376 replies to this topic

[Kazma]

Great Performance fix! No lags at all

[veedubfreak]

Mad Magnus, on 30 July 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

No, it means you might actually have to fire your missiles tactically instead of just mashing one key. group each side, fire them half and half... they track better and its much better heat management As for your highlander build chain fire your LRMs...try using jump jets to maintain target when the enemy tries to duck. Yes, you might need to pick up a little better gaming skill than hitting left mouse button and then once in a while right mouse button... it's really not game ruining or very much of an inconvenience to anyone who actually knows how to play this game.

Pick up your socks.

Mag

You don't understand how AMS works do you? 50 missiles in 1 volley = pain. 50 missiles 10 at a time = why bother if anyone has ams. L2P. I think Paul has somehow managed to usurp Rich Vogel as #1 most incompetent lead designer for an online game.

I guess I'll just drop 1 lrm10 and pick up another PPC. Heck, that might actually make the mech better.

Edited by veedubfreak, 30 July 2013 - 12:55 PM.

[DemonRaziel]

While I'm not a big fan (not a fan at all, actually) of the recently intorduced heat penalties, they are obviously here to stay, so let's discuss the actuall changes to this system introduced today.

I can understand they combined LLs and ER LLs (and I welcome they combined both PPC variants) but adding LPLs to the bunch? Haven't the poor short-ranged-hot-as-hell 7-tonner suffer enough?

Also, please up the limit to 3 at least, otherwise no one will give a damn about whichever version of large lasers and just stick to PPCs.

And the SRM combinations are really getting out of hand now - if you want to limit them as a bulk, just set a hard-limit on the maximum amount of tubes fired at once, like, say, 20, or 14, or whatever, and then apply the penalty if more missiles are launched within 0.5 secons, regardless if it's a crapload of SRM2s (highly theoretical, not possible currently with any chassi, unless the limit is set absurly low) or third that amount of SRM6s.

Right now it's painfully obvious that the SRM4 and SRM6 combination is aimed solely at Splat-Cats and it's confusing as all hell to calculate the exact penalty you will incurr for a given combination of missile launchers.

As far as nerfing SSensor goes - good job. It's still useful, the advanced version still gives a benefit (increases the range by over 50%) but you can't cover a crazy amount of area around you anymore. Requires some more tweaking still, in my opinion and if other nerfs are introduced, maybe could use a range buff again, but right now it's the best solution available.

[Steinkrieg]

I'm still pissed about the reticle shake from JJs on my Heavy Metal. Still makes me nauseous if I jump more than once a minute. As a prior poster stated, some mechs were specifically designed to boat weapons. All of this malarkey about heat and such defeats the purpose of those mechs existence. It feels like the whiners about PPCs and Missiles won. Looks like PGI cut the game down to the lowest ability mechwarriors instead of making them think, learn, and actually play the game beyond LeRoy Jenkinsing it into the enemy line.

[Ngamok]

veedubfreak, on 30 July 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

You don't understand how AMS works do you? 50 missiles in 1 volley = pain. 50 missiles 10 at a time = why bother if anyone has ams. L2P. I think Paul has somehow managed to usurp Rich Vogel as #1 most incompetent lead designer for an online game.

I guess I'll just drop 1 lrm10 and pick up another PPC. Heck, that might actually make the mech better.

Shoot 50 LRMs are once, AMS targets the entire cluster and shoots X amount out of the air. Chain fire 10 at a time, AMS targets first cluster first and the rest all land behind the first minus a few that AMS will track after first cluster lands. Maybe cluster 3 and 5.

[King Lags]

So which dev did large lasers beat up in high school? Cause the only reason for the ridiculous limitations that are continually being placed on them make no sense otherwise. I ran a 5 LL stalker when working on mastery and it was a high heat build before that could only really pay off with a high alpha and careful heat management. So yet again PPCs and their superior damage mechanics win again. And now all large lasers count towards the ridiculously low limit of 2. The same with all missile systems! You know the weapons that WEREN'T brokenly overpowered. Da fuq kinda thought processes are going on here? Looking more and more like it's time to bail and not hand PGI any money. The recent patches have made me apprehensive to do so despite needing more mechbays.

Looks like if I do keep playing it's gonna be limited to my dual-guass Jaeger to compete with all the 2xppc 1x Gauss mechs. Considering every last other mechof mine just ate a big nerf with limits on my favorite builds. So long quad large laser quickdraw, your mighty nipples will now have to be ppcs and medium lasers. I'm shocked they didn't drop medium laser numbers just to screw over my hunchback too.

[veedubfreak]

Tainwulf, on 30 July 2013 - 01:02 PM, said:

So which dev did large lasers beat up in high school? Cause the only reason for the ridiculous limitations that are continually being placed on them make no sense otherwise. I ran a 5 LL stalker when working on mastery and it was a high heat build before that could only really pay off with a high alpha and careful heat management. So yet again PPCs and their superior damage mechanics win again. And now all large lasers count towards the ridiculously low limit of 2. The same with all missile systems! You know the weapons that WEREN'T brokenly overpowered. Da fuq kinda thought processes are going on here? Looking more and more like it's time to bail and not hand PGI any money. The recent patches have made me apprehensive to do so despite needing more mechbays.

Looks like if I do keep playing it's gonna be limited to my dual-guass Jaeger to compete with all the 2xppc 1x Gauss mechs. Considering every last other mechof mine just ate a big nerf with limits on my favorite builds. So long quad large laser quickdraw, your mighty nipples will now have to be ppcs and medium lasers. I'm shocked they didn't drop medium laser numbers just to screw over my hunchback too.

That's the hilarious part of this ghost heat crap. It just keeps funneling more and more people into the 2ppc/gauss builds.

[Itsacon]

Garth Erlam, on 30 July 2013 - 07:34 AM, said:

Linked weapons will always use the highest base heat value and highest multiplier of the weapons fired. e.g. if you launch LRM15s with LRM10s, it will use LRM15 numbers. If you fire Large Lasers with ER Large Lasers, it will use ER Large Laser numbers.

At first I thought this was a typo. Then I looked here.

And then I thought: They've gone mad.

I understand using the max alpha and the multiplier from the biggest weapon. But the base heat?

This makes a 4-ERPPC stalker a better mech than a 2ER & 2 PPC stalker, same heat, more range.


It's worst for missiles, as the launchers you use are determined by the chassis (number of launcher tubes)

An example: The Highlander 733P has 3 missile hardpoints: one 20-tube and two 10-tube launchers.

For 20 tons, I can either mount two LRM 20s and get no heat penalty. Or I can mount the LRM20 and two LRM10s the hardpoints are designed for, and get a heat penalty as if I was mounting THREE LRM 20s. So I'm paying heat for 20 missiles I'm not firing.

Again, I don't mind getting a heat penalty for mounting three launchers, but use the proper base heat as the base for calculating the final heat.

Edited by Itsacon, 30 July 2013 - 01:14 PM.

[Ngamok]

veedubfreak, on 30 July 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

That's the hilarious part of this ghost heat crap. It just keeps funneling more and more people into the 2ppc/gauss builds.

No. Like someone already pointed out, they are doing it to prevent future problems.

[veedubfreak]

Ngamok, on 30 July 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

No. Like someone already pointed out, they are doing it to prevent future problems.

Right sorry, I keep forgetting that part. Kill the game in its current form so that it can't evolve into an even bigger piece of ****. It's basically the plot of Terminator, except that instead of Sarah Conner, they are trying to kill fun.

[FupDup]

Ngamok, on 30 July 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

No. Like someone already pointed out, they are doing it to prevent future problems.

Actually, there's a nifty little mechanic that already prevents LL or LPL problems.


It's called beam duration.

[Dakkath]

I have gone through and removed off-topic and posts that were not constructive to the discussion at hand.

Please note that criticism is acceptable in a constructive manner. Stay constructive with your likes/dislikes and offer suggestions for improvement when/if needed.

Thanks,
Dakkath

Edited by Dakkath, 30 July 2013 - 01:26 PM.

[Telemetry]

I'm going to keep this guy busy deleting posts, lol. Criticism of the devs and their lack of good decision making is in fact CONSTRUCTIVE. They need to be aware of this or they will not change course. If in fact, if they delete all criticism that you don't like, they won't ever see a need to change and save this game before we all leave. Remember, we want the SAME THING. We want a successful game. We want a fun game that is balanced. But over the past year, this train has been derailed and with very little signs of it being put back on the track.

Edited by Telemetry, 30 July 2013 - 01:36 PM.

[Dethyr]

Ngamok, on 30 July 2013 - 01:13 PM, said:

No. Like someone already pointed out, they are doing it to prevent future problems.

They SAY that, but what problems are they preventing? A modifiable max heat threshold means people are ALWAYS going to try and find the best high alpha build they can, because the mechlab allows it. If the updates from PGI stay more of the same then instead of fixing the heat threshold problems they are just going to force every weapon down to single fire and remove alpha all together. If not that then the logical conclusion is that the game will continue with the high alpha meta that it has now. There are NO PENALTIES for a pinpoint high alpha boat (2ppc/gauss) and yet every other weapon group has been systematically nerfed.

Why change LPL? I think most people agreed they were damn near balanced, and no where near the current competitive meta. Also why change SRM when it was just buffed? The only things these changes are doing is punishing 'boats' that were intended to be boats while ignoring high pinpoint alpha (convergence is the real issue here). With a hard heat threshold cap Mechs that are designed as boats (such as certain variants of Hunchback, Catapult, and Awesome) can still be effective, alpha strikes can still exist, and the meta would likely shift towards either many mechs with balanced loadouts or more effective team play where role warfare plays a larger role. Much better than everyone in a max alpha sniper setup.

TLDR;
Keep it simple! Do one of two things:
1. Remove the overly complex and confusing heat penalty system and make a set heat threshold for all mechs (such as 30 or 40).
or
2. Remove the overly complex and confusing heat penalty system and also remove alpha strikes entirely and ONLY allow single or chain fire. (This is possibly a solution to the convergence problem too)

Both of these options allow players to create the Mech they want, instead of being forced into a certain play-style because they will lose otherwise.

[veedubfreak]

Wait? They let non admin delete posts? How deep does the incompetence go?

[Lostdragon]

Apnu, on 30 July 2013 - 12:49 PM, said:

How does it hurt newbies?

Here's what will happen: A newbie will join the game, buy a mech and fiddle with it. They'll think "4 PPCs, heck yea!" They'll drop with it and get eaten up because they crippled themselves with heat and constant alpha striking. They'll say "F this" and go play another game that has logical rules that actually make sense.

Fixed this for you to reflect reality.

[DisasterMedic]

There once was a dev named Paul
Who hated for 'Mechs to brawl
So he made a dumb change
Put the whole game at range
And prayed the "noise" died by Fall

[Mokou]

Say hello to CPLT-A1 6xALRM5.

[BADWVLF]

once again us joystick users are left out,,cannot play the game,,there is no joystick input,,the new map and none of the old maps are responding to joystick input,,i cannot play the game,,give me an e mail sometime when it is fixed and ill come back to play,,veyron

once again us joystick users are left out,,cannot play the game,,there is no joystick input,,the new map and none of the old maps are responding to joystick input,,i cannot play the game,,give me an e mail sometime when it is fixed and ill come back to play,,veyron

[veedubfreak]

DisasterMedic, on 30 July 2013 - 01:51 PM, said:

There once was a dev named Paul
Who hated for 'Mechs to brawl
So he made a dumb change
Put the whole game at range
And prayed the "noise" died by Fall

That was beautiful Medic.