75 replies to this topic

[B B Wolfe]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:11 PM, said:

I read it and I addressed that in my first post in this thread. So there ya have it, it's a failure on both NGNG's and PGI's fault for not knowing the original rules for jumping in BT.

What I said in the podcast applied to THIS GAME. I am sorry you did not make the connection.

[James The Fox Dixon]

B B Wolfe, on 12 July 2013 - 01:12 PM, said:

What I said in the podcast applied to THIS GAME. I am sorry you did not make the connection.

This game based off of the TT game... I'm sorry that you failed to make the connection about how JJs work in the BT universe.

[B B Wolfe]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

This game based off of the TT game... I'm sorry that you failed to make the connection about how JJs work in the BT universe.

That's really cute.

[James The Fox Dixon]

Wingbreaker, on 12 July 2013 - 01:11 PM, said:

That rule does not preclude a running jump within the hex. In fact, it fits entirely within what it describes. Mechs must be standing AT THE START of the turn to jump.

Or, well, Perhaps we should stop trying to rules lawyer when it's a translated feature in the first place.

Actually it does since there are four movement modes that you can use, but you cannot combine them into a single movement phase. They are standing, walking, running, and jumping. At the beginning of your movement phase you select the movement you want to do and you can only use that one type of movement. To do what you are suggesting requires the combination of running and jumping movement modes which is illegal under the rules.

[Wingbreaker]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:18 PM, said:

Actually it does since there are four movement modes that you can use, but you cannot combine them into a single movement phase. They are standing, walking, running, and jumping. At the beginning of your movement phase you select the movement you want to do and you can only use that one type of movement. To do what you are suggesting requires the combination of running and jumping movement modes which is illegal under the rules.

I'm well aware of the movement modes within movement turn, what I'm saying is that nothing precludes the mech in REAL TERMS of moving within that 30M hex. What you are arguing over is a technical definition for a game system, which is then being translated.

Explain how jumpjets, even vectored, at the rear of a mech are going to jump backwards?

[James The Fox Dixon]

Wingbreaker, on 12 July 2013 - 01:23 PM, said:

I'm well aware of the movement modes within movement turn, what I'm saying is that nothing precludes the mech in REAL TERMS of moving within that 30M hex. What you are arguing over is a technical definition for a game system, which is then being translated.

Explain how jumpjets, even vectored, at the rear of a mech are going to jump backwards?

I am explaining how things work in Battletech and there is no running jumps there. I didn't write the rules nor the fluff on how things work, but I can clearly read what was originally written down as a guide for my decision making.

The equipment for the generation of jump jet thrust is mounted in the legs and torsos of the mech. However, there are nozzles placed about the mech that vector the thrust through them. Much like a Harrier jump jet has the thrust generation for its jump jets in the center of the fuselage it has separate nozzles for where the thrust is directed.

Beyond that, I don't have to explain how it all works in BT since it is not my universe that I created. I'm also not a public figure, but you can bet your bottom dollar that when presented with contrary facts I apologize for my error instead of getting self-righteous like y'all are.

Edited by James The Fox Dixon, 12 July 2013 - 01:39 PM.

[Wingbreaker]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:36 PM, said:

The equipment for the generation of jump jet thrust is mounted in the legs and torsos of the mech. However, there are nozzles placed about the mech that vector the thrust through them.Much like a Harrier jump jet has the thrust generation for its jump jets in the center of the fuselage it has separate nozzles for where the thrust is directed.

Wat.



Nozzels?


Internal diagram, no nozzles.



Even on modern interpretations, non existent.

For a rules lawyer, you're interpreting pretty hard here.

[Bluetavius]

All Mechwarrior games are apocryphal, and thus the jets can be any way they damn well please.

Thus making ALL arguments invalid

Good day

[James The Fox Dixon]

Wingbreaker, on 12 July 2013 - 01:47 PM, said:

Wat.



Nozzels?


Internal diagram, no nozzles.



Even on modern interpretations, non existent.

For a rules lawyer, you're interpreting pretty hard here.

For a writer for a podcast, you're defending an erroneous statement pretty hard here. You also show that y'all cannot do proper research nor can you admit to a mistake that you've made. This gives me another reason to not listen to your podcasts since you cannot get a simple fact right from the BT universe.

BT isn't my universe and the drawings you referenced are just interpretations of some artist about what is written. It does not make it correct. Whereas, the rules and the lore are correct and canon in regards to how jump jets function in the universe. Got a problem with it? Take it up with Catalyst Games since they're in charge of BT now.

[B B Wolfe]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:53 PM, said:

For a writer for a podcast, you're defending an erroneous statement pretty hard here. You also show that y'all cannot do proper research nor can you admit to a mistake that you've made. This gives me another reason to not listen to your podcasts since you cannot get a simple fact right from the BT universe.

BT isn't my universe and the drawings you referenced are just interpretations of some artist about what is written. It does not make it correct. Whereas, the rules and the lore are correct and canon in regards to how jump jets function in the universe. Got a problem with it? Take it up with Catalyst Games since they're in charge of BT now.

The statement about how MWO currently interprets jumpjets?

Edited by B B Wolfe, 12 July 2013 - 01:55 PM.

[Cattra Kell]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 11:00 AM, said:

Then the NGNG staff have to play the TT or at least have an understanding of the source material to do proper reporting. Either way, this is a failure on their part.

>Then the NGNG staff have to play the TT or at least have an understanding of the source material to do proper reporting. Either way, this is a failure on their part.
>Then the NGNG staff have to play the TT or at least have an understanding of the source material to do proper reporting.
>Then the NGNG staff have to play the TT or at least have an understanding of the source material
>NGNG staff have to play the TT

[Bluetavius]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:53 PM, said:

BT isn't my universe and the drawings you referenced are just interpretations of some artist about what is written

Some of those are TRO art, and thus not "interpretations", but how the damn thing looks

[James The Fox Dixon]

Cattra Kell, on 12 July 2013 - 01:55 PM, said:

>Then the NGNG staff have to play the TT or at least have an understanding of the source material to do proper reporting. Either way, this is a failure on their part.
>Then the NGNG staff have to play the TT or at least have an understanding of the source material to do proper reporting.
>Then the NGNG staff have to play the TT or at least have an understanding of the source material
>NGNG staff have to play the TT

<Snip>

Then why did you let an error like this get through? Why are you defending an error of how canon describes jump jets working? Show us in the canon that a mech takes a running jump? How can a mech run backwards and still jump if running jumps are valid since a mech running backwards moves at half speed and not enough momentum would be built up?

Bluetavius, on 12 July 2013 - 01:56 PM, said:

Some of those are TRO art, and thus not "interpretations", but how the damn thing looks

TRO art is an interpretation of what these fictional mechs look like. They may not be correct on all of the details and never were meant to be blueprints for them.

Edited by James The Fox Dixon, 12 July 2013 - 02:00 PM.

[Bluetavius]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:58 PM, said:

TRO art is an interpretation of what these fictional mechs look like. They may not be correct on all of the details and never were meant to be blueprints for them.

just....

facepalm...

"quote on arguing on the internet"

[B B Wolfe]

James The Fox Dixon, on 12 July 2013 - 01:58 PM, said:

Then why did you let an error like this get through? Why are you defending an error of how canon describes jump jets working?



TRO art is an interpretation of what these fictional mechs look like. They may not be correct on all of the details and never were meant to be blueprints for them.

Demonstrating yet again that you seem to have missed the part where I was talking about how they work in MWO.

[Cybermech]

James seems your missing a few points,
yes you are right some vertical trust is needed.
yes you are right that the lagshield/hover situation with JJ's is not the best.
but there are something your really missing.

If you have ever seen the alpha video done a long time ago, there was directional trust in game.
By the time beta was in it was removed. why? can only guess it was just crazy lagshield for the pilot with JJ's.

Wingbreaker is a TT nerd and is not right all the time.
Normally when he is wrong its cause of 1 mech or an easy slip up.

However the biggest thing you are seeming to be missing is the fact that its not TT.
It is a game and movement of your mech making you go further makes sense to me.
The idea that you guys are the only TT nerds out there and that NONE of the hardcore nutters are not in NGN, PGI or IGP.
Not 1?

If your thoughts were correct you wouldn't have to dance around the obvious or take things out of context to prove your point.

[Wingbreaker]

/I don't write the podcast.
//Damn you, cyber.

[Sean Lang]

@James... so you took Luara's opinion and made it the stance of NGNG? IRconfused...

I want forward momentum, vector ability. And yes I've played more TT than most, but I've always played allot of Mechwarrior.

That being said, methinks JJ's will probably be tweaked a bit in the future.

[B B Wolfe]

Sean Lang, on 12 July 2013 - 02:24 PM, said:

@James... so you took Luara's opinion and made it the stance of NGNG? IRconfused...

I want forward momentum, vector ability. And yes I've played more TT than most, but I've always played allot of Mechwarrior.

That being said, methinks JJ's will probably be tweaked a bit in the future.

All I said was that it doesn't exist in game at present.

[Cybermech]

wow sean, its nice to see you but now I know her name.
baby I'm coming to you.....................