26 replies to this topic

[NRP]

pulupulu, on 24 July 2013 - 08:25 AM, said:

However what I take away from this list is that victor can force and take advantage of a good situation much better than say... an awesome...

I'm quoting this for emphasis.

[XX Sulla XX]

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Again, the TOP TEN are not the average.You can't take the TOP TEN of anything as good comparable data. They are outliers.

You really can. This is a lot like car racing. The top few drivers will be able to get the most out of the car. This will give you a good idea about what car is better. What the tournament shows us is the Atlas, Highlander and Stalker are really very close. That is they are all good mechs. With the Awsome falling behind.

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The Victor also is not easier to pilot than an Atlas. May be Easier for YOU, but not for all. And the ELO of someone stating in a new weight class is the middle. They aren't starting off playing the dregs, but other new players and those that really are average.

Maybe but I know the Atlas is very hard to pilot well and is unforgiving. Even more so before they had seismic. You have to be very good tactically in an Atlas because you tend not to get a second chance. But in a Victor running say 85kph and with jump jets you can recover from a mistake many times.

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I don't participate in the tournaments as they are really a joke. Individual scores in a team setup..... Just like ELO, the concept is broken. If you want ELO and tournaments to mean something then they have to fit. If they want Individual scores, then free for all tournaments. If they want team tournaments, then team scores (Only score for the same 4 people dropping count). My ELO is dependent on the 7 other people I get dropped with. That's not a real way to compute my skill level of an individual.

By the way I do agree the Victor could work better for pugging than in teams. Not saying it is the case but only that it is possible. I just do not play enough on teams to know for sure.

[NRP]

RussianWolf, on 24 July 2013 - 08:47 AM, said:

My ELO is dependent on the 7 other people I get dropped with. That's not a real way to compute my skill level of an individual.

This is a team game, not an individual game. ELO is not intended to determine your individual skill. All that matters is the team's success. Individual skill is only relevant in so far as how well it contributes to the team's success. If you're losing a lot, perhaps your individual skill isn't as useful to your team as your ego would have you believe?

[pulupulu]

General Taskeen, on 24 July 2013 - 09:06 AM, said:

I guarantee the Awesome would be at Atlas level if the 3D Model was skinnier, and that portion of the CT was shaved down flat, and over all adjustment of hit-boxes.

I honestly don't believe fixing the CT alone would fix awesome.

Awesome's problem is that it get into the same mess as atlas with less armor, nearly same speed, less weapon via weight and crap hard point... and of course easier to hit CT. Fixing only the CT size, you get an atlas with 20 ton less, nearly same speed, less armor and less weapon via weight and crap hard point. Still no reason to take an awesome. Only 9m and PB might benefit a little from harder to hit CT... just a little.

IMO the only way to fix awesome is give it better hard point with bigger engine. Other wise pick a victor for JJ.

One would take highlander over atlas is for JJ.
One would take stalker over highlander or atlas is for better hard point.
One would stay atlas most likely for ECM and 100 ton.

Taking an awesome for better torso and arm twisting angle? Other mech can turn to the same direction too, just move their leg a little.

Edited by pulupulu, 24 July 2013 - 07:36 PM.

[ArmandTulsen]

XX Sulla XX, on 22 July 2013 - 06:06 PM, said:

I thought we talked about keeping this a secret haha.

I was one of those poor fools who had no idea how amazing the Victor is, until I gave it a second try.Best decision I've made in this game, thus far.And no, I'm not on the Gauss+PPC train (just the K uses Gauss and one ER PPC ). I primarily use the AC/20 with a PPC/ER PPC and SRMs. Thing is a ******* monster.

[xRatas]

Correlates rather directly with my impression on popularity of the mechs. I'd list them at that order if I had to make guess about their numbers in matches.

Which may or may not affect the numbers. But most likely the amount of mechs also indicates which are considered good and which are not. I.e. Dragon and Awesome are not popular, because they are generally seen as second class mechs.

Every round is full of Victors now, while Atlas has always been popular and Highlander certainly found it's place. Stalkers got less common after last patch, and Awesome is not seen often.

Also you will see Jagers and Cataphracts in every game, often also at least some Catapults. Quickdraw got less popular fast, and Dragon has always been rather rare sight.

Same with mediums, Hunchbacks and Centurions are easily most common sights, Single Blackjack seem to be around in many games, but rarely many in same match. Trebuchets and Cicadas are rather uncommon sight.

[Angel of Annihilation]

XX Sulla XX, on 24 July 2013 - 01:06 PM, said:

You really can. This is a lot like car racing. The top few drivers will be able to get the most out of the car. This will give you a good idea about what car is better. What the tournament shows us is the Atlas, Highlander and Stalker are really very close. That is they are all good mechs. With the Awsome falling behind.

This is exactly my point. You take the best of the best players and you now take skill out of the equation as a random variable because your dealing with a very slight deviation in skills and ability at this level of gameplay. All that is left is how well the mechs themselves performs.

Additionaly, to get high scores in the tournament, it isn't as much about luck as it is consistancy. A person who cannot get consistantly high scores in match after match will not make it to the top of the tournament bracket. Remember it is the average of top 10 matches that makes up the score, not just the top match. This means they had to have at least 10 stellar matches to get in the top 15 in the bracket and most are probably only playing 30-50 matches to get there.

Really you couldn't ask for a better or more controled performance test than what the tournament offers. This is why I think the scores are important.

However, as was mentioned there have been some balance changes that might dramatically change how mechs are preforming so just take the numbers for a general idea. For example, the JagerMech might not have performed so highly if the antiboating heat scales had been in place for the Heavy vs the World tourney.

Still, I think in general the scores represent a good overall comparison of relative performance.