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Catastrophic Core Conflagration


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Poll: Catastrophic core conflagration (39 member(s) have cast votes)

Should we add engine decompression?

  1. Yes (31 votes [79.49%])

    Percentage of vote: 79.49%

  2. No (8 votes [20.51%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.51%

Should the decompression cause physical damage to other mechs?

  1. yes (20 votes [51.28%])

    Percentage of vote: 51.28%

  2. no (19 votes [48.72%])

    Percentage of vote: 48.72%

Should the decompression cause ambient heat that will give all local mechs a healthy dose of heat

  1. Yes (13 votes [76.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 76.47%

  2. No (4 votes [23.53%])

    Percentage of vote: 23.53%

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#1 PenitentTangent

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Posted 09 July 2013 - 11:35 AM

You know what'd be cool? if a mech will sometimes explode violently.


-- I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT STOCKPOLING --

I fully understand that a fusion reactor cannot go critical like a fission reactor and cause a megaton sized explosion.

What I mean is rapid decompression of the engine.

The principle is this:

the average Fusion reactor core is extremely small. all it really is, is about a thimble of reactive plasma that is highly unstable and dense with energy. what is keeping it so tightly pact is a static electromagnetic barrier that prevents any thermal energy from escaping the plasma and dissipating on the interior walls of the engine.

now often times what happens when a fusion engine is destroyed, the energy converter is destroyed or the magnetic field fails and the thermal energy dissipates instantly into the interior walls. Nothing spectacular.

On very rare occasions, though, the engine's interior walls are breached. Note that the protective shields inside. a fusion reactor is extremely dense and extremely strong, so this would only happen when the mech in question takes a huge amount of direct fire in a short period of time (say, an AC/20 direct critical hit on the engine). I think it's reasonable that 5% of mechs die in such a manner.

Now, don't worry, your mech is built safer than that. There are safety systems that prevent the very hot and very unstable plasma from escaping the engine, so what would happen is the engine would heat up and melt over a few seconds. Still not very dangerous. Still not the explosion I'm talking about.

every once in a while, though, a mech will take a ridiculous amount of fire power in the final moments of life. And I'm talking like two AC/20 shots or eighty LRMs in the span of half a second. When such a high amount of damage is absorbed to the center torso, it often shreds the engine's outer components and puncture the core so quickly that the Safeguards cannot enact fast enough. The plasma (which is under tremendous pressure) will rapidly expand and flood out of the tiny hole in the interior wall.

The result looks something like this:

An Atlas is trapped with his back to a wall. his armor is gone and his internals are heavily damaged. He is surrounded by an entire lance of mechs, armed to the teeth with Large lasers, SRMs and various other weapons. He's not going down with out a fight and he opens fire with everything he's got. The enemy mechs courteously return fire. Four full alphas ram the atlas at once. The mech is shredded to pieces and the protective walls in the core are punctured. White hot plasma jets out of the Atlas's chest. The entire chest caves out, shooting superheated fire and high velocity shrapnel outwards in a cone shape, showering the attacking mechs. The lance of mechs all survive the event, but with a moderate amount of damage taken.

or the event could play out like this:

A Spider is fleeing from a stalker 3F in a straight line. The stalker is very sluggish, but he is fast enough to train his weapons onto the poor fellow. The spider attempts to Jump up to throw off his foe's weapons, but to no avail. The stalker fires four PPCs into the back of the Spider, which catastrophically damages the engine. The spider begin plummeting to the ground, but before he hits, the engine unleashes. The entire spider is blown apart by the ensuing release of energy.

Or maybe like this:

A thunderbolt is determinedly charging his way up a hill in a last ditch effort to make a difference in the fight. Near the top is a Madcat MKII with two heavy Gauss rifles trained on the valiant Thunderbolt. The thunderbolt fires his ppc in hopes to get a lucky hit on the Madcat before his ultimate and guaranteed death. The weapon hits the Madcat, only to anger the pilot. Both Heavy Gauss rifles fire. The Thunderbolt takes both 250 Kilogram rounds (550 pounds per shot) in the chest. The rounds exit through the back and continue some distance. In a flash (Pun much?) the thunderbolt is ripped in two by the explosion. Shrapnel is sent far and wide in an attractive umbrella pattern. Both halves of the thunderbolt are now molten white slag.


This my friends, is an interesting feature to add to mechs that makes sense and already exists in lore. It should honestly be a very rare occurrence, and the damage yield to other mechs should be pretty low, but it would be a kick *** visual. The destruction should be increased for every ton of ammo in the mech.

here's a link, look under fusion engine explosions.
http://www.sarna.net...Mech_Technology



thank you for devoting your time to my suggestion.

also, tooltip; Gauss rifles and other Armor-piercing ammunition should make this event much more likely.

EDIT: HottHedd had a brilliant idea. I'm going to modify the post accordingly

Edited by PenitentTangent, 14 July 2013 - 06:03 AM.


#2 Vox Scorpus

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Posted 10 July 2013 - 02:22 PM

Good idea as a visual effect but I'm not sure it should damage other close in mechs. Although it would add a new element to the game, making your death cause damage or even (if your lucky) kill another mech. I think most people wouldn't want to be penalized for killing a mech up close. That sure would stop those 9 small laser mech builds though. How about an explosion straight up that other mechs can see, in essence "marking" your death spot? At least I like the visuals about the deaths you described. They would look awesome. Much better than just falling over backwards!

#3 Dirus Nigh

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Posted 10 July 2013 - 02:27 PM

A bright flash and a jet of flame would be cool. It should also happen only when an engine it taken out very quickly. IE if three engine crits happen at once.

Ammo explosions need sound and visual effects.

There should never be damage done to other units. Sound and visual only.

Oh and the plasma inside the engine is held with in a vacuum, it cannot be decompressed.

Edited by Dirus Nigh, 10 July 2013 - 02:29 PM.


#4 Nothing Whatsoever

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Posted 10 July 2013 - 09:59 PM

The damage to others mech though should be very low, like a flamer, but the event of a sudden breach should look spectacular.

#5 Typhoon Storm 2142

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Posted 10 July 2013 - 11:21 PM

Quote

You know what'd be cool? if a mech will sometimes explode violently.


No. Damage to other 'Mechs by reactor explosions will stop brawlers from brawling and make them go sniping. We don't need further encouragements to become a sneaky chicken sniper. If every 3rd 'Mech blows up next to me, even without taking damage, you can bet that I won't ever walk closely to anyone again. I'll just pack some PPC's and keep using that rock over there to stay hidden and harrass you.

Reactor meltdowns are a stupid idea. It is Stackpoling, despite you claiming that it's not. And it's not new, there are like hundred threads already, about this lame topic. Stop posting the same old s-h-i-t again and again. You're not original...you're lazy.

Edited by Typhoon Storm 2142, 10 July 2013 - 11:30 PM.


#6 PenitentTangent

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 08:30 PM

View PostDirus Nigh, on 10 July 2013 - 02:27 PM, said:

Oh and the plasma inside the engine is held with in a vacuum, it cannot be decompressed.


yes it can. what you are thinking of is decontract, which cannot happen in a vacuum.

besides, even if it couldn't, decompression would take the form of the plasma (which is a gas) violently escaping.

Edited by PenitentTangent, 12 July 2013 - 08:30 PM.


#7 PenitentTangent

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Posted 12 July 2013 - 08:33 PM

View PostTyphoon Storm 2142, on 10 July 2013 - 11:21 PM, said:


No. Damage to other 'Mechs by reactor explosions will stop brawlers from brawling and make them go sniping. We don't need further encouragements to become a sneaky chicken sniper. If every 3rd 'Mech blows up next to me, even without taking damage, you can bet that I won't ever walk closely to anyone again. I'll just pack some PPC's and keep using that rock over there to stay hidden and harrass you.

Reactor meltdowns are a stupid idea. It is Stackpoling, despite you claiming that it's not. And it's not new, there are like hundred threads already, about this lame topic. Stop posting the same old s-h-i-t again and again. You're not original...you're lazy.


okay thank you for not reading my full post and for disregarding what Stackpoling is and what my recommendation is or observing the significant diference between the two. or looking at the link which explains it in much more detail.

I also think you have stackpoling and reactor meltdowns confused.

A reactor meltdown is where a reactor, through one means or another, creates too much heat because it is burning more of it's fuel than it should. This causes the protective materials to get degraded, melted, destroyed, warped, or harmed in any way that eventually causes a reactor to release it's noxious materials and harmful gamma rays. It's nigh impossible to do this with a fusion reactor, but extremely easy to do with a fission reactor.

Stackpoling has a similar beginning as the protective materials are damaged somehow, but the event causes a rapid chain reaction in the core to cause all of the fuel to be consumed in a fraction of a second and the energy is released in a violent fashion. This is similar to a nuclear explosion.

stackpoling is impossible to do with a fusion reactor. In fission reactors, this is known as prompt critical. Not critical, mind you. In movies when people say "The reactor is going critical!" that means the reactor is working how it's supposed to. totally normal and relatively safe. Prompt critical though means you don't even have enough time to announce it is going prompt critical. Prompt critical events are so unlikely in a nuclear reactor that it is one of the least considered risks. The only time it really happens is when a nuclear bomb goes off.

a fusion reactor's form of going prompt critical is turning off. completely harmless.

Also, all your problems that you mentioned can be solved by simply not adding the damage mechanic, which I added as a choice for good measure when I posted. If people wanted it to be purely cosmetic, than it should be.

Edited by PenitentTangent, 14 July 2013 - 05:57 AM.


#8 Aznpersuasion89

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Posted 13 July 2013 - 05:33 PM

i like the idea. were all playing a game were we walk around in big stompy robots. why cant we have some awesome visuals to go with our uber death? and the chance of it happening is low enough not to scare anyone but enough to make it exciting.

#9 Hotthedd

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Posted 13 July 2013 - 05:35 PM

I do not think it should cause damage to other mechs, as that mechanic could be abused, but it would make sense if it caused a heat effect in a certain radius.

#10 Dark Shaman of Clan Ghost Bear

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Posted 13 July 2013 - 06:18 PM

My only concern would be damaging Friendly Mechs while 'sploding.
Be prepared for some hefty XP and Credit losses. :)

#11 PenitentTangent

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Posted 14 July 2013 - 06:00 AM

View PostDark Shaman of Clan Ghost Bear, on 13 July 2013 - 06:18 PM, said:

My only concern would be damaging Friendly Mechs while 'sploding.
Be prepared for some hefty XP and Credit losses. :D


I think that if there is a damage mechanic, It shouldn't count as friendly fire. That's just mean.

View PostHotthedd, on 13 July 2013 - 05:35 PM, said:

I do not think it should cause damage to other mechs, as that mechanic could be abused, but it would make sense if it caused a heat effect in a certain radius.


Brilliant idea!

#12 Vox Scorpus

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Posted 14 July 2013 - 02:18 PM

View PostHotthedd, on 13 July 2013 - 05:35 PM, said:

I do not think it should cause damage to other mechs, as that mechanic could be abused, but it would make sense if it caused a heat effect in a certain radius.


Yeah I think that a heat effect would be the way to go! Great idea Hotthedd!

#13 Pinselborste

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Posted 14 July 2013 - 02:29 PM

would be great for visuals.

other things i would like to see is if you kill a mech by legging him for example that the last leg to get destroyed can get ripped off completely.
or a mech with 10 or even 15 tons of ammo actually exploding.

Edited by Pinselborste, 14 July 2013 - 02:30 PM.


#14 Urfin

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Posted 14 July 2013 - 04:15 PM

Yes, and such engine failures should absolutely shred the surrounding populace. Headshot by half-molten mech arm lodged in your cockpit, dripping white-hot slag onto the ashpile that was you ^)

#15 Team Leader

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 09:50 PM

Shrapnel and explosions pls

#16 WonderSparks

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 10:01 PM

I support big 'Mechs that go boom. :( 'Nuff said.

#17 Gaan Cathal

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Posted 24 July 2013 - 11:30 PM

View PostDirus Nigh, on 10 July 2013 - 02:27 PM, said:

Oh and the plasma inside the engine is held with in a vacuum, it cannot be decompressed.


Presuming for a moment that fusion reactors do use vacuum containment (which is..physically impossible, but hey-ho Sarna says so), what do you think happens when you have plasma or gas compressed in a vacuum container and the container is breached? That's right! Decompression.


View PostPenitentTangent, on 12 July 2013 - 08:33 PM, said:


A reactor meltdown is where a reactor, through one means or another, creates too much heat because it is burning more of it's fuel than it should. This causes the protective materials to get degraded, melted, destroyed, warped, or harmed in any way that eventually causes a reactor to release it's noxious materials and harmful gamma rays. It's nigh impossible to do this with a fusion reactor, but extremely easy to do with a fission reactor.


Not possible. At all. What is possible is for lithium coolant to be released if the external cooling system is breached (which it has to be for the plasma vessel to be breached) and it would be highly likely to fireball since it's ultra-flammable. Thus, massive gouts of flame coming out of a mech that gets cored is both visually cool and realistic. It doing AoE damage is ******** of course, but you did add an exclusion aspect for that, I'm aware.

Edited by Gaan Cathal, 24 July 2013 - 11:34 PM.


#18 HeavyRain

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 01:09 PM

I approve of this thread for using the word "conflagration" in the title.
Also, I believe it would be a great visual effect, as long as my FPS didn't drop to single digits. Add a little shake from the shock wave too.

#19 Wolf Ender

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 02:49 PM

i know all of you guys out there are nuclear physicists...congrats to you, you're soooo smart and you can probably tell me all about how this would not happen in real life and blah blah you know what, IDGAF

In MW4 one of the coolest things ever was when you kill a mech and he explodes and causes splash damage all over everyone in the furball ....or when you know you're about to go down and you use your last ditch effort to dive into the enemy's lines and end up taking one of the ******** with you. i don't care how you justify it with fluff or science... just put it in the freaking game it's just too cool not to have :)

#20 Mazaraz

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Posted 26 July 2013 - 08:50 AM

if all of the accompanying causes are met then i would enjoy watching mechs ripped asunder by decompression, or going up in flames/melting into slag. that fission/fussionable material doesn't just cease to exist when the mech dies. there should at least be a 'hot spot' around the dead mech. For the mech that was just firing and moving to just go completely cold in a matter of seconds is a bit far fetched.





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