56 replies to this topic

[Roughneck45]

Weapon balance right now makes just about every mech disappointing.

If brawling ever makes a comeback the extra speed you can get with this mech may come in handy.

Right now, all you can do is take 3 PPC's Gauss and poptart.

Edited by Roughneck45, 08 July 2013 - 07:24 AM.

[Iskareot]

Its a mixed bag for me... I have had a few drops of great matches then the WORST ones I have ever had.

Whats frustrating is that my QD lasts longer then this mech does hands down... I know it does not make sense but man it sure seems like it. Sometimes it does ok takes a few hits.. BUT SOME rounds it seems to get cored almost instantly and then its over.

It does NOT seem like a Assmech - it seems like a Heavy in most respects. I can say as well that I am a bit dissapointed in it and wish I spent the money on Misery or something that can take some hits. (At least a few)... I know its meant for damage and go .. but really its a freaking 80 ton mech.

I will be curious to see the vars of this Victor... I get the feeling some may be better then the hero version lol

[One Medic Army]

I decided to wait for the CBill versions, since I don't like torso energy hardpoints on assaults, much prefer arm mounts.

[armyof1]

One Medic Army, on 08 July 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

I decided to wait for the CBill versions, since I don't like torso energy hardpoints on assaults, much prefer arm mounts.

Yep I'm with you there, finally going to play a mini Highlander the way I always wanted without the MC gate: Baby HM

or with XL: XL HM

Edited by armyof1, 08 July 2013 - 08:49 AM.

[Angel of Annihilation]

One Medic Army, on 08 July 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

I decided to wait for the CBill versions, since I don't like torso energy hardpoints on assaults, much prefer arm mounts.

You know I had decided to do that myself at one point but since I had MC left over from founders, I figured what the hell especially since I didn't expect any other hero mechs to peak my interest between now and the end of the year (purchased the Overlord package).

That being said, I have a feeling I am going to like 9K variant better for the same reason you are waiting, i.e. I can move the torso mounted MLs to the arm. Already after only 14 matches I am finding the inability to bring my MLs to bear on enemies below me to be a nuisance. Of course this might be because I have a tendency to use my JJs to get to high places that make it harder for the enemy to use it's torso mounted weapons on me as well.

[One Medic Army]

Viktor Drake, on 08 July 2013 - 08:48 AM, said:

You know I had decided to do that myself at one point but since I had MC left over from founders, I figured what the hell especially since I didn't expect any other hero mechs to peak my interest between now and the end of the year (purchased the Overlord package).

That being said, I have a feeling I am going to like 9K variant better for the same reason you are waiting, i.e. I can move the torso mounted MLs to the arm. Already after only 14 matches I am finding the inability to bring my MLs to bear on enemies below me to be a nuisance. Of course this might be because I have a tendency to use my JJs to get to high places that make it harder for the enemy to use it's torso mounted weapons on me as well.

That's exactly the reason I bought the Heavy Metal: leftover Founder's MC, plus I liked that it actually had energy arm mounts compared to the torso energy on the standard models.
Now I get an entire line of energy arm jumpjet assault mechs, and they have big engines as well.

The Heavy Metal is by far my favorite highlander, I'm looking forward to having several fast 80ton versions.

[zhajin]

I would certainly wait until its fully unlocked to cast it off, it really does make a difference. also if they ever get around to tweaking srms, that will help it as well. I would not however compare it to a quickdraw, it is a bit of a stretch to expect it to be as agile. its more akin to a better armored 3D. i think the 3D is still a better mech at the moment, but does not have a 30% cbill boost, and if srms are ever viable again that might give it a bump over the 3D.

as for not seeing them a lot, i noticed that also. the heavy metal was everywhere when it was first released. however then i considered the fact that the phoenix package was announce the week before. hard to spend $30 on a mech when you just spent $80...

[Bishop Steiner]

I see 2-3 a match.... wonder if it;s an ELOHell Bracket thing?

[Angel of Annihilation]

Iskareot, on 08 July 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

Its a mixed bag for me... I have had a few drops of great matches then the WORST ones I have ever had.

Whats frustrating is that my QD lasts longer then this mech does hands down... I know it does not make sense but man it sure seems like it. Sometimes it does ok takes a few hits.. BUT SOME rounds it seems to get cored almost instantly and then its over.

It does NOT seem like a Assmech - it seems like a Heavy in most respects. I can say as well that I am a bit dissapointed in it and wish I spent the money on Misery or something that can take some hits. (At least a few)... I know its meant for damage and go .. but really its a freaking 80 ton mech.

I will be curious to see the vars of this Victor... I get the feeling some may be better then the hero version lol

From my experience, the side torsos are much more vulnerable on the Victor which is why I too feel the Victor is not as durable as the Quickdraw. For example, I don't ever recall dying because they took out my side torso on the QD and I have almost 250 matches with it. However, I have died twice to side torso hits in the Victor in just 14 matches. That part in and of itself is kind of disappointing because I was hoping it would be more durable option to the QD.

One Medic Army, on 08 July 2013 - 09:08 AM, said:

That's exactly the reason I bought the Heavy Metal: leftover Founder's MC, plus I liked that it actually had energy arm mounts compared to the torso energy on the standard models.
Now I get an entire line of energy arm jumpjet assault mechs, and they have big engines as well.

The Heavy Metal is by far my favorite highlander, I'm looking forward to having several fast 80ton versions.

Yeah its hard sitting on that much MC when you don't see anything coming down the pipe in the next 6 months that you might want to spend it on. I guess I could have waited to see if they came out with a Hero QD but the reviews and hard stats looked really good on the Dragon Slayer so I figure better to use it and have fun now than hope for something decent later. This is especially true since I bought the Overlord package.

zhajin, on 08 July 2013 - 09:18 AM, said:

I would certainly wait until its fully unlocked to cast it off, it really does make a difference. also if they ever get around to tweaking srms, that will help it as well. I would not however compare it to a quickdraw, it is a bit of a stretch to expect it to be as agile. its more akin to a better armored 3D. i think the 3D is still a better mech at the moment, but does not have a 30% cbill boost, and if srms are ever viable again that might give it a bump over the 3D.

as for not seeing them a lot, i noticed that also. the heavy metal was everywhere when it was first released. however then i considered the fact that the phoenix package was announce the week before. hard to spend $30 on a mech when you just spent $80...

Oh I am definately not casting it off and it is not a matter of disliking the mech, it is just a matter of it not meeting my expectations/hopes. I guess I honestly was expecting it to have similar agility to a Quickdraw to be honest. This was based on the fact it was in the same movement catagory for the new moment change, plus it is pretty much the exact same size model wise. Oh I knew it would give up some mobility because it is a larger weight class but I figured it would at least be comparable to my Cataphract 3D considering it is much faster than my 3D.

As far as not seeing them....I haven't seen a ton of them myself but they aren't super uncommon. I really do think this is because of ELO screw up the matchings. Really wish they would do away with that crap but that is for another topic.

[Chavette]

Finishing elite makes a huge difference. I remember when it transformed the HM from "something funny and different" to an absolute atlas killer beast.

[Tennex]

good thing it wasn't that expensive right ?

[Lyoncet]

Has anyone seen a Victor/Dragon Slayer hitbox image? I think the hitbox size could be a big factor in how it stacks up against the Quickdraw. I was really surprised to see how small the Quickdraw's side torso hitboxes are. (See here.)

[Angel of Annihilation]

Lyoncet, on 08 July 2013 - 02:07 PM, said:

Has anyone seen a Victor/Dragon Slayer hitbox image? I think the hitbox size could be a big factor in how it stacks up against the Quickdraw. I was really surprised to see how small the Quickdraw's side torso hitboxes are. (See here.)

Yeah I mentioned that in one of my posts here. The QD has tiny side torso hitboxes. In fact in around 250 matchs I can't recall once getting a blown out side torso that resulted in a kill (though I am sure it had to happen at least a few times). This is absolutely not the case with the Victor. Right now I am running about a 15% death rate to side torso hits.

Tennex, on 08 July 2013 - 02:05 PM, said:

good thing it wasn't that expensive right ?

Well considering I got 20,000 MC with my founders package, the Dragon Slayer wasn't all that expensive at roughly $18 dollars. Less if you consider all the value I got out of my Founders mech and premium time. Now there is no way in hell I would have spent $30 on it if I hadn't had the cheap founder MC. The target price for hero mechs should have been the $10-$15 range. Honestly I think they would have made a who hell of alot more money if they hadn't been so greedy with their pricing.

Same goes for colors and camo. 3 colors and a single camo pattern for almost 2750 MC, are you serious? A pattern should be like maybe 250 MC and individual colors maybe 50 MC each. Anyway definately another thread needed for this discussion.

Edited by Viktor Drake, 08 July 2013 - 02:35 PM.

[Devil Fox]

armyof1, on 08 July 2013 - 05:21 AM, said:

Well since you're only doing 76 kph then it sure isn't an XL400 you're using which is a real waste of tonnage. But are you only carrying one ERPPC and a Gauss? Because that to me sounds really low on firepower for an 80t mech. At least 2ML when something fast gets close to you would make the mech more versatile.

Arm mounted weapons... their a beautiful thing, and typically after hitting a light in the leg once they tend to try running. it might be low firepower but it's a pinpoint precision loadout, you're there for efficiency and accuracy not potshots like every other sniper. I tend to also close with my meals and start jumping/torso twisting around them, you have the power and heat efficiency to lay into their CT or XL torso as most players try to rely on firepower.

I don't know why comparison to a Quickdraw keep coming up, in essence the Victor is closer to the Highlander in terms of both hitboxes and armour, however it doesn't have the versatility of hardpoints of the pure energy/missile hardpoints of the Quickdraw... more like the dragon (where I also have a Guass/ERPPC build variation).

[Arkmaus]

I love my Victor. I'll post my loadout when I get the chance.

[Sybreed]

having an 80 tons mech while you can have a 90 or 100 tons one won't make much sense until tonnage limits.

[Devil Fox]

Makes plenty of sense depending on your play style... my HGN never went poptart, they were anti-tart builds of twin ALRM15, Guass and 3 ML to hammer them when they came up and down. The 80ton range gives the assault class the agility and armament of the heavy class, like what the Cicada does for the mediums in that it's a pseudo-light. And I expect to see alot more once their released become a staple assault mech on the field.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Apostal, on 08 July 2013 - 06:12 PM, said:

Makes plenty of sense depending on your play style... my HGN never went poptart, they were anti-tart builds of twin ALRM15, Guass and 3 ML to hammer them when they came up and down. The 80ton range gives the assault class the agility and armament of the heavy class, like what the Cicada does for the mediums in that it's a pseudo-light. And I expect to see alot more once their released become a staple assault mech on the field.

The problem is that I don't find it has the agily of a heavy class mech.

For example, my QDs feel just as nimble as my Trebuchet did despite being 10 tons heavier. I expected the same out of the Victor but it honestly feels closer to my Highlander than it does my Cataphract 3D. It takes alot to get off the ground and has very limited height despite 4 JJs. I lists 21m for 4 jump Jets while the 3D carries 23m for 4 JJs. That doesn't seem like much but it is a huge difference. Also the general agility isn't there. For example I have a huge issue reversing momentum and the turn radius is fairly large. Now maybe the mech is tuned around a 400XL engine which is why a 350XL gives so poor performance but lets face it, mounting a 400XL gives you less firepower than most 50 ton medium mechs.

[Lightfoot]

I can't find a loadout that works except 1 Gauss and 3xPPC, which is a little boring. SSRMs are useless now (100 SSRMs can't kill a Jenner), similar with SRMs. Tried LRMs, but no Missile Tubes for them and LRMs can't compete with any direct fire weapon so there you go. Gauss and PPCs only. I also use an ST engine because it's too easy to kill with an XL.

Which kind of underscores a problem MWO has with Missile based weapons. They seem to think there is something wrong with Missiles when they work decently well, so we end up with only direct fire working. When your mech has only 2 or 3 energy slots you are forced to use PPCs, if you are honest about Mechlab.

If Missles worked I would drop the PPCs for Lasers and Missiles.

[Devil Fox]

Viktor Drake, on 08 July 2013 - 07:15 PM, said:

The problem is that I don't find it has the agily of a heavy class mech.

For example, my QDs feel just as nimble as my Trebuchet did despite being 10 tons heavier. I expected the same out of the Victor but it honestly feels closer to my Highlander than it does my Cataphract 3D. It takes alot to get off the ground and has very limited height despite 4 JJs. I lists 21m for 4 jump Jets while the 3D carries 23m for 4 JJs. That doesn't seem like much but it is a huge difference. Also the general agility isn't there. For example I have a huge issue reversing momentum and the turn radius is fairly large. Now maybe the mech is tuned around a 400XL engine which is why a 350XL gives so poor performance but lets face it, mounting a 400XL gives you less firepower than most 50 ton medium mechs.

QD though is at the bottom of the heavy list and because of it's engine sizes occupies the role of a bridge between the Medium and Heavy Chassis. The 4JJ on the Victor are fine, the problem with jumpjets is that you need the forward momentum to make the best use of them which is where larger engines provide the pivot point.

A 400XL I agree is wasted tonnage, that's why I'm not doing over a 380XL where I get a good return of speed to tonnage, and still have the firepower I require. But yea at present the larger the engine in a Victor the more balanced it seems to be... kind of broken in that regard. But until slower close range brawler are more viable (without being spotted then shot to pieces 500m from a target), you need the speed to cover both ground and flanks.