65 replies to this topic

[SethAbercromby]

I've done a bit of experimenting on smurfy's for once I decide to give my founder's atlas a proper treatment. because I'm not feeling too comfortable in a pure brawler, I've done a bit of thinking how to adapt the Atlas's perfomace to my liking and this is what I came up with: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...23d23265410d80f

The downgrade from LRM20 to LRM10 made sense because the launcher is limited to only 10 tubes anyways so it allows for much better ammunition control at the sacrifice of fire rate. The ER Large Lasers and AC/10 can pick off enemies at long range while the medium lasers and SRM6s come into play once a enemy gets into medium to short range.

A few thoughts on the setup (asked by myself while working on the setup):

• Q: Doesn't this undermine what a Atlas is commonly used for?
  
• A: Yes and no. The Atlas is intended for heavy frontline combat. Being able to reach enemies at greater distance doesn't change that. In fact, a skilled pilot could actually put more pressure on enemies, allowing for greater coverage and ultimately drawing more fire onto itself.
  
• Q: If it comes to brawling, isn't this configuration too weak to keep up?
  
• A: The Atlas's greates wekness is it's own weight which results in very low cruising speed so people often prefer hard hitting weapons for short range encounters to prevent a more agile enemy from circling around, hoping to kill it in one clean alpha strike. The AC/20 does that best but the AC/10 with its higher rate of fire is more forgiving on a miss, trading the one-hit-kill for more reliability and range. But in the end, I've chosen it to open up some tonnage for the ER Large Lasers (which can also hit at short range but because of their heat generation, I would not reccomend to do so).
  
• Q: Speaking of which, what do you hope to achieve with the large Lasers and why the ER variant?
  
• A: The ER coice is up to discussion but ultimately, I chose it because it weights the same and has only slightly increased heat buildup compared to the Large Laser but can reach almost 50% further. Large Lasers are also great weapons that can reach enemies at a long distance. It puts pressure onto enemies that have to coose between retreating and retaliating, especially if they don't have some of their own. It'll either draw them into the fight where the mediums can put more fire into them or reatreat where they can't shoot back (maybe even causing them to back into their comrades which would be even more fun, especially if they are still in your line of fire).

[Void Angel]

"Atlai" is not a word. =)

[Hexenhammer]

The Atlas D sucks!

I guess I need to be that guy that slaps up a screen shot of 1304 damage in a D.

Luckily we're all saved because I'm not at my PC and I do t want to be that guy.

[Void Angel]

On a more serious note, Atlases are designed for direct heavy combat, not necessarily knife-range brawling. Because of the waist-level hardpoints on nearly all of its weapons, it performs very poorly as a sniper, but it doesn't follow that you simply have to use it only as a brawling face-hugger. So long as you are building your Atlas for direct combat at some range, you're at least trying to do it right. =)

That being said, I'd say that the LRM-10 is a questionable decision in this build, for a number of reasons. LRMs do best when they are able to saturate anti-missile systems, but the smaller launchers are simply unable to get that done in many cases. A cloud of LRMs also has the nearly universal effect of attracting fast heavies, mediums, and lights to your location - because they see LRMs, they're likely to crowd in to get inside the minimum range, and since your weaponry is mostly mid-to-long-ranged, that'll often make combat frustrating for you. Additionally, you're an Atlas, and no Atlas can ever be fast enough to dictate engagement ranges to the enemy. For these reasons and others, I'd suggest losing the LRM 10 and going to two SRM6's and adding Artemis - to better place your missiles when (not if) you find yourself fighting at close range.

PS: A word on ER Large Lasers. The difference in heat compared to regular lasers is deceptive, so be careful with them. If you put ERs on your Atlas (and I have,) you'll have to exercise careful heat discipline in close combat once your heat scale gets mostly full - because then your actions are limited by your cooling rate, not your overall heat capacity.

[SethAbercromby]

Void Angel, on 25 September 2013 - 02:08 PM, said:

On a more serious note, Atlases are designed for direct heavy combat, not necessarily knife-range brawling. Because of the waist-level hardpoints on nearly all of its weapons, it performs very poorly as a sniper, but it doesn't follow that you simply have to use it only as a brawling face-hugger. So long as you are building your Atlas for direct combat at some range, you're at least trying to do it right. =)

The weapons loadout is designed primarily for direct fire, but allows for more range flexibility. Yes, that's not what you'd usually expect an Atlas to do but not something I'd want to see happening to me.

Quote

That being said, I'd say that the LRM-10 is a questionable decision in this build, for a number of reasons. LRMs do best when they are able to saturate anti-missile systems, but the smaller launchers are simply unable to get that done in many cases. A cloud of LRMs also has the nearly universal effect of attracting fast heavies, mediums, and lights to your location - because they see LRMs, they're likely to crowd in to get inside the minimum range, and since your weaponry is mostly mid-to-long-ranged, that'll often make combat frustrating for you. Additionally, you're an Atlas, and no Atlas can ever be fast enough to dictate engagement ranges to the enemy. For these reasons and others, I'd suggest losing the LRM 10 and going to two SRM6's and adding Artemis - to better place your missiles when (not if) you find yourself fighting at close range.

Well a single AMS can only shoot down about 5 missiles of each salvo. So with an LRM 15 that is fired 10+5 you'd generally only have 5-8 of those hit (that is, if the AMS has trouble locking onto the 2nd salvo). Sure, they deplete the AMS faster but so do they depelte your LRM ammo pool. I'd say it's up to dicussion wether or not a LRM15 in a 10 tube launcher is a viable option. Using SRM6 with Artemis however would be an intelligent option. I am somewhat concerned with the upper launcher being set up with a ballistic angle for LRMs though.

Quote

PS: A word on ER Large Lasers. The difference in heat compared to regular lasers is deceptive, so be careful with them. If you put ERs on your Atlas (and I have,) you'll have to exercise careful heat discipline in close combat once your heat scale gets mostly full - because then your actions are limited by your cooling rate, not your overall heat capacity.

That would be one of the biggest concerns. But that's why we've got 2 Medium Lasers and one (now two) SRM6s. Firing those with some common sense will keep you at fairly low heat and you'll be able to sqeeze in one shot with the Large Lasers every now and then. To ER or not to ER is a lot of decision making and I am considering dropping the idea in favor of regular Large Lasers.

Edited by SethAbercromby, 25 September 2013 - 03:45 PM.

[Void Angel]

I eventually went back to normal large lasers on my D-DC, before scrapping the whole thing and going to a dedicated LB-X brawler setup - different chassis, of course, but I found that it was too hot for my playstyle.

As for the LRM v. AMS... that's kind of my point; the AMS will shoot down literally half of your LRM damage before you even account for cover and scatter - and you don't have Artemis or TAG. This means your spread and tracking are going to be far below average, and the whole weapon system will be neutralized if even one other person out of 12 is close enough to bring a second AMS to bear. I've found my personal preference to be no less than 30 LRMs, launched at the same time, to be effective - and you can't do that on any Atlas, because of the way the missile tubes function. I used to make do with 40 on my D-DC, until the missile nerfs and ECM hardpoint nerfs made the build nonviable.