117 replies to this topic

[Warge]

Shadowdusk, on 27 July 2013 - 01:22 AM, said:

And please remove this tracking nonsense where the LRMS can target and seek you even when noone has any line of sight, tag, or narc on you.

None cares... I too don't understand the reason why LRMs guided.

heleqin, on 27 July 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

the only change i'd like to see with LRMs is for them to use the same target prioritization system as the SSRMs so that LRMs are less useful as a CT coring weapon.

What's about Artemis? How it should act in that case?

Edited by Warge, 27 July 2013 - 12:56 PM.

[Unbound Inferno]

LRMs still need a damage buff and chance to hit buff. They are not dealing enough damage to overwhelm comparable PPC weight damage with ammo tonnage factored in.

[Dashwood Fox]

Lets just literally replace them with foam Nerf darts. Give all the 'mechs with hands some pillows and foam Nerf bats to swing around too.

And a campfire on every map for everyone to sit around and tell stories after were all tuckered out from our Nerf battle.

[Umbra8]

Dashwood Fox, on 27 July 2013 - 02:52 PM, said:

Lets just literally replace them with foam Nerf darts. Give all the 'mechs with hands some pillows and foam Nerf bats to swing around too.

And a campfire on every map for everyone to sit around and tell stories after were all tuckered out from our Nerf battle.

Mechs with hands will be given a new combat mode: "Slap battle" where they will advance on a similarly equipped mech until they are point blank, lean their torso's back and turn slightly to the side and then slap their hands at each other until one of the mechwarriors kills themselves from dignity loss.

[DarkDevilDancer]

I have 30 mastered mechs of all weights and models only one uses lrms the rest use ballistics and energy, it's very very rare I die to lrms, you have to be caught with your pants down in the open for a long time.

[Mystere]

No, no, and hell no.

Lean to fight in the shade.

[Sephlock]

Seriously, scrubs are not going to be happy until you can literally grab them out of the air and throw them back.

[Edson Drake]

OMG this again.

And here I was playing the other day and thinking, "hey, missiles are nice again, I have fun playing my STK 3-H, but these missiles are so slow and target locking is so clumsy even with decay, why don't they buff the speed of missiles again?"

Missiles are a joke. At least 3 mechs with AMS nullify a boat damage and I won't even comment on taking cover, sure it's harder now but still possible. I play assaults and can't remember being killed by missiles once since the buff.

They need balance: a damage buff, splash reintroduced and fixed, along with the Streak not-focusing-the-torso fix as well, and a speed buff. My honest opinion.

[TheReal]

Seriously ... on the most maps of MWO, the LRMs are kinda useless, if your opponents knows what to do. It is so easy to hide.

Also you should stop gambling and take your AMS including some missiles with you. If you wanna save that weight, do it at your own risk. Same to your teammates.
There are even Mechs out there having two AMS, so there are enough options. ECM was mentioned also.

[Lord of All]

Funny, I run a DDC brawler that runs through the rain drops without feeling the need for loading AMS. AMS would be nice but in a pro/con situation my loadout benefits more by taking the hits while I close and crushing the poor boat when I get there in 2 alpha's. So no it's not OP even a little. I think they got it right finally. Well as close as they are going to be able to under the current mechanics.

If you don't know how to deal with Lurms then find cover/ecm and if you don't have either then your team better target them as a priority and not brawl while getting rained on. Ohh and a hint, most boats are slow deathtraps.

[Erata]

LRMs are about as close to balanced as they've ever been.

If you're getting tagged there isn't a lot you can do except:

Be aware of where the LRMs are coming from.
> You can hide behind the right wall so that 90% to 100% of the missiles hit the ground or wall for massive damage.
>> Do not walk into flat land or away from cover for extended periods
>>> Cover breaks line of sight, which causes missiles to lose lock either instantly, or within about 3 seconds due to target decay.

That's really it, really.

If you have ECM bots, ask them to stick near you. Use AMS until you develop cover habits and feel you can do without it.

Something you can't counter as easily: Jumpjetting LRM platforms. These players will typically fire on targets that they choose, not against targets that are simply within range. They will choose their own targets and use their jets to help maintain their line of sight lock and will likely have TAG as well. Against these enemies, even using cover can be difficult.
They will rarely fire from the max range, as the flight time of the missiles gives the target too much time to evade.

Edited by Erata, 28 July 2013 - 04:04 AM.

[JohnnyWayne]

*still dances the "wait for 12v12" dance and leaves again*

[TheReal]

Lord of All, on 28 July 2013 - 03:52 AM, said:

Funny, I run a DDC brawler that runs through the rain drops without feeling the need for loading AMS. AMS would be nice but in a pro/con situation ...

Yeah, but obvisouly the starter of this thread got his problems with LRMs
AMS are not useless, even if some people tell the opposite. But you cannot just have one guy with one load of ammo inside your team and pretend to 100% be save from LRM.

Therefore I agree to:

Erata, on 28 July 2013 - 04:02 AM, said:

If you have ECM bots, ask them to stick near you. Use AMS until you develop cover habits and feel you can do without it.

[Zervziel]

Wow, really? A nerf LRMs poll? In a time where the PPC/Gauss combo and the 4PPC stalker still rule the meta?


Quite frankly LRMs are only really dangerous if you decide to take stroll across open terrain with absolutely no cover and no ECM or AMS.

Hell even then you can mitigate the damage by either finding cover or falling back under a teammates AMS system which is always pretty funny. For example, people laugh at the AS7-K for being the least dangerous flexible Atlas variant until they have some missiles to run from and suddenly it's like "Hey, buddy! Mind if I chill here until the missiles blow over?"

Actually that's yet another way to find covers. Find a tall assault and let them take the blow. They've got more armor anyway.

Edited by Zervziel, 28 July 2013 - 02:32 PM.

[Bront]

The problem with LRMs isn't LRM per sey, it's LRM + Artemis + Tag. with that combo, you get cored unusually quickly. Also, they're a go big or go home weapon due to how the AMS works, so a suplimental LRM isn't as useful as it should be in a more balanced build (and their generall requirement for Artemis to be extremely useful)

Still dialing back their damage back to 1.0 might not be a bad idea.

[Kaijin]

Bront, on 28 July 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

The problem with LRMs isn't LRM per sey, it's LRM + Artemis + Tag. with that combo, you get cored unusually quickly. Also, they're a go big or go home weapon due to how the AMS works, so a suplimental LRM isn't as useful as it should be in a more balanced build (and their generall requirement for Artemis to be extremely useful)

Still dialing back their damage back to 1.0 might not be a bad idea.

Not sure how dialing back the damage is going to make those single LRM packages as useful as they should be.

Also, if PIG paid any attention to the already existing lore and game-mechanics behind the named equipment they're using, instead of just arbitrarily making up new rules for it, Artemis and TAG would not have a cumulative effect. First came Artemis. Then came TAG to relieve mechs of the extra tonnage needed to mount Artemis. They do the same thing. If PIG stuck with the program, using both would be redundant.

[Erata]

Bront, on 28 July 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

Still dialing back their damage back to 1.0 might not be a bad idea.

It's a bad idea, given the entire scope of weaponry available to use.
There are enough weapons that are already irrelevant in the broad view without turning one of the most balanced weapons, and requiring the most team participation in many cases, to remain effective into yet another trash weapon in MWO's catalog.

[Sheraf]

Shadowdusk, on 27 July 2013 - 07:55 AM, said:

Thats not true. Its impossible to fight when there's nothing but LRMs flying at you. And stop saying "ECM ECM ECM" ECM is very rare. If PGI really cared about Mech balance they'd add ECM or better AMS. Right now the entire game play revolves around LRMs. They need to be better balanced.

There is no enemy standing next to you forcing you to go out of cover when LRM flying at you, at least that don't happen too often. You know that you can also stop as well as move

[YueFei]

Bront, on 28 July 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

The problem with LRMs isn't LRM per sey, it's LRM + Artemis + Tag. with that combo, you get cored unusually quickly. Also, they're a go big or go home weapon due to how the AMS works, so a suplimental LRM isn't as useful as it should be in a more balanced build (and their generall requirement for Artemis to be extremely useful)

Still dialing back their damage back to 1.0 might not be a bad idea.

Yeah. Sometimes I will suicidally pop out to shoot at an Atlas with my Awesome-8R's 4 ALRM15 racks with TAG. From about 300 meters. It helps that I can be running away from the Atlas while still firing LRMs at him thanks to the Awesome-8R's arm yaw angle. Usually after 3 salvos the Atlas is dead or almost dead, with all damage focused onto his CT.

On the other hand, if I'm doing indirect-fire LRMs, I could probably empty half of my LRM ammo, dump 500 missiles into him, and he still won't be dead.

[John MatriX82]

Actually LRMs are always CT-loving, that makes them a little too much effective; I hope they'll fix splash bugs soon for bot SRMs and LRMs then we'll see.

As usual, what breaks the system is the huge boating, even with heat penalties, lrm 70-80-90 are beyond any common sense, there should be an hardpoint restriction system (like the one I suggest in my sig) that would help address balance issues with this weapon system once and for all.