65 replies to this topic

[Capt Jester]

I hear over and over that the Atlas D variant is useless and that the DDC can do everything better with another missile hardpoint and an ECM hardpoint. Sure, but when you pilot a DDC, you tend to get cocky and believe that with your ECM, you're pretty much invincible. I built this D variant and I have had great success both in PUG games and in premade group drops, easily pulling 500+ damage. This is not a brawler, and should not be played as one, but can survive a close quarters encounter should the need arise.

With that said, here's the build: AS7-D

You can swap the LLas for ERLLas if you don't mind the heat, and this build is very heat efficient at 1.49 efficiency. If you were feeling lucky, you could even drop a heat sink in favor of another ton of Gauss ammo or LRM ammo, though I rarely run out of Gauss ammo.

[Zed993]

Saying the D is not viable is certainly very harsh. While I do agree that generally the D-DC is a better variant than the other Atlai, both the D and RS can still hold their own and are solid 'mechs. Although I find playing any Atlas in the current PPC, AC/40, LRM meta rather painful.

Couple problems with your build. First of all you should switch that LRM ammo with the gauss in the leg. Having ammo in your torso is never a good idea if you can avoid it. Place it in the legs, arms, or head. Second, you aren't using the CT laser slots; yes you stated you aren't a brawler but you might still be forced into a brawl and having back-up lasers is always nice, especially for only 2 tons.

Swapped a ton of LRM ammo for gauss, placed LRM ammo in legs, and removed 3 DHS to swap the 2xLRM 10s out for a single LRM 20 + Artemis and added two medium lasers. You should find this acceptably hot for a fire support 'mech.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...75f5d81f5df8877

I don't personally like playing Atlai as support, I find their hardpoint placement is too unfocused and their weapons fire from too low on the torso to make it viable compared to other 'mechs like the Stalker that are perfectly built for fire support. I also can't stand having a gauss in my Atlas RT because it gets detonated so easily, I prefer to take Dual UAC/5 if I want ballistic range.

If you do want to run fire support though that build should do ya', all personal preference after all.

[Little Nemo]

The RS does that better with 4LL and Gauss IMO.

[Hebdomas]

In my opinion if you're not using the CT energy slots that the D offers you should be playing a DDC. As far as I can tell the only reason to play a D and not a DDC are those two energy slots.

[Just wanna play]

well first off who ever said that is an ***** since the D has more enrgy hard points (while ddc has more missile hard points) and can actually zombie, so obviously ddc cant zombie better, but on to the build i would recommend doing this with your ammo
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9cf6ea2aaca3d39


isnt 40 leg armor a bit thin???
perhaps you could use er large laserz since your mech is already cool running and you are fire support, also just saying i prefer using smaller engines and no endo/ferro in bigger mechs, but thats just me since the bigger the mech the more wasted tonnage going at the same speed as a smaller mech, with both endo steel and a 325 engine you loss 7.5 tons of your 9.5 ton advantage over the highlander trying to go the same speed, at stock speeds you have a 9.5 ton advantage over the highlander so imo the bigger the mech the slower you should make it since the heavier the mech the less it will get out of an engine, my atlas still runs the 300 engine and its pretty nice

[Capt Jester]

Skinny Pete, on 08 July 2013 - 10:10 AM, said:

The RS does that better with 4LL and Gauss IMO.

In this meta.

Zed993, on 08 July 2013 - 09:59 AM, said:

Saying the D is not viable is certainly very harsh. While I do agree that generally the D-DC is a better variant than the other Atlai, both the D and RS can still hold their own and are solid 'mechs. Although I find playing any Atlas in the current PPC, AC/40, LRM meta rather painful.

Couple problems with your build. First of all you should switch that LRM ammo with the gauss in the leg. Having ammo in your torso is never a good idea if you can avoid it. Place it in the legs, arms, or head. Second, you aren't using the CT laser slots; yes you stated you aren't a brawler but you might still be forced into a brawl and having back-up lasers is always nice, especially for only 2 tons.

Swapped a ton of LRM ammo for gauss, placed LRM ammo in legs, and removed 3 DHS to swap the 2xLRM 10s out for a single LRM 20 + Artemis and added two medium lasers. You should find this acceptably hot for a fire support 'mech.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...75f5d81f5df8877

I don't personally like playing Atlai as support, I find their hardpoint placement is too unfocused and their weapons fire from too low on the torso to make it viable compared to other 'mechs like the Stalker that are perfectly built for fire support. I also can't stand having a gauss in my Atlas RT because it gets detonated so easily, I prefer to take Dual UAC/5 if I want ballistic range.

If you do want to run fire support though that build should do ya', all personal preference after all.

I use 2xLRM10 because I can chain fire them or double-fire them. It gives me better ammo management and the option to continuously pound an enemy with LRMs. And usually by the time I'm in a brawl, it's because the rest of my team is dead.

Hebdomas, on 08 July 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

In my opinion if you're not using the CT energy slots that the D offers you should be playing a DDC. As far as I can tell the only reason to play a D and not a DDC are those two energy slots.

I am currently saving up for another Atlas. I got the D when it was 50% off MC. I just finished Centurions, so I just have 2m right now.

Just wanna play, on 08 July 2013 - 10:14 AM, said:

well first off who ever said that is an ***** since the D has more enrgy hard points (while ddc has more missile hard points) and can actually zombie, so obviously ddc cant zombie better, but on to the build i would recommend doing this with your ammo
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...9cf6ea2aaca3d39


isnt 40 leg armor a bit thin???
perhaps you could use er large laserz since your mech is already cool running and you are fire support, also just saying i prefer using smaller engines and no endo/ferro in bigger mechs, but thats just me since the bigger the mech the more wasted tonnage going at the same speed as a smaller mech, with both endo steel and a 325 engine you loss 7.5 tons of your 9.5 ton advantage over the highlander trying to go the same speed, at stock speeds you have a 9.5 ton advantage over the highlander so imo the bigger the mech the slower you should make it since the heavier the mech the less it will get out of an engine, my atlas still runs the 300 engine and its pretty nice

40 leg armor is just fine. People don't generally try to leg Atlai and I've never been legged in it. THey usually go for the torso since that's where the firepower is.

Edited by Capt Jester, 08 July 2013 - 10:17 AM.

[Just wanna play]

Hebdomas, on 08 July 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

In my opinion if you're not using the CT energy slots that the D offers you should be playing a DDC. As far as I can tell the only reason to play a D and not a DDC are those two energy slots.

so um.... lets say that in reverse if you don't use the ecm and 3rd missile hard point of the ddc might as well just use the D since it will create the same build but is cheaper

[Agentpony]

Just wanna play, on 08 July 2013 - 10:16 AM, said:

so um.... lets say that in reverse if you don't use the ecm and 3rd missile hard point of the ddc might as well just use the D since it will create the same build but is cheaper

Except that one virtually never uses a DDC without the ECM. It wouldnt make sense even with a lot of missile builds.

Edited by Agentpony, 08 July 2013 - 10:34 AM.

[Selfish]

My problems with the build: You have 2 Energy fallback hardpoints in the CT that you didn't use. A bit too much ammo for the LRMs and too little for the Gauss--the stacks are badly placed. You can skim some armor off legs, but not ~2.7 tons of it. You're going to get legged and blow up.

I've never heard anyone badmouth the D. Maybe you're thinking of the AS7-K. The D is a solid, zombie capable mech in its own right.

If you wanted a non brawling Atlas you can try a 2xPPC+AC/20 build like this. Rely on the 2xPPC+AC/20 to deal your pinpoint damage. It's the same damage potential of an AC/40 Jager, but you need to aim two weapons systems. When the PPCs are too close to use you still have 42 damage alphas. Just try to avoid twist brawling.

[Wintersdark]

The DDC is a better mech. Even with sub par missiles and ECM not being what it was, ECM is still very useful to have. Particularly in an Atlas, where LRM's can really **** you up.

With that said, the D is absolutely viable. Viable doesn't mean the best, just that its usable and effective.

Too often in these sorts of games people get stuck into a mindset where "Not the best" = "garbage", and that's a pretty harmful viewpoint.

Given how arms are pretty lackluster right now and lrm racks don't need a lot of hard points, the D's only real disadvantage is no ECM - a disadvantage that doesn't particularly hurt Highlanders.

The D brings to the table a CT energy hard point. This is quite valuable, as it allows you to continue dealing damage even when severely damaged yourself. I've been zombies in my DDC a LOT of times, and wished for that last laser.

[Autobot9000]

UUh. Saying the D is bad is just none sense. Remember you can use the 1.5 tons, that you save from ECM for other things. When your D brawls a D-DC that D-DCs ECM doesnt help him winning vs you. Both of your AMS+current meta will make the extra SRMs not the biggest problem. Your extra lasers can hit the right spots, if you can aim right. I recommend you this super solid brawler:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...77bb040d09489fd

I am also convinced, that no matter what meta, your Atlas is not a supporter at all. He belongs in exactly one place and thats the first line as a brawler. No one needs your 600ish armor sitting at the back. Other mechs have a smaller profile and more mobility. They fill the role as a sniper better. Also remember, that you will OWN snipers, if you force them to brawl. It depends on you to force the brawl.

Edit:
Also your armor distribution looks super bad to me. You need far more armor at the front and fewer at the back. You compensate light harassment with piloting not with extra armor. My build above has IMO the exact right amount. Maybe you could even take out an additional 5 armor from the rear CT and put that into the front CT.

Edited by Autobot9000, 08 July 2013 - 11:02 AM.

[Hebdomas]

Just wanna play, on 08 July 2013 - 10:16 AM, said:

so um.... lets say that in reverse if you don't use the ecm and 3rd missile hard point of the ddc might as well just use the D since it will create the same build but is cheaper

Yes. If you have a DDC and you don't have ECM you might as well be using the D. In fact, two medium lasers in the CT of the D would do one more damage than a SRM 6 in the side torso of a DDC and the two medium lasers would allow you to zombie. The only downside would be the increased heat of two medium lasers over a SRM6.

[Buso Senshi Zelazny]

The D is Definitely viable. And follow Autobot9000's advice about armor, your Smurfy build has way too much on the rear. Shoot for 95-100 on the front CT, and 65-70 on the front side toros.

[Kin3ticX]

The battletech in me says (as a figure of speech) "The Atlas aint no atlas without an AC20". I drive my Atlas D stock+ with a STD 345 and get good damage regularly.
AS7-D+. Be a hater if you want but that doesnt change the fact that this game is 95 percent pilot and 5 percent mechlab. We cannot just hand each other builds and expect things to work out.

I used to drive the mix build DDC AS7-D-DC "brawler with reach" like most others but it lost most of its luster with the SRM nerf. Now that I think of it, I haven't driven my DDC in months.

Looks like all the problems with the OP's build has been covered by everyone

Edited by Kin3ticX, 08 July 2013 - 11:36 AM.

[TheCrazySteve]

It is not that the D isn't viable.The D just isn't as good as the RS and DDC.

If you are going the laser route, usually it is better to have the lasers on the arms since only an ***** will not try to get out of your firing arc, making the RS the superior choice usually.

If you aren't going the laser route, the ecm + third missile launcher is usually better.

End of the day, just run whatever you have fun with and fits your style. At 100 tons the difference won't be very noticeable in a public match, this isn't like comparing commando variants.

[Lefty Lucy]

I think this build is as viable as a brawling atlas gets in the current meta. I generally play with the LPLs and MLs on a single weapon group and have arm lock on a mouse key so I can do precision alphas. While LPLs are not generally a good weapon, the purpose they serve on this build is to maximize alpha damage to take advantage of the fact that alpha>>all currently. It might potentially be better with ERPPCs, but I think that having 3 weapon groups with 3 different shot velocities would not lend itself well to the "fire and twist" brawling style that atlases lend themselves to.

Edited by Lefty Lucy, 08 July 2013 - 11:46 AM.

[Autobot9000]

14 ammo on a AC20 never works for an atlas

[Lefty Lucy]

Autobot9000, on 08 July 2013 - 11:56 AM, said:

14 ammo on a AC20 never works for an atlas

It works just fine. Against a competent team you get killed fast, or your RT gets wrecked, anyways. If you spend all 14 shots and aren't dead yet you're probably winning that battle.

[SchwarzerPeter]

You need moar Gauz ammo

And you should put 2 ML in the CT, zombie ftw! Or an TAG+ML for the LRMs.

I switched a ton of LRM ammo for Gaus ammo and dropped 2 DHS for 2 ML: AS7-D

15 DHS still runs very cool with the Gaus. You could drop another DHS for more ammo if you like.

The Gaus is a very nice guns in the Atlas, especially on the larger maps. If it wouldn't be so fragile.

[Kin3ticX]

Autobot9000, on 08 July 2013 - 11:56 AM, said:

14 ammo on a AC20 never works for an atlas

yeah it does