25 replies to this topic

[Foxfire]

The AC is supposed to be a weapon that fires a number of rounds dependent upon the 'size' of the weapon.

I think that it would be beneficial to the game if AC's were changed to fire a stream instead of frontloading damage as a single shot.

Two effects of this being that a miss is not as punishing but it takes more skill to effectively utilize.

This will address the issue of the AC/40 mechs by removing the 'ease' of use of these types of weapons.

Granted, it is probably far too late to make these type of core weapon changes...

[Escef]

So, turn it into a delayed hit scan weapon? Yeah, that won't feel too much like lasers, right?

[Foxfire]

Would make the easier to handle balance wise and that is how they are supposed to function in the first place.

[Escef]

Foxfire, on 14 July 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

Would make the easier to handle balance wise and that is how they are supposed to function in the first place.

It may be how they are described in the original TT fluff, but they have never been able to walk fire across a target in TT game play. Saying that this is how they are "supposed" to function isn't an assertion that can be reliably backed up.

[BillyM]

I tend to think so. ...make it feel more like the novels...

--billyM

[Foxfire]

Escef, on 14 July 2013 - 02:38 PM, said:

It may be how they are described in the original TT fluff, but they have never been able to walk fire across a target in TT game play. Saying that this is how they are "supposed" to function isn't an assertion that can be reliably backed up.

Limitations on the TT ruleset... because, you know.. it wouldn't really be fun to make someone sporting an AC/20 role hit location on all 20 shots.

[Durahl]

Wouldn't mind if they gave it a try... I mean look at the weapons we have right now.


We have Rockets that depending on the size of the Launcher are either fired all at once, in packs or even single every 3-4sec.
We have Lasers that fire ~1sec every 2-4sec.
We have PPCs that fire a shot every 4sec.
We have ACs that fire slower the larger the caliber goes starting from like 0.5sec up to like 4sec.
We have Gauss Cannons that fire a single shot ~3sec.

Dunno about you guys but it ends all with a rather large delay before another shot can be fired leaving me with the impression that right now the variety on weapons that allow you to pull the trigger to spew out a continuous stream of hurt is rather disappointing.

The only 3 things in the game that behave like that are MGs, the AMS and the TAG Laser and two of them don't really count as weapons.

[Escef]

Durahl, on 14 July 2013 - 03:40 PM, said:

The only 3 things in the game that behave like that are MGs, the AMS and the TAG Laser and two of them don't really count as weapons.

I take it you've never seen a Jager or 4X phract boating small bore ACs in chain-fire mode? Or twin UAC5 in chain-fire?

[Narcissistic Martyr]

Some AC fire many rounds in a very short burst and some fire relatively few rounds. What they have in common is that they all land full damage on their target in a single blast. If they didn't they'd be 100% inferior to lasers, PPCs, and Gauss Rifles.

[Voidsinger]

Autocannons have never been rated by calibre. Rather, they have always been rated by damage capability, with smaller calibre weapons firing at an increased rate of fire. Machine guns covered calibres up to 25mm in Battletech originally, with autocannons traditionally being in the 30-120mm range.

That said, it is a feature which could be implemented (eventually). However, there are a great many issues which could and should take precedence.

Implementation would most likely be in breaking weapons down by manufacturer. Easy enough to do, once you have a player base familiar with the basic game concepts and can accept the added complexity.

[Hyperlynx]

I'd rather they improve the quality of MWO in its own right than try to make it closer to the descriptions in the tabletop game.

[Xeren KelDar]

Foxfire, on 14 July 2013 - 03:35 PM, said:

Limitations on the TT ruleset... because, you know.. it wouldn't really be fun to make someone sporting an AC/20 role hit location on all 20 shots.

They wouldn't have. If it was a scatter weapon it would work like missiles and incidentally like the LBX autocannons when firing cluster rounds. Fluff is all over for autocannons with firing mechanisms being different due to manufacures, but in implementation in TT autocannons were all pinpoint weapons except for the LBX variants with cluster ammo.

Edited by Xeren KelDar, 14 July 2013 - 09:36 PM.

[Thumper3]

Foxfire, on 14 July 2013 - 03:35 PM, said:

Limitations on the TT ruleset... because, you know.. it wouldn't really be fun to make someone sporting an AC/20 role hit location on all 20 shots.

Are you INSANE? I drool at night in my pillow about rolling 20 to hits at once!! What's the use of having 1612 dice if you can't use each one every game session.......

[Carrioncrows]

Foxfire, on 14 July 2013 - 01:20 PM, said:

The AC is supposed to be a weapon that fires a number of rounds dependent upon the 'size' of the weapon.

I think that it would be beneficial to the game if AC's were changed to fire a stream instead of frontloading damage as a single shot.

Two effects of this being that a miss is not as punishing but it takes more skill to effectively utilize.

This will address the issue of the AC/40 mechs by removing the 'ease' of use of these types of weapons.

Granted, it is probably far too late to make these type of core weapon changes...

First off, No it's not.

Read up on your history.

The AC is a generic weapon and the actual weapons whether be a AC2, AC5, AC10, AC20 are not all equal. There are thousands if different designs.

Some ac's fire 1 large bore bullet, others fire off entire streams of bullets. They are grouped according to their damage they do, not how they do it.

So yes we could have an AC20 that deals a full 20 dmg over the course of 4-20 shots like a buzz saw and it is still considered an AC20. But there is also the one AC20 that's the 200m short bore that deals it all in one shot.

Would it be nice to try these different types? YES.

But do go throwing everything to the wolves in your clumping.

[MisterPlanetarian]

This is not only canon but probably essential to balance AC vs Gauss.

This is not mentioning things like clan Ultra AC 10/20 etc

[CDLord HHGD]

Don't touch my AC/20.

[Tennex]

there are rotary ACs that do this though.

Plus UAC is supposed to be stream fire according to lore. But inorder to do that PGI would have to reduce TT damage, and increase TT firerate for the UACs.

Even with double tap UACs do not fire at the 700bullet/minute rate a 3 barrel rotary gun should fire at.

Edited by Tennex, 15 July 2013 - 05:43 AM.

[Durahl]

Escef, on 14 July 2013 - 05:17 PM, said:

I take it you've never seen a Jager or 4X phract boating small bore ACs in chain-fire mode? Or twin UAC5 in chain-fire?

I'd like to have that high rate of fire with one weapon alone, not the entire Mech sporthing half a dozen.

Something like this:


Keep the damage over time the same, increase the rate of fire and increase the ammunition accordingly and we've got something totally new to play with.

Heck... You could probably even decrease the damage a little as I suggest ppl would hit stuff more often with a RoF like that.

[LoveLost85]

no.

[3rdworld]

Sure, lets just cement Gauss and PPCs being superior to AC/s.