36 replies to this topic

[Telemetry]

Just throwing this out there. We need a new Commando variant with ballistic slots to field MGs. Back in the day, when I played table top, my first mech was a Commando and it had machine guns on it. Since we have a "hard point" system that TT never had, it would be nice to get a new Commando with ballistics.

Given that each variant of the Commando has only 4 hard points, we could make a couple variants that are similar to what we already have:


Commando COM-1B-MG Right Arm - 1B, 1E, otherwise same as 1B
Commando COM-1D-MG Right Arm - 2B, otherwise same as 1D
Commando COM-2D-MG Right Arm - 1B, 1M, otherwise same as 2D
Commando COM-3A-MG Left Arm - 1B, otherwise same as 3A
Commando COM-SK Right Arm 1B, 1E, Left arm 1B, 1E (SK = my hero variant, The Silver Knight)

How about some Commando love!!

Edited by Telemetry, 14 August 2013 - 05:06 AM.

[Ewigan]

There even exists a Commando Variant with Ballistics, i guess it even would be timeline appropriate.

From sarna:
COM-1C - This version removed all the missile racks and replaced them with an Autocannon/2 with a ton of ammunition. It appears to have been an experiment in providing direct fire support.

So it would have 1 Ballistics and 1 Energy HP.
Energy in an arm, the Ballistic HP in one of the torsos.

[Telemetry]

That's cool but I'd like the ballistics in the arms for better aiming. Could have that variant with the AC/2 in a torso as well. The more the better!

Also got this from www.sarna.net :

Blazing Inferno - As of 3028, the techs on Chara III used this designation for a frequent field modification of the COM-2D that exchanges both missile launchers for three additional medium lasers built into the right arm, right torso and head respectively, six small lasers mounted in pairs on each leg and the center torso, and an additional ton of armor (+3 to each leg, +2 to the head, center torso and both torso sides, and +1 to each arm).

The Blazing Inferno sounds good too. Instead of mounting the small lasers on the legs, we can just use the left and right torsos. This would give the Commando a variant that rivals the Jenner-F!

Edited by Telemetry, 14 August 2013 - 05:38 AM.

[General Taskeen]

COM-5S, missile is in torso instead of chest = awesome.
COM-1C, Ballistic in arm.

Both have unique HP layouts.

[Telemetry]

I like those suggestions too. Now we just need a dev and the art team to get busy! It shouldn't be that much work to add a visual for the ballistics on the Commando. Maybe less than a day.

Edited by Telemetry, 14 August 2013 - 06:36 AM.

[Deathlike]

More Commando Hero Mechs? Maybe.

New standard variants? Probably not, given that you have to balance among its other variants.

[Kensaisama]

A new varient is in the works, it will be the COM-5AC. This is a special Commando varient that will be attached to the Atlas as a cod-piece. Yes you will be able to fight independentaly from the Atlas by detaching yourself and running amok on the battlefield if you so desire, everyone will know instantly what a little ***** you are. Or stay attached to your host and wreak havoc on some poor unsuspecting mechs backdoor The choice is yours

[Telemetry]

Ok now, no need to compare the Commando and all it's awesomeness to a ....well yeah. Let's keep this discussion on track and maybe the PGI guys will give us a new Commando!

Ohhh, another idea is to have a variant or two with JUMPJETS!!!

Edited by Telemetry, 14 August 2013 - 07:01 AM.

[Kensaisama]

LOL no worries Telemetry, I have all the Commando Variants mastered, it is one of my favorite light mechs Just thought I would inject some humor here, the forums are lacking some of that lately.

[Telemetry]

How about a new Commando skin....The Crazy Mime pattern!

Edited by Telemetry, 14 August 2013 - 07:20 AM.

[General Taskeen]

Deathlike, on 14 August 2013 - 06:42 AM, said:

More Commando Hero Mechs? Maybe.

New standard variants? Probably not, given that you have to balance among its other variants.

Rest assured, the COM-5S would have less HP's than the ones currently (uses SRM6-Artemis, SSRM2, 1 ML), as predicted early on in clan widowmaker's mech lab. And the COM-1C literally only has 1 AC/2 and 1 ML, which would be incredibly hard to use since the HP's are in RA/LA, more of a challenge variant than anything else for bored Vets.

Edited by General Taskeen, 14 August 2013 - 07:31 AM.

[stjobe]

If we need any new Commandos, we need a 4xMissile one:

COM-TDK: 4E
COM-1B: 3E, 1M
COM-1D: 2E, 2M
COM-3A: 2E, 2M
COM-2D: 1E, 3M

We need a 4M one to complete the progression (and satisfy my OCD)

[Deathlike]

General Taskeen, on 14 August 2013 - 07:31 AM, said:

Rest assured, the COM-5S would have less HP's than the ones currently (uses SRM6-Artemis, SSRM2, 1 ML), as predicted early on in clan widowmaker's mech lab. And the COM-1C literally only has 1 AC/2 and 1 ML, which would be incredibly hard to use since the HP's are in RA/LA, more of a challenge variant than anything else for bored Vets.

I would look at it this way..

Most released variants generally lean towards a limited combination of hardpoints, or having all of them (like Atlai) but redistributed differently.

The BJ for instead has a missile variant (the BJ-2 IIRC) that has 2 missile hardpoints... and I'm unsure if its within the timeline, but if you look at what we currently have for BJ options, they are energy heavy with some ballistics. The Cicada has a JJ variant (yes, really), except IIRC it is not "within the timeline" (imagine what the field would look like with Garth running that variant). The Highlander has an heavy energy-no ballistic variant in the 733P. The Catapult has the K2, to offset the primarily energy+missile heavy nature of the Catapult class (and IIRC the Catapult has more K2-like variants too). The lightest mech that resembles a K2 in their options is the Trebuchet-7K..

Adding such options to a light mech where tonnage and hardpoints are at a premium can limit the potential of releasing other mechs that would accommodate those roles. I'm not against adding more variants (more options is good), but just remember that the issue eventually comes back to what some of us already harp on PGI about... is mech sizes and hitboxes... because that eventually will come to be a serious problem with adding more variants.

Edited by Deathlike, 14 August 2013 - 09:05 AM.

[General Taskeen]

@stjobe - Might have to wait for the Pirate Commando, either the Periphery version or the amazing custom 7S2, the best Commando of all time, which also has jump jets.

Otherwise, the past predicted HP's for the 5S/1C are:

COM-5S - 2M, 1E (basically inferior total possible weapons compared to a 2D, but better HP locations to mount bigger missiles if desired)
COM-1C - 1B, 1E (or 3B, 1E or 2B, 2E)

Edited by General Taskeen, 14 August 2013 - 09:06 AM.

[Khobai]

Commandos need to be made viable before they can entertain adding new variants.

1) Jenners/Ravens go faster than Commandos while also out-tonning and out-gunning them. WTF how is that balanced? Jenners/Ravens need to be slowed down so lighter mechs can outrun them. If you cant outgun you should be able to outrun.

2) Commando 2Ds have serious tonnage issues with trying to fit all their missiles, ammo, ecm, and a max size engine. You just cant do it without making serious concessions. Concessions that the Jenner and Raven unfairly dont have to make while still being able to achieve the speed cap.

In other words there is currently no reason to pilot a Commando because its just a way worse Jenner/Raven.

Edited by Khobai, 14 August 2013 - 09:15 AM.

[Telemetry]

I'm cool with the 2-4 ballistic HPs, but it can't be ONLY ballistic. There has to be 2 types of slots minimum.

Edited by Telemetry, 14 August 2013 - 09:14 AM.

[General Taskeen]

Khobai, on 14 August 2013 - 09:10 AM, said:

Commandos need to be viable before they can entertain adding new variants.

1) Jenners/Ravens go faster than Commandos while also out-tonning and out-gunning them. WTF how is that balanced? Jenners/Ravens need to be slowed down so lighter mechs can outrun them. If you cant outgun you should be able to outrun.

2) Commando 2Ds have serious tonnage issues with trying to fit all their missiles, ammo, ecm, and a max size engine. You just cant do it without making serious concessions. Concessions that the Jenner and Raven unfairly dont have to make while still being able to achieve the speed cap.

In other words there is currently no reason to pilot a Commando because its just a way worse Jenner/Raven.

For the first issue. Yes that is true, it also has to do with customization though. When you think about a Jenner or Raven, they are actually kind of slow by default and more on par with Commando's armor and speed wise. Another issue to what you mentioned is also the hitbox design on the Mechs, where Jenner's while usually get hit in the CT, they are small and also fit in huge engines because the side torso's are stupidly small.

If there was a sort of limited customization mode (like even more restrictions to engine mounting), any Commando wouldn't be as hamstrung as they are.

[Khobai]

> 30 ton speed cap should be 141.
< 30 ton speed cap should be 151.

That would give the spider/commando/flea/locust mechs a 10kph advantage to run away from Jenners.

Because honestly why pilot a Commando or even a Flea/Locust if you cant run away from a Jenner?

[Deathlike]

Khobai, on 14 August 2013 - 09:10 AM, said:

1) Jenners/Ravens go faster than Commandos while also out-tonning and out-gunning them. WTF how is that balanced? Jenners/Ravens need to be slowed down so lighter mechs can outrun them. If you cant outgun you should be able to outrun.

Due to the nature of MWO's engine cap rules (based off of NBT rules I think?), the Commando will always end up being slower, because the Commandos are naturally slower. If the speed cap was removed, the Raven-3L's top speed wouldn't change actually (295 is the max cap due to the rules)... the Jenners however still have more options to go through (which may mean more SL+superfast Jenners running around). Commandos will not benefit to the same degree.

Quote

2) Commando 2Ds have serious tonnage issues with trying to fit all their missiles, ammo, ecm, and a max size engine. You just cant do it without making serious concessions. Concessions that the Jenner and Raven unfairly dont have to make while still being able to achieve the speed cap.

In other words there is currently no reason to pilot a Commando because its just a way worse Jenner/Raven.

That is usually why the heaviest light mechs are popular... they are still fast but pack the punch as needed. It has been a consistent case in the MW series in general.

Khobai, on 14 August 2013 - 09:20 AM, said:

> 30 ton speed cap should be 141.
< 30 ton speed cap should be 151.

That would give the spider/commando/flea/locust mechs a 10kph advantage to run away from Jenners.

Because honestly why pilot a Commando or even a Flea/Locust if you cant run away from a Jenner?

That rule doesn't work. That's kinda why mediums are killed by heavies.. the heavies tend to catch up reasonably well to a medium.

[stjobe]

Khobai, on 14 August 2013 - 09:10 AM, said:

In other words there is currently no reason to pilot a Commando because its just a way worse Jenner/Raven.

Oh sorry, I didn't realize I had my fun the wrong way.

You use your chickens, I'll be in my less arm-challenged lights.