1 reply to this topic

[Gaan Cathal]

There are a number of very good suggestions around these forums to solve the current problem where it's overly easy to concentrate large pinpoint damage spikes on individual compartments. The general problem with this, however, is the level of complexity involved in these solutions, which lower their chances of being implemented.

Hopefully this fix will be easy to implement. It involves exploiting the current convergence setup rather than changing it, since the latter is unlikely to happen per:

miSs, on 12 July 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

Answer from Paul: Weapon convergence is a tough nut to crack. We want to keep the number of random “dice rolls” to a minimum, and network synchronization can become unpredictable when trying to determine a convergence point that may or may not be moving. It will be necessary to make the convergence point calculation server authoritative and that can cause a desync due to the fact that the simulation runs at different frequencies on the server and client.

So, actually changing convergence substantially is unlikely at this point. I.e. it will remain instantaneous.

With that in mind, I'm suggesting the following:

Make the range of dynamic convergence the range to targeted mech. When there is no target, use a fixed convergence point (if it's possible to have different convergence points, use the optimal of the weapons).

What this will do is:

a: mean that to really concentrate damage on a single point you'll need the enemy mech targeted
b: mean ECM, BAP and TAG have an effect beyond missile play
c: minimise the effect of MW:O's "falloff" range extension to bring in the ranges slightly, making it a little more like TT/Prior MW games

- At long range, actually hitting the target without having them locked will be difficult.
- At brawling ranges, it's likely that hitting the target without lock will be easy enough, but a degree of spread will be inherent unless the target is at the 'natural' convergence distance.

Edited by Gaan Cathal, 14 July 2013 - 12:04 PM.

[Fire and Salt]

I think that will just make ECM more powerful, in addition to punishing new players who haven't gotten accustomed to pressing the target key all the time. I hate that we need to "FIX" this issue as it never really bothers me (FYI - I don't boat PPCs or AC20s - not because I feel "cheap" doing so, but because I have BETTER configs.)
Anyways, if we MUST fix this...

Fire and Salt, on 14 July 2013 - 04:20 AM, said:

I have a suggestion that:

•Doesn't add an unrealistic heat penalty.
•Doesn't add any random factor that takes away from player skill.
•Would be fairly easy to implement
•Treats the "AC40 issue" identically to the "6PPC issue" because it doesn't rely on heat.
•Has a plausible physical explanation.
•Seems lore friendly. ("I have 6ML-and-1LL because 8ML magically makes extraheat... that doesn't make sense sorry.)


Here it is:
Whenever PlayerA does more than 20 damage to a specific panel of PlayerB within a half second window, some of that damage is transferred to adjacent sections. I recommend that all damage over 20 is dealt at 50% to the hit panel. So 40 damage = 20 + 10 to the hit panel and 10 elsewhere. This ONLY applies to armor. We will say that this happens because a very large impact places physical stress through the surface of the armor, and some of that stress is transferred to adjacent locations.
The limit of 20 is perfectly matched to the AC20 - the most powerful weapon in the game - which will place all of its damage into 1 location still - as long as they are fired one at a time (such as the individual dice rolls in the classic game)

Ex:
2PPC to CT - 20 damage to CT
3PPC to CT - 25 damage to CT, 2.5 damage to LT, 2.5 Damage to RT
4PPC to CT (Or 2 AC20s) - 30 damage to CT, 5 damage to LT, 5 Damage to RT
6PPC to CT - 40 damage to CT, 10 damage to LT, 10 damage to RT

Now this would only apply to armor - not to internals. Armor would transfer to nearby armor, but NOT to nearby internals. If the panel that it is supposed to transfer to is gone the damage stays where it hit. So lets say my LT is stripped of all armor, and do the same examples:
2PPC to CT - 20 damage to CT
3PPC to CT - 27.5 damage to CT, 0 damage to LT, 2.5 Damage to RT
4PPC to CT (Or 2 AC20s) - 35 damage to CT, 0 damage to LT, 5 Damage to RT
6PPC to CT - 50 damage to CT, 0 damage to LT, 10 damage to RT



I also recommend never damaging a panel to by more than 25% of its current health nor bring it below 5 total health (tunable numbers) with this transfer. Lets say there is a big crack in the LT - the force from a CT hit wont damage the portion to the left of the crack, only the portion to the right of the crack which is connected more solidly to the CT. For example:
A mech has 50 armor left on its CT, 40 left on its RT, and 10 left on its LT.

2PPC to CT - 20 damage to CT
3PPC to CT - 25 damage to CT, 2.5 damage to LT, 2.5 Damage to RT
4PPC to CT (Or 2 AC20s) - 32.5 damage to CT, 2.5 damage to LT, 5 Damage to RT
6PPC to CT - 47.5 damage to CT, 2.5 damage to LT, 10 damage to RT



Damage Transfer Panels:
CT: LT & RT (25% of extra each)
LT: CT (50% of extra)
RT: CT (50% of extra)
Rear CT: Rear LT & Rear RT (25% of extra each)
Rear LT: Rear CT (50% of extra)
Rear RT: Rear CT (50% of extra)
Head: does not apply since the head cannot have 20 points of armor.

Arms could be a special case - they are not connected by armor skin to any other panel, so the damage should not transfer to other armor. However, the stress might damage the internal structure. So lets say 50% of the extra can go to the internal structure, but never bring it below 25% of its TOTAL health (tunable number) How does this help? Well, the armor will protect the weapons from critical hits, but the internal structure simply holds the weapons. So if I have 40 points of arm armor, and you hit me with a 40 point alpha, it would be 20 + 10 damage to the Armor, and 10 damage to the internals. This way I have 10 armor and 10 internal left, instead of 0 armor and 20 internal left. It will now take at least 20 damage to destroy a weapon with 10 health, as opposed to just 10 damage as it is with the current system.


The legs could be similar to the arms, except that they would transfer 25% to their own internal structure, 10% to the corresponding torso, and 15% to the CT internals. The same safeguards would be in place to protect the "transferred to" locations - bearing in mind that this damage doesn't "disappear" - if it can't go elsewhere, it simply stays in the place that it's originally dealt to.