27 replies to this topic

[Trauglodyte]

Sephlock, on 07 August 2013 - 05:05 PM, said:

So what about engines? Do they count as crittable, but indestructible? For example, can I shoot out an enemy mech's back armor and then go to town on his rear CT or side torso (if he is using an XL engine) and get an unlimited number of crits until he dies? I mean, if the area that I am shooting at has nothing in it, I can't get a critical hit, right?

Only works if the mech has additional heat sinks stashed inside the engine.

[Ralgas]

Downside, sections destroy faster
On the upside, it now means gauss and ac 20 are the only weps that can 1shot components?

Am i reading that right?

Edited by Ralgas, 07 August 2013 - 06:58 PM.

[stjobe]

Sprouticus, on 07 August 2013 - 03:17 PM, said:

The 25/14/3 is NOT for single/double/triple damage, it is for number of crits. This means that the 2nd or 3rd crit hits a different component.

This is a thread about the new critical damage mechanic, and as such we are talking about internal structure damage. In that context there is no difference between triple damage or triple crits; there is only a single internal structure to apply the damage to. But yes, technically you're correct, it's the number of crits.

Note however, that crits are randomly assigned so there's no guarantee three crits will hit different components.

Sprouticus, on 07 August 2013 - 03:17 PM, said:

For mg's, lbx and flamers the iHP has a multiplier (different for each weapon)

Per this site (here)

flamers do 0.44 per crit
lbx does 2 per crit
machine guns do 0.5 per crit

Those numbers are quite outdated. The MG did 0.5 damage to internal components per crit when it had a per-projectile damage of 0.04. Why? Because it has a crit damage multiplier of 12.5 (0.04 * 12.5 = 0.5). Since it now has a per-projectile damage of 0.1, its crit damage is (0.1 * 12.5 = 1.25).

Which means the MG does 1.25, 2.5, or 3.5 damage to internal components and 0.2975, 0.575, or 0.825 damage to internal structure (as per my posts above) per projectile that crits, with damage to internal components spread over the internal components available to crit.

See http://mwo.smurfy-ne...eapon_ballistic for up to date weapon numbers, parsed from game files on each patch.

[Sprouticus]

stjobe, on 07 August 2013 - 11:52 PM, said:

This is a thread about the new critical damage mechanic, and as such we are talking about internal structure damage. In that context there is no difference between triple damage or triple crits; there is only a single internal structure to apply the damage to. But yes, technically you're correct, it's the number of crits.

Note however, that crits are randomly assigned so there's no guarantee three crits will hit different components.


Those numbers are quite outdated. The MG did 0.5 damage to internal components per crit when it had a per-projectile damage of 0.04. Why? Because it has a crit damage multiplier of 12.5 (0.04 * 12.5 = 0.5). Since it now has a per-projectile damage of 0.1, its crit damage is (0.1 * 12.5 = 1.25).

Which means the MG does 1.25, 2.5, or 3.5 damage to internal components and 0.2975, 0.575, or 0.825 damage to internal structure (as per my posts above) per projectile that crits, with damage to internal components spread over the internal components available to crit.

See http://mwo.smurfy-ne...eapon_ballistic for up to date weapon numbers, parsed from game files on each patch.

Thanks for the correction. Ill correct my post.

Yea, at those levels, the MG is doing kind of insane extra damage.

[MustrumRidcully]

General Taskeen, on 07 August 2013 - 04:28 PM, said:

Sigh, I don't think we're ever getting an MG that damages armor and internals equally now...

Maybe not, but maybe that's not too horrible - it might now actually play a role in destroying mechs - not on its own, but at least it can be a useful investment on a mech that doesn't have weight, slot or heat sinks for "all-damaging" alternatives.

Ralgas, on 07 August 2013 - 06:58 PM, said:

Downside, sections destroy faster
On the upside, it now means gauss and ac 20 are the only weps that can 1shot components?

Am i reading that right?

I am not sure I follow?

IF by component you mean an item inside a hit location, then PPC, AC/10, Gauss, and AC/20 are the best for this job. Most times have 10 hit points.
AC/5 can one-shot an item potentially on a double or triple crit (no guarantee though), other weapons might be able to one shot Gauss or ECM (both 3 hit point items).

[Sprouticus]

MustrumRidcully, on 08 August 2013 - 04:08 AM, said:

Maybe not, but maybe that's not too horrible - it might now actually play a role in destroying mechs - not on its own, but at least it can be a useful investment on a mech that doesn't have weight, slot or heat sinks for "all-damaging" alternatives.

I am not sure I follow?

IF by component you mean an item inside a hit location, then PPC, AC/10, Gauss, and AC/20 are the best for this job. Most times have 10 hit points.
AC/5 can one-shot an item potentially on a double or triple crit (no guarantee though), other weapons might be able to one shot Gauss or ECM (both 3 hit point items).

Spot on for both comments

I am still not sold on the lbx (maybe bump to 2.5iHP for a crit from 2?), and the flamer is still trash, but the mg has a purpose now. It does almost triple damage (273%) against internals. That is on TOP of the critical hits.

Even 2 of these are not bad backup weapons for 2 tons. And a light with 4 + ammo will tear stuff up.


Remember, with 12v12, you dont have to have every mech engage form the getgo. A light who actually SCOUTS now, can come back and help kill mechs afterward.

[General Taskeen]

MustrumRidcully, on 08 August 2013 - 04:08 AM, said:

Maybe not, but maybe that's not too horrible - it might now actually play a role in destroying mechs - not on its own, but at least it can be a useful investment on a mech that doesn't have weight, slot or heat sinks for "all-damaging" alternatives.

I'd prefer it be able to "destroy on its own." My absolute favorite MG was the one in MW3 that destroyed armor just effectively as small lasers and AC/2's.

But the developers absolutely wish to push their fantasy MG that only does bonus damage to internal structure, fantasy ECM, fantasy LB-X, etc.

It's kind of no wonder PPC/Gauss are always talked about, as certain weapons and equipment remained in the trashbin.

Edited by General Taskeen, 08 August 2013 - 05:05 AM.

[Ralgas]

MustrumRidcully, on 08 August 2013 - 04:08 AM, said:

Maybe not, but maybe that's not too horrible - it might now actually play a role in destroying mechs - not on its own, but at least it can be a useful investment on a mech that doesn't have weight, slot or heat sinks for "all-damaging" alternatives.

I am not sure I follow?

IF by component you mean an item inside a hit location, then PPC, AC/10, Gauss, and AC/20 are the best for this job. Most times have 10 hit points.
AC/5 can one-shot an item potentially on a double or triple crit (no guarantee though), other weapons might be able to one shot Gauss or ECM (both 3 hit point items).

Internal crit mechanic's always got lost on me, i figured this was an attempt to make weapons and heatsinks more durable at the expense of the sections internal hp, thus being a nerf to crit seeking via dmg for everything bar the gauss/ac/20. From what you describe i believe i'm wrong.

Edited by Ralgas, 08 August 2013 - 06:22 AM.