PGI does not force us to go balance builds. forcing ppl to use certain play styles is horrible. if someone wishes to min max that is there choice, if someone wishes to go a balance build that is their choice. both should be just as effective.

OFC a balanced build should be as effective as a maxed build. But thats not the fact right now